"Christocrats" is politics and religion a dangerous mixture?

[opensoul7]

Here in Ohio we have a large evangelical church named World Harvest.This church was founded by a man named Rod Parsley , who is now pushing his large congregation and others to be immersed in the political arena. He is calling these new politically involved Christians "Christocrats", and urging them to use the power of numbers by involving all Christians to create a new political movement.A movement that will bring God back into the goverment.He has already met with over a thousand pastors and politicians, including president Bush .This movement goes beyond the ten comandments issue , and could one day effect if not destroy the idea of seperation of church and state. Is politics and religion a dangerous mixture? What do you think or feel about "Christocrats" ?

 

[Sunstone]

All of history shows beyond reasonable doubt that mixing politics and religion is far more dangerous than it is beneficial.

The very notion of returning this country to God is fallacious. The generation of the Founders was one of the least religious in our history. But Christian revisionists have repeated the lie that the Founders were especially religious so often now that many people believe it.

 

[Mike182]

Here in Ohio we have a large evangelical church named World Harvest.This church was founded by a man named Rod Parsley , who is now pushing his large congregation and others to be immersed in the political arena. He is calling these new politically involved Christians "Christocrats", and urging them to use the power of numbers by involving all Christians to create a new political movement.A movement that will bring God back into the goverment.He has already met with over a thousand pastors and politicians, including president Bush .This movement goes beyond the ten comandments issue , and could one day effect if not destroy the idea of seperation of church and state. Is politics and religion a dangerous mixture? What do you think or feel about "Christocrats" ?

i personally think it is a very dangerous mix - the tudor period in England comes to mind........

what will they use political power for? i hate to sound skeptical, but im affraid it will turn into a "lets restore basic morality back to how it should be" situation, with a rise of anti-GBLT legislation among other things


but also, wil they try to pass ligislation to make schools hold christian assembleys? will they descriminate against people of other religions?

i would not support a christian group (or any other religious group) trying to gain political power with the aim of "bringing God back to politics"

i do not think that politicians should not have a religion, i just think that political offices should be held by the people who are best at doing the job - whoever that maybe

mike

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Here in Ohio we have a large evangelical church named World Harvest.This church was founded by a man named Rod Parsley , who is now pushing his large congregation and others to be immersed in the political arena. He is calling these new politically involved Christians "Christocrats", and urging them to use the power of numbers by involving all Christians to create a new political movement.A movement that will bring God back into the goverment.He has already met with over a thousand pastors and politicians, including president Bush .This movement goes beyond the ten comandments issue , and could one day effect if not destroy the idea of seperation of church and state. Is politics and religion a dangerous mixture? What do you think or feel about "Christocrats" ?

It is a seperation of Christ from Christianity and their fundamental premise is the unification of church and state. Yes, religion and politics are a dangerous mixture when a religion is codified into law and incorporated into the state.

Religions in most cultures did start out as what we can classify as "state religions" because they were part of the public government. Because religions were a part of the public government, the religions could be used to carry out the non-religious objectives of the state: to fight in the wars of the state, to participate in civil government, to grow crops, marry to produce more citizens to preserve the state, and the preists are puppets of the state and use their office to further whatever objectives the state sets. The seperation of church and state is a very new idea, and it is the only prescription for freedom, both civic and religious.

The Christocratic idea deserves any ridicule that it may attract. Have fun.

EDIT: I found their website and their blog, and their aint much on it, thank God. www.cristocrats.org. OK, their political symbol is a lion, presumably from C.S. Lewis' Narnia, with the Republican colors. http://www.cafepress.com/csunite

It honestly is offensive to me to see people use the name of Christ so flippantly.:areyoucra

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Here in Ohio we have a large evangelical church named World Harvest.This church was founded by a man named Rod Parsley , who is now pushing his large congregation and others to be immersed in the political arena. He is calling these new politically involved Christians "Christocrats", and urging them to use the power of numbers by involving all Christians to create a new political movement.A movement that will bring God back into the goverment.He has already met with over a thousand pastors and politicians, including president Bush .This movement goes beyond the ten comandments issue , and could one day effect if not destroy the idea of seperation of church and state. Is politics and religion a dangerous mixture? What do you think or feel about "Christocrats" ?

