Climate Change - Bad News

[Ben Dhyan]

My point is simple. One has either 2 choices. One can either try to get a handle on the research itself, which (believe you me) takes years and years of research and a background in multivariate mathematics, physics, and some other odds & ends, or one can accept the majority opinion: anthropogenic global warming is real, dangerous, and happening now. That's not an exclusive "or", btw. Many a person who has done such research has concluded that AGW is real, happening, and dangerous. I am personally not as convinced as many. But then, I'm famous for uncertainty.

That's fine. Now the final arbiter is the climate itself, I am happy to note that so far in the 21st century the data is showing no warming. We will see as the years roll by who was correct.

 

[LegionOnomaMoi]

Now the final arbiter is the climate itself

This is true, my friend.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

My other thought was that these guys obviously missed the memo about the sea level rises, because that is going to be massively catastrophic to many, many human communities.

Well these sea levels rises so far this century are showing that no catastrophe is looming any time soon...

New study using GRACE data shows global sea levels rising less than 7 inches per century

Finds sea levels have risen over the past 9 years [2002-2011] at a rate of only 1.7 mm/yr, equivalent to 6.7 inches per century, matching tide gauge data rates.

 

[Riverwolf]

Riverwolf, AGW refers to human derived CO2, not pollution in general., and CO2 does not harm the environment.

It doesn't harm plant life; rather, plants will thrive on the rising CO2 levels.

But we can't breathe it.

Environmental destruction through human activity in general including particulate atmospheric pollution is another matter, not to be confused with the climate change debate.

Climate change is one of the side-effects of pollution, and the climate is changing. I keep saying, over and over, that the climate where I live is completely different from when I was a kid.

 

[Riverwolf]

Well these sea levels rises so far this century are showing that no catastrophe is looming any time soon...

So screw our descendents, huh?

 

[Ben Dhyan]

It doesn't harm plant life; rather, plants will thrive on the rising CO2 levels.

But we can't breathe it.

Climate change is one of the side-effects of pollution, and the climate is changing. I keep saying, over and over, that the climate where I live is completely different from when I was a kid.

I'm quickly realizing you don't do science Riverwolf, you'd be better sticking to non science subjects.

Fyi, anthropogenic derived CO2 comprises only about 3% of all atmospheric CO2, the 97% rest is natural, and all of atmospheric CO2 comprises just 0.03% of air, while Oxygen is about 20%.

So the human derived CO2 comprises just 3% of 0.03% of the air,..ie. 0,0009% of the air.

So you have no worries about breathing CO2.

And fyi, the earth's climate is never in stasis, it's always changing, so all is normal in that regard, All adults anywhere in the world throughout all time were / are aware that the climate has changed since they were kids.

 

[YmirGF]

And fyi, the earth's climate is never in stasis, it's always changing, so all is normal in that regard, All adults anywhere in the world throughout all time were / are aware that the climate has changed since they were kids.

Also there is the reality that people are paying far more attention to the weather these days, so they notice what they expect to see and ignore anything that does not meet expectations. It's really a new religious paradigm.

 

[sandandfoam]

It's really a new religious paradigm.

I couldn't agree more.

 

[Riverwolf]

I'm quickly realizing you don't do science Riverwolf, you'd be better sticking to non science subjects.

And how do you define science that you can make such a determination about a person you've never met?

How do you know I don't have a Ph.D. in something?

I don't; I'm taking 7 years to get through a 2 year college, and I was a C-average student in high school, but it would have been quite funny if I'd had. (I don't do well in formal academia.)

For the record, I do do science. Computer science, about 50% self-taught.

while (true){printf("/a");}

Contrary to what Hollywood thinks, someone who's a master in one field of science can be a complete novice in another field. A biologist isn't necessarily going to be able to recite the periodic table, let alone know anything about chemical formulas.

In short: don't tell other people what they should or shouldn't be doing with their lives, especially when your entire exposure to them has been an online forum.

