Conspiracy beliefs, underlying causes.

[Secret Chief]

I think the pandemic of conspiracy theories is in large part the downside of the internet / social media. In pre-internet times your local idiot remained just that - local - but now they can spread their stupidity worldwide as their delusional nonsense gets "likes" and shared.

 

[Stevicus]

Just came across this accidentally, sums up one of the main issues pretty well I think:

Philosophy & Literature on Instagram: "Stephen Fry on Today’s Method of Thinking . . . . . . . . #stephenfry #thinking #philosophy #actor"

13K likes, 221 comments - philosophyofexistence on June 17, 2024: "Stephen Fry on Today’s Method of Thinking . . . . . . . . #stephenfry #thinking #philosophy #actor".

www.instagram.com

All I got when clicking the link was a login screen for Instagram. I don't have an Instagram account.

 

[Secret Chief]

All I got when clicking the link was a login screen for Instagram. I don't have an Instagram account.

Basically it's a short clip of Stephen Fry saying about people preferring simple definite answers rather than the nuanced and complex truth of matters.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

I’m interested in thoughts on why some people are disposed towards believing ideas that lack any credible explanation.

I'd say your number 2 - limited information - and your number 4 - inability to process information - are much of the answer. Some of your other points - inability or unwillingness to recognise complexity and conviction that the belief is true regardless of any evidence to the contrary - seem to derive from these. People who have the poorest understanding of how the world works and people not trained in critical thinking are most susceptible.

These people are also often fearful, angry, or both. Low information people who feel cheated by life are prone to invent reasons for it that involves unseen, sinister powers.

Sometimes conspiracy theories come true.

Any crime or other corrupt practice planned and committed by two or more people in secret began as a conspiracy.

There a plenty of good examples from the news. Back in the 9/11 days, only the version that included American involvement was called a conspiracy theory, but the official explanation that only involved Arabs was also a conspiracy theory. Arabs secretly met and planned those airplane strikes. Two people going to Wal-Mart or Target to shoplift together are conspiring. We're surrounded by conspiracies.

But the OP is referring to outlandish ideas with little or no basis in fact.

 

[Tomef]

All I got when clicking the link was a login screen for Instagram. I don't have an Instagram account.

Yeah it seems to be embedded in some instagram reel sharing account.

 

[wellwisher]

Big topic I know, but I’m interested in thoughts on why some people are disposed towards believing ideas that lack any credible explanation.

A few factors that seem to be common are:

1) An inability or unwillingness to recognise complexity: Conspiracy believers often claim something they believe is ‘the truth’, but are unable to participate in any meaningful discussion of the details of whatever the issue is.

2) Limited information: The more sophisticated conspiracy-ists use famous quotes, vague allusions to the ideas of someone famous and so on to support their assertions. When pressed, it becomes clear these quotes and allusions are based on a skim reading of whatever the original words or ideas are in order to find something they can re-interpret and press-gang into supporting their belief. Another variation on this is studying one aspect of a given situation but ignoring all other aspects, which might otherwise lead to a more balanced or reasonable understanding.

3) Over-riding conviction that the belief is true regardless of any evidence to the contrary, or that even if the details are accepted to be incorrect the general idea is still ‘true’ in some sense.

4) An inability to process information, for example where 2 public figures are subject to accusations, the preferred public figure is believed to be the victim of nefarious plots regardless of the situation, while the disliked person is believed to be guilty of anything and everything from the word go.

5) Conflation: cases of governments lying, harming citizens in some way, cooking up bizarre plots etc are conflated into a general notion that there is some sort of overarching ‘plan’ that is behind all the problems the conspiracy-ist is experiencing or sees in the world. This allows the believer to bypass any real attempt at understanding complex realities, since available information is seen as being manipulated or otherwise unreliable.

