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Converting to Judaism
- Thread starter Leo613
- Start date
Not all racial "Jews" are religious Jews.
Leo613
Active Member
And if someone converts and then after a while stop practising are they no longer jewish?
Religiously? Obviously not. Racially? That's more difficult.
Tesla
Member
Think of Judaism as being more like a nationality for the purposes of this conversation. Let’s say that it’s like America. It won’t be a perfect analogy, but I’ll try to make the point as well as I can.
The United States passes down US citizenship to almost everyone born on the soil. They’re auto-American. Citizenship is also passed down through parentage, even if a child is born outside of the country to American parents. Additionally, foreigners can move to America and eventually become a citizen. Once that foreigner becomes a citizen, he or she is as much a citizen as anyone else is.
There may be White Americans, Black Americans, Asian Americans and Indian Americans…. But we’re all Americans. –The race factor doesn’t matter in determining who an American is. We’re all American.
When a Non-Jew converts to Judaism, he or she is taking a time to study Judaism and try the lifestyle on for size to see if they really want to convert. This process may take up to a year or two…maybe even 3 years or more. Consider that when you issue citizenship tests for new American citizen-to-be, they have been living in the country for several years and have been learning about our government and way of life. When the time comes, they should be ready to take the test, and when they do, they're 100% American, just as the Jewish convert becomes 100% Jewish.
The United States passes down US citizenship to almost everyone born on the soil. They’re auto-American. Citizenship is also passed down through parentage, even if a child is born outside of the country to American parents. Additionally, foreigners can move to America and eventually become a citizen. Once that foreigner becomes a citizen, he or she is as much a citizen as anyone else is.
There may be White Americans, Black Americans, Asian Americans and Indian Americans…. But we’re all Americans. –The race factor doesn’t matter in determining who an American is. We’re all American.
When a Non-Jew converts to Judaism, he or she is taking a time to study Judaism and try the lifestyle on for size to see if they really want to convert. This process may take up to a year or two…maybe even 3 years or more. Consider that when you issue citizenship tests for new American citizen-to-be, they have been living in the country for several years and have been learning about our government and way of life. When the time comes, they should be ready to take the test, and when they do, they're 100% American, just as the Jewish convert becomes 100% Jewish.
Leo613
Active Member
But the bible says Jews were chosen. what makes them chosen?
Flankerl
Well-Known Member
By going to a Synagogue of their choice and talking with the people there.
The word you are looking for is Ethnoreligious.
And no the western definition of "race" doesn't cover it.
Then how did Ruth convert?
No they would still be Jewish.
Leo613
Active Member
Are the Jews different in their mind and soul?
Leo613
Active Member
Race and religion
Leo613
Active Member
Race and
You can't change your skin color.
As flankerl already stated, "Jewishness" isn't a race. It's an ethnicity based on a shared religion, language, and history.
And converts to Judaism also adopt that ethnicity.
rosends
Well-Known Member
"How"? By following a process laid out by Jews. Judaism is a religion with genetic components. It is not a race. If you drop that as an element of your thinking, things will be clearer. Being Jewish does not require "both." It requires either the matrilineal connection or the halachic conversion.
You are getting confused because you think that the conversion process requires belief while the genetic aspect doesn't, so you should think that it requires EITHER belief or genetic. But even then you wonder what happens to a proper convert who chooses not to believe. You figure that if his conversion was based in belief, then by removing that belief, his conversion is null and void. For the most part, that isn't how halacha holds. Once he is converted properly, he is bound to the laws and can't simply change his mind..
You can equate it (loosely) to attaining American citizenship. If you are born in the US you are a citizen automatically even if you can't spell the word "president." If you want to become naturalized, you have to take a test made up by the American government who can judge if you pass.
Flankerl
Well-Known Member
Also its pretty much one of the oldest ideas of "community" on the planet.
Back in the days, really really back in the days people could simply join a tribe. By joining the tribe they took part in the religious ceremonies of the tribe and married in the tribe.
Tribal affiliation is so old that its really confusing for me when people don't understand it. Its not like its the new kid on the block, that's Nationalism.
Tesla
Member
Jews differ from person to person just as the rest of the human population does; but I don't think that's what you were asking.
Jews who are Jews by birth, or Jews who are naturalized Jews do not differ based on their mode of becoming Jewish. They are held equally accountable to uphold the mitzvot.
A conversion is considered to be permanent, so the convert cannot "remove" their Jewish soul just because they've changed their minds. This is the reason that Rabbis today make conversion so difficult. They do this to avoid adding sin to Israel (the body of people) from a person who is not serious about keeping the mitzvot.
Theweirdtophat
Well-Known Member
I never understood what made it a race. Nobody can become a different race. Anyone can be a Jew by converting to Judaism. It also of course depends on which branch you want unless you're a solitary Jew with your own practices.
Tomorrows_Child
Active Member
Are there not Jews who believe one can not convert to Judaism? Religiously speaking of course.
None that I've ever met.
The different movements disagree on the requirements for conversion, but they all do accept converts.
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rosends
Well-Known Member
I believe that certain Syrian communities don't accept converts. This is not to say that they have refused to accept the concept of converts but that their communities don't convert people. A convert from another community would (I believe) be accepted as Jewish if he moved in.