OK, from what I can tell, Rod Parsley actually has no political power. The meeting with Bush and 1000 pastors is most likely a myth or related to a regular prayer breakfast that pastors of every faith attend. One of Parsley's sermons drew a little attention in some blogs, and the Christocrats may be one or two people in his church. "Christocrat" does not appear on his church's website www.breakthrough.net, and I don't recall seeing his name on christocrat.org.

I could not find "Christocrat" on two other websites of organizations founded by Rod Parsley https://www.centerformoralclarity.net and http://www.reformationohio.org/. All I can find are institutes by Parsley that are accomplishing nothing as they are fighting against religious and civic freedoms.Knockout

If Christians seperate from the Republican or Democratic party it would render them powerless as an independent third party.

 

[opensoul7]

Angellous,
No parsley does not have power as of yet, this is a pretty new thing developing here. Also it was more than a sermon , he also has had at least one meeting with pastors from all over the state and ohio politicians in attendance.It was enough for there to be a couple of articles written on the meeting and it's ideas .Also a four page article on the man himself and his church in the columbus dispatch.I believe he had put something in the last book he wrote "silent no more" .It is not that it is a movement already in power , but more the possible begining of a snowball starting to roll down a mountain.Just because it isnt major news yet does not mean it wont be .Parsley and his church have alot of viewers nationwide , alot of people hearing this message.I know and have friends and neighbors who attend this church, and follow and believe whole hearted what this man tells them.We have discussed this topic and my stand point is if God is alive in your life then God will show in all you choose to do .You don't need a man to tell you how to vote when you can pray and discuss it with God directly.Like I said it is more local at the moment , but leads me to think about the topic as a whole , and bring it to a public forum now for people to think about the potential "what if ". I dont think rod has given up on this idea and he also has been looking into being able to run for political office and has lawyers looking into that possibility.I'll see if I can dig up those articles , they are in the Columbus dispatch , ohio.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Angellous,
No parsley does not have power as of yet, this is a pretty new thing developing here. Also it was more than a sermon , he also has had at least one meeting with pastors from all over the state and ohio politicians in attendance.It was enough for there to be a couple of articles written on the meeting and it's ideas .Also a four page article on the man himself and his church in the columbus dispatch.I believe he had put something in the last book he wrote "silent no more" .It is not that it is a movement already in power , but more the possible begining of a snowball starting to roll down a mountain.Just because it isnt major news yet does not mean it wont be .Parsley and his church have alot of viewers nationwide , alot of people hearing this message.I know and have friends and neighbors who attend this church, and follow and believe whole hearted what this man tells them.We have discussed this topic and my stand point is if God is alive in your life then God will show in all you choose to do .You don't need a man to tell you how to vote when you can pray and discuss it with God directly.Like I said it is more local at the moment , but leads me to think about the topic as a whole , and bring it to a public forum now for people to think about the potential "what if ". I dont think rod has given up on this idea and he also has been looking into being able to run for political office and has lawyers looking into that possibility.I'll see if I can dig up those articles , they are in the Columbus dispatch , ohio.

I have no doubt that as a pastor of a large church that he has a local following, and he could have met with other fundie pastors, but I can't imagine that Christians will ever be able to become a powerful independent party in this country. There simply aren't enough fundies, and if anything, a "snowball" effect would draw more people to vote Democrat or Republican. Christians are much more powerful as swing voters for people who seem moral but won't actually be theocratic.

The "Christocratic" platform is anti-American and unconstiutional, and anti-Christ. Something cannot "snowball" if it is on fire.

 

[Sunstone]

The man sounds power hungry.

 

[Quiddity]

The generation of the Founders was one of the least religious in our history. But Christian revisionists have repeated the lie that the Founders were especially religious so often now that many people believe it.

I've heard this too. Do you have any source where I can read about it?

~Victor

 

[Feathers in Hair]

While the example given was of Christianity, I'd take it further to include all faiths, including my own. Religion is far too personal a thing to involve in politics.