Does anyone remember the classic conspiracy theory called the Russian Collusion scam? Trump was Putins puppet. It took a lot of coordination at the highest levels of Government, Media and Business to get half the people in the USA to buy into that conspiracy theory. This type of coordinated effort, at the highest levels is why many conspiracy theories from citizens often involve the Government, the rich and the powerful. This was not an isolated event. It took two years to debunk that disinformation conspiracy theory, before the political left had to move on. Some are have still not left, completely rather than admit being taken by people they trusted.

As another example, Area 51, was/is a secret installation for testing new technology. To hide that from the enemy, it was rumored to be a place where the Government has alien technology and even alien bodies. This story was a way to distract from what was really going on.This type of disinformation has practical use in clandestine society. If alien buffs can approach Area 51, the enemy is confused.

As another example, Hillary Clinton and President Biden both had classified document issues, that were both dismissed with the same type of excuse that nobody would even bring this to court or condemn either one. Nobody else gets that lame excuse. You need to be part of the Swamp and have connections at the top levels. Trump is not Swamp so he gets a different standard; much worse. It was not up to the FBI to make either claim of ismissal. That belongs to the DOJ and AG, who was protected from being accused of a conspiracy, by letting rank and file do the dirty work and make it go away. This is why the AG will not release the recorded meeting then the conspiracy is back on.

Another good one is although the Biden Family influence business, has set up a bunch of dummy accounts, to shuffle and hide money, Hunter owes the IRS, and nobody in the family has the level of influence of President Joe Biden, to explain the big pay checks, Joe is the only one not involved. It is conspiracy that common sense makes you a conspiracy nut case, so stop thinking.

Trump has been useful in that the top level coordinated conspiracies; from the Russian Collusion, to Impeach Trump for digging into the Biden Family Influence peddling business in Ukraine, to the laptop being Russian Disinformation, to Jan 6, being more than a riot, shows Trump is very durable to their disinformation scams. There have been too many coincidence scams, and the two face smile has stopped pretending.The Get Trump via kangaroos court trials was one swamp conspiracy too many. This is even starting to awaken Democrats who had been in under the spell of "maybe" CIA led conspiracy disinformation, for 8 years.

 

[LuisDantas]

What constantly amazes me about believers in conspiracy theories in general, is how little logical thought is necessary to debunk many of the theories. Take the idea that the moon landings never happened and were all created in Hollywood studios. You don't need any actual investigation, just consider how many people would have to be involved in creating this deception, and how unlikely it would be that none of these people had ever admitted it.

So why did people still believe it? I can only conclude that they wanted/needed to believe it very very much.

I don't have any real scientific support for this conclusion, but I think that you are correct.

People want very much to believe in it, because it is the price of admission for being part of peer group of sorts.

It is very similar to calls for patriotism, nationalism, or church belonging. Much of the point is that they are being illogical and receiving social support for that.

Many are in fact proud of that. They feel that it is a "celebration" or exercise of "freedom". An opportunity for Credibility Enhancing Displays, perhaps explained by Richard Sosa's Signal Displaying Theory.

Sort of disgusting really.

 

[Tomef]

Does anyone remember the classic conspiracy theory called the Russian Collusion scam? Trump was Putins puppet.

The big problem with that is that the version you talk about in this and other posts bears no resemblance to how that investigation was actually presented in the media. In another post, I asked you to justify your exaggerated, straw man version of it and sent you a series of links of coverage of the investigation of links between Trump’s campaign and Russian interests, going back to 2016. However, like all spreaders of pseudo-truth of your ilk you lack the integrity to get past your emotional bias and provide a reality-based analysis of your claims.

You can do it now, prove you’re something more than a hollow shill who talks a fancy talk but lacks even the most basic understanding of what integrity means. All the coverage since first mention of the investigation into Trump is available on the sites people call the ‘msm’, WAPO, the NYT etc. You can find all the articles you need to justify your presentation of what you claim were the stories they ran in minutes, and explain why you think it matches your deliberately distorted exaggeration. Go ahead, say something real.

