Christians and Therianthropy

[dudley thoth]

Dudley Thoth, I've read Daniel 4:32-33, and aside from calling King Neb a beast and giving him animal qualities, I have yet to see why you bring this verse up. It's one thing to quote the Bible, and it's another thing to explain it from your position. Until you explain it, it's open to anyone's interpretation, and as far as I'm concerned, it means diddly squat to me. If you want to discuss/debate this, then make a point.

Runt, that makes no sense; the whole reason I brought this topic up was to receive Christian feedback. I am trying to learn. Why move this topic to the "hidden and unseen" areas?

Frustrated,
Zelani

Fair enough.

It was the only passage of scripture that came to my mind.

A straight reading of it is this. Nebuchadnezzer was transformed into an animal (or became beast-like) because he failed to acknowledge God. Only when he recognized God did he become fully human again.

If any relevent Biblical examples come to mind, relating to therians, i will share them with you.

God Bless 8)

 

[dudley thoth]

Hi Zelani :hi:


Look, I've been thinking.

Rather than give you a Christion opinion, I'll give you the opinion of a Christian.

God wants to know you, Okay. 8)

Don't let Therianthropy be a problem.

Stop thinking about it. 8)

Just be honest.

If you want to accept God into you life then do it! 8)

At this stage I dont think you'll get the answers your after.

God Bless Zelani and look after yourself.

 

[Master Vigil]

Zelani, its ok. No one here is out to get you. And Runt understands that you want to discuss this in this forum. She just wants another discussion about the same topic in the pagan forum as well. It is a topic that interests her and she would just love to have a pagan point of view as well. No worries, no need to be frustrated.

By the way, never lose your animal side. It is what makes you special. But, whats more important is what you do with your animalities that really makes you special. I know from experience that alot of christians may believe you are evil or insane. But that is nonsense. Never feel the need to fit in, for no one really fits in anywhere. Your animal side will show you the way, if you are willing to let it. No frustration, just love.

 

[Runt]

Zelani--

LMAO... I was just suggesting that you keep this conversation going and recieve Christian feedback here... and you bring it up in the Paganism forum so those of us who have no Christian feedback to give but still want to talk to you about the concept of an animal spirit can do so... Master Vigil summed up my feelings pretty accurately.

 

[painted wolf]

Zelani-
I'm sorry you feel the other forums arn't what you want in discussion of the therintropes soul...

as I non-chrisitan my feedback here is limited.

I hope you dont mind my starting a thread on the paganism area, and I hope that you will come over and help me explain Theranthropy to the rest. :mrgreen:

wa:-do

 

[Zelani]

I hope you dont mind my starting a thread on the paganism area, and I hope that you will come over and help me explain Theranthropy to the rest.

Painted Wolf, sure I'll try and help explain it, though I'm not the best one to do that. Aside from my experiences, I don't know what else to offer.

Hey, what does wa:-do mean?

[/quote]LMAO... I was just suggesting that you keep this conversation going and recieve Christian feedback here... and you bring it up in the Paganism forum so those of us who have no Christian feedback to give but still want to talk to you about the concept of an animal spirit can do so... Master Vigil summed up my feelings pretty accurately.

Runt, er, *sheepish look* I'm still learning this forum. At work, I can access the other posts, whereas at home, I can access this one. I know it's a mistake on my part, and that I'll figure it out, but, well, sorry. And I'm sorry for my defensiveness; that jumped out of me, and it shouldn't have happened. Forgive me.

By the way, never lose your animal side. It is what makes you special. But, whats more important is what you do with your animalities that really makes you special. I know from experience that alot of christians may believe you are evil or insane. But that is nonsense. Never feel the need to fit in, for no one really fits in anywhere. Your animal side will show you the way, if you are willing to let it. No frustration, just love.

Master Vigil, I so appreciate what you just said. I attend church *only* because I highly respect the open-mindedness, knowledge, and wisdom or our pastor, but I really am terrified of the consequences if/when my therian side is discovered. But your words are reassuring--my animal side will guide me, and I do see it as a gift from God. So thank you for your reassurance.

God wants to know you, Okay.

Don't let Therianthropy be a problem.

Stop thinking about it.

Just be honest.

If you want to accept God into you life then do it!

Dudley Thoth, I can't live without God--I should have clarified that to begin with. My belief and reliance on him is quite strong. What I'm trying to understand is how my therian side is so real, and yet the Bible accounts for no therians. That's all.

At this stage I dont think you'll get the answers your after.

Why?

A straight reading of it is this. Nebuchadnezzer was transformed into an animal (or became beast-like) because he failed to acknowledge God. Only when he recognized God did he become fully human again.

