Christians who reject the old testament and slavery

[Subduction Zone]

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Living conditions
An 1850 publication provided slaveholders with guidance on how to produce the "ideal slave":[4]

1. Maintain strict discipline and unconditional submission.
2. Create a sense of personal inferiority, so that slaves "know their place."
3. Instill fear.
4. Teach servants to take interest in their master's enterprise.
5. Deprive access to education and recreation, to ensure that slaves remain uneducated, helpless, and dependent.

Brutality
According to historians David Brion Davis and Eugene Genovese, treatment of slaves was harsh and inhumane. During work and outside of it, slaves suffered physical abuse, since the government allowed it. Treatment was usually harsher on large plantations, which were often managed by overseers and owned by absentee slaveholders. Small slaveholders worked together with their slaves and sometimes treated them more humanely.[5]

Besides slaves' being vastly overworked, they suffered brandings, shootings, "floggings," and even worse punishments. Flogging was a term often used to describe the average lashing or whipping a slave would receive for misbehaving. Many times a slave would also simply be put through "wanton cruelties" or unprovoked violent beatings or punishments.[6]

Humane treatment
After 1820,[7] in response to the inability to legally import new slaves from Africa following prohibition of the international slave trade, some slaveholders improved the living conditions of their slaves, to influence them not to attempt escape.[8]

Some slavery advocates asserted that many slaves were content with their situation. African-American abolitionist J. Sella Martin countered that the apparent contentment was a psychological reaction to dehumanizing brutality, such as witnessing their spouses sold at auction or their daughters raped.[9]

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treatment_of_slaves_in_the_United_States#Sexual_relations_and_rape

You still are admitting that you are wrong. You do realize that your current posting style is an admission of defeat, don't you? Everyone else does. It is rather obvious that you cannot understand the verses I quoted for you days ago. I can help you to understand your errors.

 

[Subduction Zone]

@MJFlores just in case you do not understand. Excessive use of Green Ink, as you use is a losing technique. It is one used by people that are mentally unbalanced. If you want to discuss this properly and politely I will gladly do so. But then it seems you know you will be shown to be wrong if you do so.

Here is a link on Green Ink so that you can understand what you are doing wrong:

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Green_ink

"Green ink is a British journalistic term for the frothing of lunatics.[1][2][3] Back when letters to news outlets were produced in an archaic medium based on materials known as "paper" and "ink", the nutters would supposedly always write their IMPORTANT INFORMATION in green. It is not known just how many such letters actually existed, or if this is just urban legend, though there are occasional reports of physical manifestations.[4] Common comorbid characteristics include irrelevant capitalisation, religious mania, overuse of exclamation marks and veiled threats or warnings directed at the recipient. An article in The Observer about letters to the editor suggests avoidance of green ink.[5]

The term remains a useful metaphor for similar frothing in the electronic age, even though the pages are likely to include every colour rejected from the rainbow,[6] in a tasteful variety of fonts. Though the truly exquisite green ink often appears in carefully-formatted black and white PDFs."

The article itself is much better since they illustrate the lunacy of Green Ink with examples in the print.

 

[MJFlores]

@MJFlores just in case you do not understand. Excessive use of Green Ink, as you use is a losing technique. It is one used by people that are mentally unbalanced. If you want to discuss this properly and politely I will gladly do so. But then it seems you know you will be shown to be wrong if you do so.

Here is a link on Green Ink so that you can understand what you are doing wrong:

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Green_ink

"Green ink is a British journalistic term for the frothing of lunatics.[1][2][3] Back when letters to news outlets were produced in an archaic medium based on materials known as "paper" and "ink", the nutters would supposedly always write their IMPORTANT INFORMATION in green. It is not known just how many such letters actually existed, or if this is just urban legend, though there are occasional reports of physical manifestations.[4] Common comorbid characteristics include irrelevant capitalisation, religious mania, overuse of exclamation marks and veiled threats or warnings directed at the recipient. An article in The Observer about letters to the editor suggests avoidance of green ink.[5]

The term remains a useful metaphor for similar frothing in the electronic age, even though the pages are likely to include every colour rejected from the rainbow,[6] in a tasteful variety of fonts. Though the truly exquisite green ink often appears in carefully-formatted black and white PDFs."

The article itself is much better since they illustrate the lunacy of Green Ink with examples in the print.

Please try to answer properly. The analogy was obviously based on today's environment. In the Bible times it would be similar to predicting that a Hebrew would see a sheep. Not answering a simple question properly is another example of you demonstrating your fear.

So let's change my prophecy for Zeke:

"Lo, thou shalt see a sheep of white".

Does it mean anything if this "prophecy" is fulfilled?

I can help you with the parts of the Bible that are too difficult for you to understand.

The slavery in the Old South of the U.S. was not nearly as bad as biblical slavery.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Slavery was right - in their time.