 

[Alien826]

I think the pandemic of conspiracy theories is in large part the downside of the internet / social media. In pre-internet times your local idiot remained just that - local - but now they can spread their stupidity worldwide as their delusional nonsense gets "likes" and shared.

This makes a lot of sense. Once it was two ladies spreading gossip over the garden fence, now they can talk to thousands at once. It doesn't explain why people are so receptive to this nonsense, but it does explain the speed with which it spreads.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Conspiracy theories flourish amongst the ignorant.

They are a substitute for knowledge.

 

[Tomef]

I think the pandemic of conspiracy theories is in large part the downside of the internet / social media. In pre-internet times your local idiot remained just that - local - but now they can spread their stupidity worldwide as their delusional nonsense gets "likes" and shared.

I wonder if reading some random stuff on a site that looks kind of official-like has a kind of convincing power the idiot in the pub lacks.

 

[Alien826]

Does anyone remember the classic conspiracy theory called the Russian Collusion scam? Trump was Putins puppet. It took a lot of coordination at the highest levels of Government, Media and Business to get half the people in the USA to buy into that conspiracy theory. This type of coordinated effort, at the highest levels is why many conspiracy theories from citizens often involve the Government, the rich and the powerful. This was not an isolated event. It took two years to debunk that disinformation conspiracy theory, before the political left had to move on. Some are have still not left, completely rather than admit being taken by people they trusted.

As another example, Area 51, was/is a secret installation for testing new technology. To hide that from the enemy, it was rumored to be a place where the Government has alien technology and even alien bodies. This story was a way to distract from what was really going on.This type of disinformation has practical use in clandestine society. If alien buffs can approach Area 51, the enemy is confused.

As another example, Hillary Clinton and President Biden both had classified document issues, that were both dismissed with the same type of excuse that nobody would even bring this to court or condemn either one. Nobody else gets that lame excuse. You need to be part of the Swamp and have connections at the top levels. Trump is not Swamp so he gets a different standard; much worse. It was not up to the FBI to make either claim of ismissal. That belongs to the DOJ and AG, who was protected from being accused of a conspiracy, by letting rank and file do the dirty work and make it go away. This is why the AG will not release the recorded meeting then the conspiracy is back on.

Another good one is although the Biden Family influence business, has set up a bunch of dummy accounts, to shuffle and hide money, Hunter owes the IRS, and nobody in the family has the level of influence of President Joe Biden, to explain the big pay checks, Joe is the only one not involved. It is conspiracy that common sense makes you a conspiracy nut case, so stop thinking.

Trump has been useful in that the top level coordinated conspiracies; from the Russian Collusion, to Impeach Trump for digging into the Biden Family Influence peddling business in Ukraine, to the laptop being Russian Disinformation, to Jan 6, being more than a riot, shows Trump is very durable to their disinformation scams. There have been too many coincidence scams, and the two face smile has stopped pretending.The Get Trump via kangaroos court trials was one swamp conspiracy too many. This is even starting to awaken Democrats who had been in under the spell of "maybe" CIA led conspiracy disinformation, for 8 years.

Hey, we're missing an opportunity to question a conspiracy believer directly. Why do you believe conspiracy theories, and also, why pick one subset to believe and another to disbelieve?

 

[Secret Chief]

I wonder if reading some random stuff on a site that looks kind of official-like has a kind of convincing power the idiot in the pub lacks.

I also think as the number of likes and shares increases this can be seen as giving credence to the twaddle. "There must be something in it, they've got 28,000 followers and this post has nearly a thousand likes."

 

[dybmh]

Big topic I know, but I’m interested in thoughts on why some people are disposed towards believing ideas that lack any credible explanation.

It's a great topic. Important.

An inability or unwillingness to recognise complexity:

Yes. Agreed.

Conspiracy believers often claim something they believe is ‘the truth’, but are unable to participate in any meaningful discussion of the details of whatever the issue is.