Yes, that's what I read as well. What do you think of this idea: God used various forms of "punishment" to teach, as is the case with King Neb. What about applying that to therianism today, only with a different perspective? He gave me my cougar side, and it's taught me much about leadership, cunningness, curbing my temper, and when to snarl. Instead of a negative (ie punishment), therians could be seen as just another way God teaches us about us and Him. Further, the reason therianism isn't condoned by general Christianity is that it's not in the Bible, and the Bible was written a very long time ago, under very different perspectives. So rather than a "bad" thing, therianism--including King Neb's experience--could be seen as a good thing.

This might seem an absurd example, but it's what comes to mind right now. Have you seen the movie, "Brother Bear"? A human kills a bear out of revenge, and is transformed into a bear as a result. While a bear, he takes care of a younger bear, who, in the end, turns out to be the cub of the bear he killed as a human. In the end, the human/bear chooses to remain a bear in order to take care of the baby bear. What started out as a punishment per se, turned into a blessing--as in the case of King Neb. (though my knowledge of him is limited, but didn't he continue to do naughty things his entire life?). Regardless, I think you see my point regarding the therian and the term "bad" applied to it.

So, let's hear your thoughts, and I'll try and figure out how I got here, and what I posted on another thread *blushes*. Thanks for the insights.

Zelani :mrgreen:

 

[Hirohito18200]

Here's some Christian imput for you, although im positive it's not what u wanted...

as a christian, when u meantioned Therianism, i went "What?" I consider myself a very open minded christian, so i'll be the last to condem you. Most christians probably dont even know what Therianism is, let alone have an opinion about it. However, I have some thoughts that many christians might have...

When you refer to your animal nature, instead of calling this "therianism", could this simply be equating animal qualities to yourself and attempting to grow with them, instead of being a whole soul-nature thing? Mabey just explaining therianism more throughly to us ignorants would be helpful. Many online resources I have found are quite muddled and confusing. Thx.

 

[painted wolf]

Zelani -
our experiences are all we have 8)
I'm certain the others would apreciate any insight into our little group... first hand experience is the best teacher and the best example.

Historically the christian church has seen us as 'possessed'... or later mentally ill... Lycanthropy is still used as a medical/psycological term.. wich is why it isn't used by the Terian community.. (and it focuses on us wolves)

wa:-do is cherokee for 'thank you'... I feel privilaged and honored to be able to share my ideas and feel its only right to thank everyone who bothers to read my posts... :goodjob:

so
wa:-do

 

[dudley thoth]

To Zelani

I'm sorry about the King Neb stuff. I didn't mean anything by it. It was the first thing that came to mind and so i posted it. Bit thoughtless really.

Have you ever asked God why (stupid question)? Any response?

Concerning the other stuff you've proposed, give me a little time to think and pray about it.

God bless 8)

 

[dudley thoth]

Dudley Thoth, I can't live without God--I should have clarified that to begin with. My belief and reliance on him is quite strong.

That's wonderful!

However, you need to be with people and christians you can trust. Hiding your animal side will cause you many problems. If you bottle it up you'll only feel alienated. Without trust there cannot be unity. If Christians condemn you they are not acting with a christian spirit. You need to be part of a church of openness. A place where people may not understand you but will love you regardless. No one can fully understand somebody else, so keep that in mind. Ask God to direct you. I'm mentioning you in my prayers.

the reason therianism isn't condoned by general Christianity is that it's not in the Bible...

I'm not sure about that. The Bible does not automatically condemn something because it is absent.

He gave me my cougar side, and it's taught me much about leadership, cunningness, curbing my temper, and when to snarl. Instead of a negative (ie punishment), therians could be seen as just another way God teaches us about us and Him.

Concerning your cougar side, It seems to me that you have two reference points. One is the Creature itself and its behaviour, while the other is the 'spirit within', which you identify with the cougar.

I'm not sure how relevent this question is, but would you recognise your cougar side if you had never seen a cougar?

Would God give you a cougar side to guide you?

All creatures are subject to the world. God wants us to overcome the world. Only Jesus was able to do this and he is our visible reference point pointing us towards God and how we are to behave. Our invisible reference point is the Spirit of God who lives within us.

Both of these reference points are perfect and complete and we really do not need anything else. So I say that your animal side is not for guidance. It is there for some other reason. Have you any other thoughts concerning what that reason might be?

God bless Zelani.

You, LORD, are all I have,
and you give me all I need;
my future is in your hands.
How wonderful are your gifts to me;
how good they are!

I praise the LORD, because he guides
me,
and in the night my conscience
warns me.
I am always aware of the LORD's
presence;
he is near, and nothing can shake me.

And so I am thankful and glad,
and I feel completely secure,
because you protect me from the
power of death.
I have served you faithfully,
and you will not abandon me to
the world of the dead.