Fyi, anthropogenic derived CO2 comprises only about 3% of all atmospheric CO2, the 97% rest is natural, and all of atmospheric CO2 comprises just 0.03% of air, while Oxygen is about 20%.

Show me a .edu website, not a .com website.

So the human derived CO2 comprises just 3% of 0.03% of the air,..ie. 0,0009% of the air.

So you have no worries about breathing CO2.

What kind of city do you live in?

That might be the case in suburbia, but I once again reference Mexico City's curfew. I also reference that it's said that breathing in China is virtually impossible. As an asthmatic, I doubt I could ever go there.

And fyi, the earth's climate is never in stasis, it's always changing, so all is normal in that regard, All adults anywhere in the world throughout all time were / are aware that the climate has changed since they were kids.

"All time"? Show me those sources. Original sources, BTW, that is, actual documents from 1000 years ago, wherein the climate changed to something completely different, and stayed that way, within the span of a few years. Specifically documents from around the North Mediterranean region (Italy, Greece, Iberia, etc.), since they share California's basic climate.

'Sides, the issue isn't the normal change; it's the accelerated change that's cause for concern. Not for the planet, but for the species, or at the very least, society. I'm not worried about an apocalypse, nor am I worried about developed countries. I'm worried about third-world countries.

You show many scientists who say there's no problem, but when an equal amount, if not a greater amount, of scientists say there is a problem, that's enough for me to be concerned and do what I can to reduce my own pollution, and encourage others to do the same.

 

[ResistETIntervention]

With all due respect, scientists that are not climatologist have not generally studied Climate Change in depth. As scientists then, they should and would be very cautious in stating or agreeing with statements such as "limiting greenhouse gases would harm the environment." As scientists, they would have had to perform experiments themselves to collect data before coming to any conclusions. So it seems odd, at best, that 31,487 scientists would sign such petition. Yet, if you consider the fact that scientists also need employments which may depend on funding often from private companies which would profit vastly more without any restrictions on emission of greenhouse gases, it is understandable then that some of the scientists may have taken an easier route and signed some seemingly harmless paper, if the signatures are, indeed, authentic.

You do not need consensus from scientists or governments to know that climate is changing. You are able to observe what is occurring around the world objectively without anyone’s data or opinion.

Some of the events of the Great Waves of Change.

(Recent Flooding in a semi-arid region in Colorado, September 12, 2013)
[youtube]QPrA6S4prjI[/youtube]

 

[ResistETIntervention]

Really, it's no more worth debating the reality of anthropogenic global warming with denialists than it is debating creationists. Climate change is a fact. The only productive discussions we can have about it are on what we're going to do about it, and how to adapt to a hotter world.

Here are some of the actions you can take to prepare for the future.

Preparing Your Outer Life:

1. Conserve energy as much as possible. Reduce your energy consumption by 25-50% or more to help save your community and the world from depletion and ruin.
2. Maintain a supply of food, water, and medicine – at least a supply for 90 days.
3. Build an emergency cash fund, if possible.
4. Consider the availability of medical services in your area.
5. Consider learning how to grow some of your own food.
6. Own fewer things. Make sure that everything you own really serves you. Travel light and create time for more important things.
7. Consider where you live in light of the Great Waves of change. In your current location, are you able and willing to travel without the use of an automobile? Will you be able to assist others?
8. Consider your profession, and ask yourself whether your line of work is sustainable in the years ahead given the constraints on energy, food, and other resources.
9. Educate other, including your friends, family, neighbors, and coworkers, about the Great Waves of change. Consider the frail, the elderly, and the vulnerable in your local community.
10. Support your local merchants, farmers, and producers.
11. Learn where your essential resources come from.
12. Be sensitive and aware of the possibility of natural disasters in your area.
13. Inquire into your local town, city, or regional government’s plan and preparations, if any.
14. Build strong personal relationships that can help you in your preparation.
15. Continue to educate yourself about the Great Waves of change. Use caution and discernment when considering the opinions of others and the commentary of experts.

