Collateral Murder

[angellous_evangellous]

NO IT IS NOT!!

What kind of BS is that AE?
I`m hoping that`s sarcasm.

Um, no. Not sarcasm.

The overwhelming majority of Congress voted for the Iraqi War Resolution, with only 42% of Democrats in the Senate and only half of the Democrats in the House voting against it. The division of the party continued for several years, and funding could have been stinted several times, and it never was.

The Iraq war is a legacy of failure.

 

[Aquitaine]

It's a symbol of your failure to be effective in the democratic process.

I disagree. Not only that but the Democrats in Congress wanted the war too, so when both sides of the two-party system want the same thing, what the Hell are the citizens supposed to do?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Being extorted for money to finance criminal activity does not make one a criminal .

.....

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Any way you slice it, there's no excusing the massacre of the guys who came in the van to pick up the wounded man. All of them were clearly unarmed, they weren't even holding tripods or cameras.

 

[Aquitaine]

Any way you slice it, there's no excusing the massacre of the guys who came in the van to pick up the wounded man. All of them were clearly unarmed, they weren't even holding tripods or cameras.

I know yeah. Not only that but the two kids and the relatives are now gona be a Hell of a lot more sympathetic towards anti-US factions in Iraq. For every 1 Civilian you kill, you're potentially creating 10 new enemies. Which is unfortunate because then more US troops (who are there with good/neutral intentions) are then gonna get whacked in revenge. Then the cycle continues.

It's honestly time we all got out of there, NOW! What the Hell are we even doing there? We didn't even have an after-plan for Iraq.

 

[Alceste]

It is relatively easy to do.

Not when I'm ten minutes late for work. If it's so easy, you do it.

I doubt a suicide bomber gives a flying **** about the Geneva Conventions, either. They've even used retarded people. It's an unfortunate and brutal war.

So suicide bombers represent America's ethical bench mark now? If not, how is this comment relevant to the video of US soldiers begging for permission to slaughter a van full of good samaritans, cheering when they succeed, and refusing to treat the innocent children they shot at a US hospital?

For Americans to demonize people who are fighting for us I think is despicable, particularly when it is thoughtless.

They're not fighting for you. What do ordinary Americans get out of this war?

 

[301ouncer]

Once again this story is at the bottom of the news pecking order because the media wish to bury this story, or no matter how awful the behaviour of these pilots believe them to be heroes, and brave. Is firing a barrage of bullets from the air on innocent children brave? If these soldiers can't be professional, then maybe they shouldn't be out there. The way they laugh about it afterwards is sickening. They were so impatient to fire, they didn't even bother to get more information on who those people were. They didn't look to be in any danger, as they weren't being fired at, so nobody can claim they didn't have time to do checks. Typical Americans, shoot first, then ask questions later. They cannot justify this evil behaviour. I don't believe anyone when they say it's just a few bad apples; a few bad apples spread their rot to others.

 

[301ouncer]

I have watched all the video. This is state sponsored murder. A makeshift ambulance pulls up with kids in the front and thay can't wait to open fire. I am ashamed to be part of human race. Anyone trying to justify these actions is brainwashed.

 

[dust1n]

FWIW, even if that tripod was an rpg, you try hitting a moving helicopter from over a mile away. Even if they were armed, they would have been no threat.

The reason the footage is so grainy isn't because of bad technology, it's because it's on maximum zoom and the helicopter is so far away that they don't even notice it until they're getting shot at.

Not to mention, you can't walk around with your buds next to your side AND shoot off an RPG.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I have watched all the video. This is state sponsored murder. A makeshift ambulance pulls up with kids in the front and thay can't wait to open fire. I am ashamed to be part of human race. Anyone trying to justify these actions is brainwashed.

An identifying mark would have been nice.

Journalists typically wear blue shirts, and even makeshift ambulances have red crosses painted on the top...

 

[dust1n]

It's a symbol of your failure to be effective in the democratic process.

More like a symbol that you failed to be effective to accumulate enough money to purchase ad space to be considered legitimate enough to have your opinion respected; whether or not it's rational.

 

[dust1n]

Man, it's a shame Blackwater USA's actions aren't as transparent as our government is supposedly is.

 

[dust1n]

An identifying mark would have been nice.

Journalists typically wear blue shirts, and even makeshift ambulances have red crosses painted on the top...

What an absurd notion -

In an urban area of a few millions people, and .01% is some radical violent membership - it makes no sense to ever really fire into a city street considering the odds to who it is you are actually shooting.

 

[Ciscokid]

I think this video from CNN may help shed more light on the situation.

Video - Breaking News Videos from CNN.com

 

[Ciscokid]

What an absurd notion -

In an urban area of a few millions people, and .01% is some radical violent membership - it makes no sense to ever really fire into a city street considering the odds to who it is you are actually shooting.

Last time I checked they have urban conflicts over there sooooo why would it be so odd to shoot into a street? You are also wrong, the journalists are supposed to be wearing special vests which they weren't. They helped to contribute to the disaster.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I think this video from CNN may help shed more light on the situation.

Video - Breaking News Videos from CNN.com

There you go.

 

[kai]

how could you shoot when you aren't sure? is war really all about assuming?



i know it is the enemy, but what if it isn't the enemy?

they were sure.

 

[kai]

What an absurd notion -

In an urban area of a few millions people, and .01% is some radical violent membership - it makes no sense to ever really fire into a city street considering the odds to who it is you are actually shooting.

where have you been ?Baghdad in July 2007 was a very violent place, and the areas of Sadr City and New Baghdad were the home of the Mahdi Army and associated Shia terror groups. The city was a war zone. To describe the attack you see in the video as "murder" is a sensationalist gimmick that succeeded in driving tons of traffic to Wikileaks' website.

 

[Alceste]

Further to my earlier comment that the Geneva Conventions may "prohibit" urban fighting, I have now had the time to look it up (since Angellous failed to deliver ). It isn't a "prohibition", it's this:

Article 58 -- Precautions against the effects of attacks The Parties to the conflict shall, to the maximum extent feasible:

(a) without prejudice to Article 49 of the Fourth Convention, endeavour to remove the civilian population, individual civilians and civilian objects under their control from the vicinity of military objectives;

(b) avoid locating military objectives within or near densely populated areas;

(c) take the other necessary precautions to protect the civilian population, individual civilians and civilian objects under their control against the dangers resulting from military operations.

As I said earlier, the US, much like their adversaries in Iraq and Afghanistan, couldn't care less about these rules but it is nice to know they exist all the same. Gives a bit of structure to the outrage.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Alceste I thought those conventions apply to war, not necessarily insurgency? And in some ways, isn't the US obeying those conventions more closely today than any of the state actors did during WWII? French cities were carpet bombed by high altitude aircraft and artillery for example, that's not what is happening in Iraq and Afghanistan.