Bam. You're describing the debates in which I am currently involved.

However, I think the underlying mechanism, the "why", they lack detail is a direct consequence of their passionate displeasure with the target of their criticism and/or their passionate love and compassion for the innocent victims. Validating their predisposition is so rewarding that they stop their investigation and research as soon as they have been given a reason to believe it. They neither require nor desire details, because they are getting what they seek without needing to do any work for it. Broad generalizations are quite rewarding on their own, but because of their passion, they don't need to go any deeper than that to be greatly rewarded. And. Broad generalizations are easy, in a way. They're easy to remember, and psychologically satisfying. The individual feels, "smart", technically, a better word is "wise". They've figured "it" out. Whatever "it" is. An accurate broad generalization describes many phenomena. The individual feels "wise". Or "in-the-know". It's "Gnostic".

Limited information:

This ^^, I disagree with. Conspiracy theorists have in some ways too much access to information. The problem as I see it? They don't have a good method for filtering all of that ... stuff.

Over-riding conviction that the belief is true regardless of any evidence to the contrary, or that even if the details are accepted to be incorrect the general idea is still ‘true’ in some sense.

Passion. Check. See my response above. I wrote a bit more about it elsewhere on the forum.

An inability to process information

Not from my point of view. They process it too quickly, if anything. I see a lot of rush to judgement and ... ok ... maybe, there's a short attention span problem. Maybe that qualifies as an "inability to process ... " kind of...

And, now that I mention it, just thinking out loud: Doesn't it make sense that these conspiracy theories are propagated on the internet, and these same individuals who fall victim to them have a short attention span?

Here's the first search result on Google.

Conflation

Good one.

ases of governments lying, harming citizens in some way, cooking up bizarre plots etc are conflated into a general notion that there is some sort of overarching ‘plan’ that is behind all the problems the conspiracy-ist is experiencing or sees in the world. This allows the believer to bypass any real attempt at understanding complex realities, since available information is seen as being manipulated or otherwise unreliable.

Ah. I thought you meant something else. Although, Yes 100%. I agree. The key words here, imo, are "general notion that there is some overarching". Please see my first paragraph. What you are describing is a specific example of what I said there. These general, over-arching discoveries, are highly psychologically satisfying ( rewarding ).

---

I will add, regarding conflation, I read that as, the reasoning of many conspiracy theorists falls into the form of: "Where there's smoke, there's fire." I call this faith based reasoning. Ultimately it's an argument from ignorance, because the individual assumes what they're seeing is smoke in the distance. That's the key to understanding this specific cognitive fault ( faulty-reasoning ). I can elaborate for you or others if requested.

Great topic. I look forward to reading the other replies.

 

[Tomef]

It's a great topic. Important.



Yes. Agreed.



Bam. You're describing the debates in which I am currently involved.

However, I think the underlying mechanism, the "why", they lack detail is a direct consequence of their passionate displeasure with the target of their criticism and/or their passionate love and compassion for the innocent victims. Validating their predisposition is so rewarding that they stop their investigation and research as soon as the been given a reason to believe it. They neither require nor desire details, because they are getting what they seek without needing to do any work for it. Broad generalizations are quite rewarding on their own, but because of their passion, they don't need to go any deeper than that to be greatly rewarded. And. Broad generalizations are easy, in a way. They're easy to remember, and psychologically satisfying. The individual feels, "smart", technically, a better word is "wise". They've figured "it" out. Whatever "it" is. An accurate broad generalization describes many phenomena. The individual feels "wise". Or "in-the-know". It's "Gnostic".



This ^^, I disagree with. Conspiracy theorists have in some ways too much access to information. The problem as I see it? They don't have a good method for filtering all of that ... stuff.



Passion. Check. See my response above. I wrote a bit more about it elsewhere on the forum.