You will show me the path that leads
to life;
your presence fills me with joy
and brings me pleasure for ever. Psalm 16:5-11 GNB

 

[MoonAlpha1222]

As a therian I had many dream shifts, phantom shifts and mental shifts. But therians can be Christians, I view therians as different and special.

 

[ruTheophobic-or what]

How do you, as a Christian, view therians? Evil? Mind games? Reality? What? I'd like your opinions and thoughts; and I'll respectfully share mine as well.
Zelani

Hi Zelani, I have just joined just to start the ball re-rolling on this old thread. I recognise you have not logged on in years, but you may be still here under a new name? Anyhow my impression is that discussion boards have an ongoing use to newcomers (like me) who got here by being curious about a subject. I mean all I did was google Therian and found this discussion page.

Oh, well, here goes. My first response to finding out about Therians and Kinfolk was confusion. I found the explanation (singular) given, to be the only possible one that could give Therians credit. I mean, if the animal part was not reincarnated then the person must have a delusion! So the stress on Spiritual causes is understandable. But the experience of being part animal could be part of a disorder, Indentity disorder. But that is not cool. So re-incarnation is used. But does re-incarnation happen? From the general understanding Christians have from their Sacred Texts re-incarnation does not happen, but ressurection does. Moses was taken directly up into Heaven as was Elijah (or was that Elisha?). Later the two of them are seen by the discipels of Jesus talking to Jesus on a mountain (sorry I cannot get the references right now, but are easy to find if you google). There was also a case where someone touched the bones of a prophet and he was either healed or brought back to like (Old Testament somewhere). A donkey spoke with a man's voice to a wayward Prophet. But the revelation is that the animals were made distinct from Humans, and in fact the Old Testament explicitly says humans should not have sex with animals. Interesting quote from the other poster about Nebuchanezzer (whoever you spell it), becoming like and animal for a period of time.

Now in a sense re-incarnation may go on, but not in a way you want to hear. What if re-incarnation is a fancy way for demons to explain how they hop from one human or animal body to the next when their "home" dies. Jesus taught that the demon once cast out of someone goes about as if in a desert place looking for someone else. Also the many demons cast out of the man living amongst the tombs begged Jesus not to all be sent out into this spiritual wasteland, but rather into a heard of pigs. So they can get about. So claims that various animal spirits can enter people and be summoned up, obviously alarms me.

Both Therian ideas and Kinfolk developed in Wiccan groups as far as I can see.
Curious that is seems to always be flattering animals you have. I mean, frogs, slugs, elephants, walrus, or octupus, not really. If you think you a fish, you will probably drown trying.

And of course, just to alarm on further, the Master Therion, was Aliestar Crowley. Just saying.

 

[ruTheophobic-or what]

Oh, yes, a issue with the mind is that the lower parts of humans brains do in fact mirror the brains of animals. The limbic and "reptilian" brain. I think the limbic is the intuitive fight of flght part (simplified) and the reptilian (yes that is really the name biologists chose to use) is the instincts. I is wonderful that instincts can pass from one bird to the offspring about when to fly north, or how to build a nest. In fact part of us needs little sex education, as it really does come naturally. So I suppose it may be possible that some people access their "lower" (for want of a better way to identify the areas) brain, which have very animal like and sensuous, non verbal ways of behaving. Or possibly the person has put on an invisible headset and is walking about in a virtual reality (illusion). Of course in a sense all is illusion, it is passing, except the eternal things which last forever. So Identity has to founded in the eternal, ultimately. The human body is made for the Holy Spirit, not any other possibly unclean spirit, to inhabit.

 

[ruTheophobic-or what]

Um, yes me again, at the risk of saying too much, Recognising that the animals people think they are, are usually complimentary or flattering to them, the other possibility is that you are latching on to animals as your "alter ego" or mask persona. People with Narcistic Personality Disorder create a "high class" Identity, that is not truly themselves, but must be maintained at all cost. Could an animal identity,- of distinction,- attract narcistic people? Another explanation Therianism, (unless you take the Spiritual re-incarnation route) is that it could be a type of Autism. Creating fantastic private realities is what a lot of Autstic people do, so I have read online from sources I treat as trustworthy. I am very tired at the moment, and my spelling is a bit up the creek, sorry, I hope you will overlook this, I have always been a lazy speller.

Watched an interview with Suzie Quatro (famous bass player, glam rock in 1970's) on Youtube last night. She said there were two Suzies, the "Little Suzie Quatro" off stage, and the other leather clad one, that a hour before going on stage she morphed into. She actually described the identity change as "a shift" (as in shape-shift?). You may have created an animal persona for when you go "on stage"?, or off stage....bark bark barking.