Then why fear slave revolts? If everything was hunky dory there'd be nothing to sweat over.

But I will punish the nation they serve as slaves, and afterward they will come out with great possessions.

So it's acknowledging slavery is only wrong when it happens to Hebrews?

We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers

But they made laws banning other stuff. Why give slavery a pass?

It is very fortunate for us, that we are not slaves but in other countries today

We have legit slaves here in the US. Your video map thing shows we are in the green, but green =/= zero.

Everyone was to free their Hebrew slaves, both male and female; no one was to hold a fellow Hebrew in bondage.

Again, why isn't it okay for Hebrews to do to themselves what they do to others?

 

[Subduction Zone]

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I see that you still do not understand your errors.

Tell me, in the Old South could a man sell his daughters into slavery, and what was almost always going to be sex slavery? The book that you do not understand allows that.

 

[MJFlores]

Then why fear slave revolts? If everything was hunky dory there'd be nothing to sweat over.


So it's acknowledging slavery is only wrong when it happens to Hebrews?


But they made laws banning other stuff. Why give slavery a pass?


We have legit slaves here in the US. Your video map thing shows we are in the green, but green =/= zero.


Again, why isn't it okay for Hebrews to do to themselves what they do to others?

The Israelites are dead and what they did they did.
There are no more Israelites today but Israelis.
The most notorious and vicious slave trading occurred in the US which lasted 246 years.
The deceased Hebrew people are not even known to be slave traders unlike the Dutch and the rednecks.
So why magnify it? Because it is in the Bible?
A lot of African Americans suffered from slavery, why do people downplay it?
Ah, because of racism?
Being white? White power?
Slavery is written in the annals of history - we could only surmise what the world would be like if it did not existed.

Next, I am not Caucasian. Take cauc because I am Asian.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The Israelites are dead and what they did they did.
There are no more Israelites today but Israelis.
The most notorious and vicious slave trading occurred in the US which lasted 246 years.
The deceased Hebrew people are not even known to be slave traders unlike the Dutch and the rednecks.
So why magnify it? Because it is in the Bible?
A lot of African Americans suffered from slavery, why do people downplay it?
Ah, because of racism?
Being white? White power?
Slavery is written in the annals of history - we could only surmise what the world would be like if it did not existed.

Next, I am not Caucasian. Take cauc because I am Asian.

View attachment 23403

No one is down playing black slavery. You are only being corrected on biblical slavery. Just as bad, if not worse.

 

[MJFlores]

No one is down playing black slavery. You are only being corrected on biblical slavery. Just as bad, if not worse.

The slavery in the Old South of the U.S. was not nearly as bad as biblical slavery.

Your posts.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Your posts.o

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Yes, and they are correct. You appear to be incredibly ignorant. Whipping was not an invention of the south. In the Bible you could legally beat a slave to death, provided they lingered for a couple of days.

All you have managed to show is that you have never studied the Bible.

And in case you did not know it that video is a reenactment . Not the best source to use.

 

[Subduction Zone]

But since you like videos so much:

 

[MJFlores]

Yes, and they are correct. You appear to be incredibly ignorant. Whipping was not an invention of the south. In the Bible you could legally beat a slave to death, provided they lingered for a couple of days.

All you have managed to show is that you have never studied the Bible.

And in case you did not know it that video is a reenactment . Not the best source to use.

 

[MJFlores]

10 Cities You Probably Didn’t Know Were Built on Slavery

1. Prague (Czech Republic)
2. Havana (Cuba)
3. New Orleans (USA)
4. Algiers (Algeria)
5. Mexico City (Mexico)
6. Venice (Italy)
7. Rio de Janeiro (Brazil)
8. Elmina (Ghana)
9. Cadiz (Spain)
10. Pretty Much Any Town or City in Belgium (Belgium)

https://www.toptenz.net/10-cities-probably-didnt-know-built-slavery.php

Any town or city in Israel failed to make the list.

New Orleans made it and that is in American history.

Well documented, not in cartoons.

 

[MJFlores]

But since you like videos so much:

Pathetic anime attempt - emoji looking angels have laptops?

 

[Subduction Zone]

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Nope, that is a fact. When do you think that video tape was invented?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Pathetic anime attempt - emoji looking angels have laptops?
View attachment 23410

Why not? You are the one that believes myths,tell me, why not?

Are you trying to make yourself look foolish here?

 

[MJFlores]

Why not? You are the one that believes myths,tell me, why not?

Are you trying to make yourself look foolish here?

I find your comments anti-semetic focusing on the Hebrew people

Subduction Zone said: ↑
The slavery in the Old South of the U.S. was not nearly as bad as biblical slavery.