Not from my point of view. They process it too quickly, if anything. I see a lot of rush to judgement and ... ok ... maybe, there's a short attention span problem. Maybe that qualifies as an "inability to process ... " kind of...

And, now that I mention it, just thinking out loud: Doesn't it make sense that these conspiracy theories are propagated on the internet, and these same individuals who fall victim to them have a short attention span?

Here's the first search result on Google.

View attachment 93217



Good one.



Ah. I thought you meant something else. Although, Yes 100%. I agree. The key words here, imo, are "general notion that there is some overarching". Please see my first paragraph. What you are describing is a specific example of what I said there. These general, over-arching discoveries, are highly psychologically satisfying ( rewarding ).

---

I will add, regarding conflation, I read that as, the reasoning of many conspiracy theorists falls into the form of: "Where there's smoke, there's fire." I call this faith based reasoning. Ultimately it's an argument from ignorance, because the individual assumes what they're seeing is smoke in the distance. That's the key to understanding this specific cognitive fault ( faulty-reasoning ). I can elaborate for you or others if requested.

Great topic. I look forward to reading the other replies.

Thanks, I’ll read this again, you have some great points.

 

[Secret Chief]

It's a great topic. Important.



Yes. Agreed.



Bam. You're describing the debates in which I am currently involved.

However, I think the underlying mechanism, the "why", they lack detail is a direct consequence of their passionate displeasure with the target of their criticism and/or their passionate love and compassion for the innocent victims. Validating their predisposition is so rewarding that they stop their investigation and research as soon as they have been given a reason to believe it. They neither require nor desire details, because they are getting what they seek without needing to do any work for it. Broad generalizations are quite rewarding on their own, but because of their passion, they don't need to go any deeper than that to be greatly rewarded. And. Broad generalizations are easy, in a way. They're easy to remember, and psychologically satisfying. The individual feels, "smart", technically, a better word is "wise". They've figured "it" out. Whatever "it" is. An accurate broad generalization describes many phenomena. The individual feels "wise". Or "in-the-know". It's "Gnostic".



This ^^, I disagree with. Conspiracy theorists have in some ways too much access to information. The problem as I see it? They don't have a good method for filtering all of that ... stuff.



Passion. Check. See my response above. I wrote a bit more about it elsewhere on the forum.



Not from my point of view. They process it too quickly, if anything. I see a lot of rush to judgement and ... ok ... maybe, there's a short attention span problem. Maybe that qualifies as an "inability to process ... " kind of...

And, now that I mention it, just thinking out loud: Doesn't it make sense that these conspiracy theories are propagated on the internet, and these same individuals who fall victim to them have a short attention span?

Here's the first search result on Google.

View attachment 93217



Good one.



Ah. I thought you meant something else. Although, Yes 100%. I agree. The key words here, imo, are "general notion that there is some overarching". Please see my first paragraph. What you are describing is a specific example of what I said there. These general, over-arching discoveries, are highly psychologically satisfying ( rewarding ).

---

I will add, regarding conflation, I read that as, the reasoning of many conspiracy theorists falls into the form of: "Where there's smoke, there's fire." I call this faith based reasoning. Ultimately it's an argument from ignorance, because the individual assumes what they're seeing is smoke in the distance. That's the key to understanding this specific cognitive fault ( faulty-reasoning ). I can elaborate for you or others if requested.

Great topic. I look forward to reading the other replies.

There's two books I'd recommend. (The first was recommended here on RF - by @anna ).

The Chaos Machine - The Inside Story of How Social Media Rewired Our Minds and Our World. By Max Fisher.

Stolen Focus - Why You Can't Pay Attention. By Johann Hari.

 

[anna.]

There's two books I'd recommend. (The first was recommended here on RF - by @anna ).

The Chaos Machine - The Inside Story of How Social Media Rewired Our Minds and Our World. By Max Fisher.

Stolen Focus - Why You Can't Pay Attention. By Johann Hari.

I'm so glad to see you'd recommend that book.