 

[Green Gaia]

While I may not like the politics of the Christocrats and others, I cannot say that they should not voice a political opinion when I am on the other end of the spectrum with religious liberals who seek to have our voice heard in the political arena as well. But I think largely our voice has become louder to counteract the voices of the Christocrats and others like them. I think the difference between us though is that while they seek to write their religion into our laws, the religious left seeks to preserve and expand on the freedoms all already enjoy.

 

[Eynah]

I've heard this too. Do you have any source where I can read about it?

~Victor

This is what I've found from a quick search:

http://www.sullivan-county.com/nf0/dispatch/fathers_quote2.htm (Some quotes by the founding fathers)

http://www.chicora.org/founding_fathers_and_religion.htm (More quotes by the founding fathers)

http://earlyamerica.com/review/summer97/secular.html (An article about President Adams signing a document that America is a Secular Nation.)

http://hnn.us/articles/9144.html (This is an interview with a Mr. Jon Butler who is the Dean of the Graduate School of Arts & Sciences at Yale University)

I've not been able to find one that says they were very religious, most I've found support that they were deists.

 

[Sunstone]

I've heard this too. Do you have any source where I can read about it?

~Victor

My own sources for this come mainly from books I've read, rather than online sources. One of the most interesting studies I found in a book by Micheal Shermer on morality. It was a graph of church attendence in the US over the last 200 years, and it showed that church attendence has been growing, rather than declining, in the long run. As a percentage of the population, there are 2 or 3 times more people going to church today than went to church during the Revolutionary Generation. I wish I could recall the title of Shermer's book for you, but I can't.

 

[opensoul7]

Well put Angellous, as allways you are a gentleman and a scholar.I also give props to feathersinhair for the quality point that any religion and political mixture is dangerous at best.

 

[TheGreaterGame]

I'm for seperation of Church and State . . . but that should not mean a Godless Government who is afraid to pray in public and say the JC word. People are free to belive whatever they choose to belive no matter how wrong or right they are . . . so if you want to be an Liberal Pro-Abortion Pro Open Homosexual Lifestyle your entitled to your right . . . but I have the equal right to disagree on Christian principles and the verbal right, promised to me by the constitution of the US government that protects said rights.

 

[nutshell]

My own sources for this come mainly from books I've read, rather than online sources. One of the most interesting studies I found in a book by Micheal Shermer on morality. It was a graph of church attendence in the US over the last 200 years, and it showed that church attendence has been growing, rather than declining, in the long run. As a percentage of the population, there are 2 or 3 times more people going to church today than went to church during the Revolutionary Generation. I wish I could recall the title of Shermer's book for you, but I can't.

Couldn't that be because the population overall is growing? I thought statistics have pointed to a decline in Church attendance over the years.

 

[opensoul7]

I think regardless of your faith , you have the right to practice and believe whatever you want. And by keeping that belief inside alive it will show in all you do in your life.As a Christian , or muslim (or any other faith) you can let God (or whatever motivates you) guide you in who or what you vote for or against.But there does not need to be a single religious group formed to influence or control govermental affairs.Your already representing your belief in the way you vote, or are involved with local state or federal representitives.And the other "catch" to this is a peer presure situation if there were "Christocrats", you would be influenced to vote or act a certain way by your peers in your congregation or group.No matter what faith you belong to (or not) the individual feels very different about almost everything ,and voting still influenced by your personal beliefs could go a variety of ways in a group.But what if you were told during a sermon that "God would want you to vote this way or that", or "God was counting on you to do the right thing by voting this way or that", or even "it would be a sin not to do Gods will by voting this way or that"? There could be a heavy peer presure effect that could sway laws and goverment drastically.A "herd" mindset could be a very unstable and dangerous one.

 

[Scuba Pete]

I abhor Christian based PACs.They are ill conceived and more often than not display ANYTHING but Christian values and ideals.

 

[Valjean]

The only benign state religion that comes to mind as I contemplate this question existed, till recently, in Tibet.

 

[Melody]

And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2

I don't see how this can be reconciled with political activism...and it's just not necessary. Compare someone like Mother Theresa and then someone like George Bush (sorry...can't think of anyone else at the moment). Who did the most for humanity and lived a more Christ-filled life? If your focus is on politics, how can it be on God?