From The Great Waves of Change (p.209~211)

 

[ResistETIntervention]

Preparing Your Inner Life:

1. Take quiet time each day to consider the wisdom of your thoughts and actions and to become aware of any insights you have had.
2. Adopt a simple meditation practice to relieve stress and to connect to the deeper intelligence within you. The study in the Steps to Knowledge provides a pathway for doing this.
3. Have few opinions.
4. Stop complaining. Do not waste your precious time and energy complaining about something if you are not prepared to take action regarding it.
5. Reassess your goals and plans to see if these are really going to be possible in a radically changing world.
6. Forgive others who seem to err against you and the world. Practicing forgiveness will save your emotional energy and keep your mind clear.
7. Honor your parents, and try to understand the circumstances of their lives that determined their decisions and behavior.
8. Forgive yourself. If you don’t forgive yourself, you lose self-trust, which you will need to rely upon increasingly in the future.
9. Build and maintain and the Four Pillars of your life: the pillar of relationship, the pillar of health, the pillar of work and providership, and the pillar of spiritual development.
10. Do not succumb to fear or believe that you have no power in the face of these great changes, for you have the power of Knowledge within you to guide and protect you if you can follow it.
11. Build self-confidence. You gain confidence by seeing what is necessary and taking action.
12. Be a catalyst for change, and do not rely upon consensus or agreement from others.
13. Assess your relationships.
14. Learn to follow Knowledge, the deeper spiritual intelligence within you, and to recognize the Great Waves of change that are coming so that you can become informed and prepared in a timely manner.
15. Have great faith in Knowledge within yourself and within humanity as a whole. Otherwise, the Great Waves will seem overwhelming.
16. Recognize that you are entering a time of great challenge and change in the world and that this challenge and change will make you strong and will call out of you’re the greater gifts that you have been sent into the world to give.

From The Great Waves of Change (p.212~215)

 

[ResistETIntervention]

Great Waves of Change Practices:

1. Keep asking yourself, “Where should I live?”
2. Recognize the signs.
3. Where are you now in terms of your time, energy, your focus, and your interest?
4. Review everything you own and keep only those that are fundamentally practical and necessary or personally very meaningful. Then sort them out.
5. Ensure that your relationships are strengthening you and that you have a greater destiny with them.
6. Evaluate any discomfort you may have, which may be telling you what you need to know.
7. Watch for the signs in the world regarding availability of food and water, climate change, political and economic instability, outbreaks of pandemic illness, and conflicts that exist now or may emerge in the future.
8. Do what you know you must. It is by doing that you gain greater clarity.
9. Consider your assets and liabilities. Do you need to change your living circumstances radically in the face of the Great Waves of change? Some of the things will take a long time, so you may need to act quickly. If there are shortages of fuel, or if the price of everything escalates beyond what you can afford, what will you do then?
10. Escape isolation. Become involved in your local community.
11. If you live in a desert region, near moving water, coastal region, or large cities, it may be wise to move away from it.

…..

From The Great Waves of Change (p.217~232)

 

[sandandfoam]

Doomsday cults

 

[Ben Dhyan]

And how do you define science that you can make such a determination about a person you've never met?

How do you know I don't have a Ph.D. in something?

I don't; I'm taking 7 years to get through a 2 year college, and I was a C-average student in high school, but it would have been quite funny if I'd had. (I don't do well in formal academia.)

For the record, I do do science. Computer science, about 50% self-taught.

while (true){printf("/a");}

Contrary to what Hollywood thinks, someone who's a master in one field of science can be a complete novice in another field.

In short: don't tell other people what they should or shouldn't be doing with their lives, especially when your entire exposure to them has been an online forum.

Show me a .edu website, not a .com website.

What kind of city do you live in?

That might be the case in suburbia, but I once again reference Mexico City's curfew. I also reference that it's said that breathing in China is virtually impossible.