Belittling the sufferings of African American slaves of the South

 

[Subduction Zone]

I find your comments anti-semetic focusing on the Hebrew people

Subduction Zone said: ↑
The slavery in the Old South of the U.S. was not nearly as bad as biblical slavery.

Belittling the sufferings of African American slaves of the South

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I see that logic is still not a tool that you know how to use. Pointing out that slavery in the Bible was as bad as slavery in the south does not belittle the sufferings of blacks one iota.

Think about it. You should be able to see your error .

 

[ImmortalFlame]

That Slavery existed even before the Bible was written https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery

Irrelevant. The Bible instructs its followers on the process of buying, selling, trading and owning slaves.

That the Bible did not promote Slavery and in fact ordered freeing of Hebrew slaves Jeremiah 34:9

I've already explained that passage wasn't an instruction to ALL Hebrews, and that still doesn't justify enslavement of non-Hebrews or the loophole the Bible provides to allow to you keep Hebrew slaves for life. What's more, instructing your followers in the practice of buying, selling, trading and keeping slaves IS promotion of slavery. If I tell you the best way to make a bacon sandwich, I can be said to be encouraging you to make a bacon sandwich.

That Slavery was formally ended by the world powers in the 1800s

Also irrelevant.

Slavery is still practiced today in countries which do not believe in the Bible https://www.wonderslist.com/10-countries-with-most-slaves/

From that list:
Haiti is officially recognized as a Roman Catholic country, with over 80% of the country being either Catholic of Protestant. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Haiti
Moldova is a very, VERY Christian nation, with over 93% being orthodox. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Moldova
Nigeria is over 50% Christian (30% Protestant, 10% Catholic, 10% other). Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Nigeria
The biggest religion in Russia is the Russian Christian Orthodox church. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Orthodox_Church

So that's 4 out of the 10 countries in that list being majority Christian, so you're lying.

That the Bible teaches the right conduct of a true Christian person when he finds himself as a slave or a master of a slave Colossians 3:22-25 Ephesians 6:9

"Conduct" isn't the issue. It's the morality of slavery in the first place. If you kidnap someone off the street, that act isn't lessened by the fact that you treat your captive very politely. Kidnapping is still morally wrong, just as slavery - in any form - is morally wrong.

That the Bible is not for slave traders 1 Timothy 1:9-11

The Bible specifically instructs its followers in how to own, buy, sell, trade and treat slaves.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Any town or city in Israel failed to make the list.

Research Israeli cities. Nearly all of them were either owned by another civilization or created relatively recently in their history. Israel is built on genocide. Sure, lots of other countries are too, but Israel tries to claim some sort of divine exemption to how bad it is.

I find your comments anti-semetic focusing on the Hebrew people

They're the ones who made the bible, dear.

Belittling the sufferings of African American slaves of the South

Where do you think they got the idea?

The slavery in the Old South of the U.S. was worst than the biblical slavery.

Slavery is inherently bad. There is no "worse than".

 

[MJFlores]

Irrelevant. The Bible instructs its followers on the process of buying, selling, trading and owning slaves.


I've already explained that passage wasn't an instruction to ALL Hebrews, and that still doesn't justify enslavement of non-Hebrews or the loophole the Bible provides to allow to you keep Hebrew slaves for life. What's more, instructing your followers in the practice of buying, selling, trading and keeping slaves IS promotion of slavery. If I tell you the best way to make a bacon sandwich, I can be said to be encouraging you to make a bacon sandwich.


Also irrelevant.


From that list:
Haiti is officially recognized as a Roman Catholic country, with over 80% of the country being either Catholic of Protestant. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Haiti
Moldova is a very, VERY Christian nation, with over 93% being orthodox. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Moldova
Nigeria is over 50% Christian (30% Protestant, 10% Catholic, 10% other). Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Nigeria
The biggest religion in Russia is the Russian Christian Orthodox church. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Orthodox_Church

So that's 4 out of the 10 countries in that list being majority Christian, so you're lying.


"Conduct" isn't the issue. It's the morality of slavery in the first place. If you kidnap someone off the street, that act isn't lessened by the fact that you treat your captive very politely. Kidnapping is still morally wrong, just as slavery - in any form - is morally wrong.


The Bible specifically instructs its followers in how to own, buy, sell, trade and treat slaves.

I'm sorry but your definition of who Christians are is a little bit way off.

Roman Catholics, Protestant, Orthodox aren't Bible believing organizations/churches hence couldn't be Christians. I specifically posted "Slavery is still practiced today in countries which do not believe in the Bible"
They use the Bible, but they do not believe in it. I used to be Catholic so I should know. Holding the Bible per se doesn't mean you believe it. It is really a different matter.

Is America, a Bible believing nation?

I am sorry, my answer would be the same as "Is the 86% Catholic Philippines a Bible believing nation?

There is no such thing as a Bible believing nation except the Church of Christ.