City cracks down on illegal houses of worship

[Pah]

City cracks down on illegal houses of worship

Friday, February 4, 2005

By ERIK ORTIZ
HERALD NEWS

Complete article

PASSAIC - Houses of worship are bountiful in this city, where signs light up God's message into the late hours. But it's the unassuming houses that have caught the eye of city officials.

After an illegal synagogue was forced to close last month, Mayor Samuel Rivera said Thursday that the city will move quickly to shut down any residence or building that operates outside the law and puts a person's welfare at risk.

The illegal synagogue, used by members of the city's Jewish Orthodox community, was on Crescent Avenue. It had been hosting "a large number of people" for months, the mayor said.

Although used as a house of worship, it never received the appropriate zoning approval, officials discovered. A structure is defined as a house of worship when it is "specifically designed, arranged and erected for the sole purpose of religious worship," according to city code.

What should be noted is that the government does has rights and powers to regulate religious expression.

 

[Master Vigil]

I guess this brings up the question of "what constitutes legal?" Is it the ordained minister? Or what, what makes a place legal?

 

[desi]

So, the government is going USSR on religion. And the former USSR is getting lax in that area. Interesting phenomenon.

 

[Pah]

I guess this brings up the question of "what constitutes legal?" Is it the ordained minister? Or what, what makes a place legal?

In this case, as the article points out, zoning laws

 

[Pah]

So, the government is going USSR on religion. And the former USSR is getting lax in that area. Interesting phenomenon.

The Constitution has, for many years, power over religion when it involves safety or policing power. I believe there was a case before the civil war. It has also extended to the power to deny tax exemptions as in the case against Bob Jones University on the basis of racial inequality

A little more depth in civics might serve you well.

 

[TranceAm]

The Constitution has, for many years, power over religion when it involves safety or policing power. I believe there was a case before the civil war. It has also extended to the power to deny tax exemptions as in the case against Bob Jones University on the basis of racial inequality

A little more depth in civics might serve you well.

Aint that strange.
If the government has laws that make legal or illegal what you can or can't do in the bedroom, it also has laws that state what and how, and with how many people together you can worship something in your livingroom... It aint that hard to imagine people worshipping a new form of government for the US with a closed for outsiders group of people in a non-public house of worship... :woohoo:

 

[Scuba Pete]

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;

By denying them a place to worship, by whatever means, they have prohibited the "free exercise thereof".

 

[huajiro]

Watch drugs become legal and Religion illegal.....people will come up bumming money to get to Church.

 

[Lycan]

IMHO -

I don't think this is really a religious issue, any other business would be held to the same standards (zoning laws) as this one. You can't turn your house into a restraunt or any other business either. I don't think it is a matter of the government restricting their worship, but rather the following of standard laws.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

This is a zoning issue rather than a religious one. The mayor interfered for their own good (in case of fire, etc.). The city would have moved against them if it were a gathering of any kind. I am sure the Jews are welcome to meet anywhere that is able to accomodate their size.

 

[cfer]

This is a zoning issue rather than a religious one. The mayor interfered for their own good (in case of fire, etc.). The city would have moved against them if it were a gathering of any kind. I am sure the Jews are welcome to meet anywhere that is able to accomodate their size.

So if I were to have a Confirmation open house at my own home, where everyone prayed together, talked about God and socialized in Christ, I'd be breaking the law? Because my home is definitely NOT zoned for religion.

By the way, I have a really large family, too. :bonk:

What about Bible study sessions? What if I wanted to hold Bible studies in my home? Where is the line drawn?

 

[desi]

The Constitution has, for many years, power over religion when it involves safety or policing power. I believe there was a case before the civil war. It has also extended to the power to deny tax exemptions as in the case against Bob Jones University on the basis of racial inequality

A little more depth in civics might serve you well.

I don't think churches should get tax breaks. I also don't think the government has any right to impose itself on harmless worshipers so long as they stay out of trouble. A lesson in history as it pertains to religious persecution might serve the government well.

 

[Pah]

By denying them a place to worship, by whatever means, they have prohibited the "free exercise thereof".

Yes Doc they did.

Let's re-examine the basic setup. The Constitution grants power to the state. What the state is not granted is retained by the people. The Constitution grants the state the policing power to continue the state and provide for the security and safety of the people.

When two "powers" clash (or two rights or two freedoms) the Supreme Court is mandated to decide which will prevail. It seems to me that unless the state has police power is can not provide for the safety of the people to exercise their recognized powers. Justifiied police power trumps some people power. (You can't yell "FIRE!" in a movie theater and cause a panic without there being a fire - you can't have a religion based on human sacrifice) Land use control is a justified use of state power.

 

[Pah]

So if I were to have a Confirmation open house at my own home, where everyone prayed together, talked about God and socialized in Christ, I'd be breaking the law? Because my home is definitely NOT zoned for religion.

And does not have the primary purpose or business of religion so you don't usually have a problem. However, upon complaint, you may be forced to have your guests park away from the house.

 

[Pah]

I don't think churches should get tax breaks. I also don't think the government has any right to impose itself on harmless worshipers so long as they stay out of trouble. A lesson in history as it pertains to religious persecution might serve the government well.

The key word is "harmless"

 

[desi]

The key word is "harmless"

What makes harmless the key word?

 

[Pah]

What makes harmless the key word?

When worshipers cause harm, the state may step in.

 

[retrorich]

City cracks down on illegal houses of worship

The houses of worship that should be cracked down upon are those controlled by the Catholic bishops who told their parishioners that voting for John Kerry would be a sin. At the very least, they should be stripped of their tax exempt status.

 

[Melody]

I would guess this had less to do with religion and more to do with safety. Depending on how many people were involved, a private home is rarely outfitted in a safe manner for large numbers of people. Doors may not open outwards, exits may be limited, layout of the house may make fast exits virtually impossible in case of fire and I could go on.


As for large parties, bible studies, confirmations, etc., check your zoning laws and I'd guess there is something in there that gives the local officials the authority to close down a bible study, confirmation or party if they feel the amount of people exceeds the safe limits of the size of the home.

Melody

 

[Scuba Pete]

I agree with Pah... "Mostly Harmless" is about as good as you can get though!