"All time"? Show me those sources. Original sources, BTW, that is, actual documents from 1000 years ago, wherein the climate changed to something completely different, and stayed that way, within the span of a few years.

'Sides, the issue isn't the normal change; it's the accelerated change that's cause for concern. Not for the planet, but for the species, or at the very least, society. I'm not worried about an apocalypse, nor am I worried about developed countries. I'm worried about third-world countries.

You show many scientists who say there's no problem, but when an equal amount, if not a greater amount, of scientists say there is a problem, that's enough for me to be concerned and do what I can to reduce my own pollution, and encourage others to do the same.

That's fine Riverwolf, I do wish you all the best with your computer science. I would advise though, that you keep an open mind on the claims of scientists, politicians, NGOs, etc., theories are one thing, reality is another. This world is not heaven and so do not expect that truth is a high priority among those whose real desire is wealth, power, or fame.

Here are some educational quotes by those who have been pushing the global warming scare...

“We may get to the point where the only way of saving the world will be for industrial civilization to collapse…isn’t it our job to bring that about” - Maurice Strong, senior advisor to Kofi Annan, U.N. Secretary-General who chaired the gigantic (40,000 participants) “U.N. Conference on Environment and Development” in Rio de Janeiro in 1992 , who was responsible for putting together the Kyoto Protocol with thousands of bureaucrats, diplomats, and politicians, stated:

“We have got to ride the global warming issue. Even if the theory of global warming is wrong, we will be doing the right thing in terms of economic policy and environmental policy.” - Timothy Wirth, U.S. Undersecretary of State for Global Issues, who seconded Strong’s statement.

“No matter if the science of global warming is all phony … climate change provides the greatest opportunity to bring about justice and equality in the world. – Christine Stewart, former Canadian Minister of the Environment

The models are convenient fictions that provide something very useful.” Dr David Frame, Climate modeler, Oxford University

“It doesn’t matter what is true, it only matters what people believe is true.” – Paul Watson, Co-founder of Greenpeace”

“Unless we announce disasters no one will listen.” – Sir John Houghton, First chairman of the IPCC

“The data doesn’t matter. We’re not basing our recommendations on the data. We’re basing them on the climate models.” Prof. Chris Folland, Hadley Centre for Climate Prediction and Research.

And here is a reference resource for you to get an idea of earth's climate over time,..note that has never been any stasis...reference-pages/global-weather-climate/paleoclimate/

 

[ResistETIntervention]

Doomsday cults

Nature is not kind to the unprepared...

 

[Knight of Albion]

Nature is not kind to the unprepared...

Nor to the disrespectful.....

 

[Kerr]

while (true){printf("/a");}

Isnt that supposed to be a "\a" ? If so you are very evil.

 

[Riverwolf]

That's fine Riverwolf, I do wish you all the best with your computer science. I would advise though, that you keep an open mind on the claims of scientists, politicians, NGOs, etc., theories are one thing, reality is another. This world is not heaven and so do not expect that truth is a high priority among those whose real desire is wealth, power, or fame.

Indeed, which is why I don't pay much heed to Al Gore himself, or politicians. It's why I am in the camp that says helping the environment is an individual's effort independent of giving money to anyone.

Here are some educational quotes by those who have been pushing the global warming scare...

Sorry, but "green-agenda.com" is not a domain name that's even remotely trustworthy. That's the domain name of propaganda.

IOW, it's as reliable on actual information about the environment as Awesome Possum Kicks Doctor Machino's Butt.

And here is a reference resource for you to get an idea of earth's climate over time,..note that has never been any stasis...reference-pages/global-weather-climate/paleoclimate/

Again, a .com website. Show me a .edu.

 

[Riverwolf]

Isnt that supposed to be a "\a" ? If so you are very evil.

I've been using C++ so much, and spending so much time in the Linux Terminal, that I forget about the \ character. ^_^

But, yes, that is quite an evil line of code. ^_^