Core Axioms of Post modern Paganism?

[prometheuspan]

What are the core axioms of the modern pagan movement?

from what pagan religions were they derived?

How have those axioms been watered down or decayed in the west?

How accurate can our reconstructions be?

What are the main kinds or types of paganism?

How does each regard those Core Axioms?

 

[enchanted_one1975]

What's an axiom?

 

[tumbleweed41]

What's an axiom?

A proposition that is not proved or demonstrated but considered to be self-evident.
Usually used in formal logic and common in ontological arguments.

 

[prometheuspan]

anyone?

 

[Rainbow Mage]

What are the core axioms of the modern pagan movement?

from what pagan religions were they derived?

How have those axioms been watered down or decayed in the west?

How accurate can our reconstructions be?

What are the main kinds or types of paganism?

How does each regard those Core Axioms?

1) To worship the old gods and goddesses in peace, and it harm none, do as you will.

2) Egyptian, Greco-Roman, Gaelic, Celtic, Druidry, several others

3) It depends on what form of Paganism, rather it be Reconstructionist, or Neo-Pagan

4) Fairly accurate if you take time to do research. Kemetic Orthodoxy is fairly accurate reconstruct of Kemeticism. Our Nisut, Reverend Tamara L. Siuda, has degrees in Egyptology and is also a Hatian Voodoo initiate.

5) Paganism is a pretty personal path. It varies.

 

[prometheuspan]

1) To worship the old gods and goddesses in peace, and it harm none, do as you will.

yes...

2) Egyptian, Greco-Roman, Gaelic, Celtic, Druidry, several others

good list to start...

3) It depends on what form of Paganism, rather it be Reconstructionist, or Neo-Pagan

yes, specifically?

4) Fairly accurate if you take time to do research. Kemetic Orthodoxy is fairly accurate reconstruct of Kemeticism. Our Nisut, Reverend Tamara L. Siuda, has degrees in Egyptology and is also a Hatian Voodoo initiate.

I agree, but its funny how few people do that research and the shape and form of your average festival.

5) Paganism is a pretty personal path. It varies.

yes, lets explore those variations.

 

[Gentoo]

I'm confused about something... you're asking questions, but when Heretical Monist answers, you respond as if you're trying to lead us somewhere. Why not save us all a lot of energy and come out with it?

 

[Rainbow Mage]

yes...
yes, specifically?

Well from what I understand, Reconstruct tries to construct the religion back to it's most original form possible, while Neo-Pagans think it more abstract, and make all sorts of inivations for the modern age. One isn't necessarily better then the other, IMO.

I agree, but its funny how few people do that research and the shape and form of your average festival.

Like I said, it depends if you want to follow the original beliefs accurately as possible, or follow a reformed view.

yes, lets explore those variations.

Well for instance, some Pagans like myself, might have a Monist view of deity, meaning we believe the gods may be one whole, and hence giving us a commonality with the Abrahamic faiths. Then some might be Polytheist, or Pantheist. Pagans try not to be dogmatic or pushy about our views.

 

[prometheuspan]

I'm confused about something... you're asking questions, but when Heretical Monist answers, you respond as if you're trying to lead us somewhere. Why not save us all a lot of energy and come out with it?

yes. true.

Lets start at the beginning shall we?
I studied world religions and I am an aspie speed reader.

I could answer these questions myself, but that wouldn't be very interesting to me and it certainly wouldn't give me any perspective into what the people on this site know.

I will certainly give my own download and answers and information once others have had a good amount of time to respond. Probably a month or so.

You can think of it like a pop quiz or a survey question.


Aside from that, also, it would take me a very long time to answer in detail by myself, AND its likely that sooner or later people will come up with details i did not know or hadn't considered.

If this seems odd to you, then try to imagine that from my perspective most
of the threads on this forum appear to be juvenile and would be resolved instantly if both sides actually knew what they were talking about.

For instance, the question of Jesus/ Yeshua Historicity. I answered that question with the actual absolute truth of the matter. The conversation is silly for the reasons i outlined. Yet the argument continues. For me its a solved and resolved question which I have no further interest in.

The point of this digression then, is how would a person in my position challenge the forum to create threads which i would find interesting and meaningful.???

This is my first pass at that, ...i have a very steep learning curve so it probably won't be my last.

I hope that this answers your question with sincerity, honesty, and at the same time reasonable brevity.

Please feel free to ask more questions if you have them.

 

[Gentoo]

yes. true.

Lets start at the beginning shall we?
I studied world religions and I am an aspie speed reader.

I could answer these questions myself, but that wouldn't be very interesting to me and it certainly wouldn't give me any perspective into what the people on this site know.

I will certainly give my own download and answers and information once others have had a good amount of time to respond. Probably a month or so.

You can think of it like a pop quiz or a survey question.


Aside from that, also, it would take me a very long time to answer in detail by myself, AND its likely that sooner or later people will come up with details i did not know or hadn't considered.

If this seems odd to you, then try to imagine that from my perspective most
of the threads on this forum appear to be juvenile and would be resolved instantly if both sides actually knew what they were talking about.

For instance, the question of Jesus/ Yeshua Historicity. I answered that question with the actual absolute truth of the matter. The conversation is silly for the reasons i outlined. Yet the argument continues. For me its a solved and resolved question which I have no further interest in.

The point of this digression then, is how would a person in my position challenge the forum to create threads which i would find interesting and meaningful.???

This is my first pass at that, ...i have a very steep learning curve so it probably won't be my last.

I hope that this answers your question with sincerity, honesty, and at the same time reasonable brevity.

Please feel free to ask more questions if you have them.

So, what I'm reading here, is that we know nothing and you know it all and have it all figured out?

 

[prometheuspan]

Well from what I understand, Reconstruct tries to construct the religion back to it's most original form possible, while Neo-Pagans think it more abstract, and make all sorts of inivations for the modern age. One isn't necessarily better then the other, IMO.

Yes, I personally go both ways, which is that i attempt a completely thoughrough reconstruction AND THEN mix and blend however suits me.



I agree, but its funny how few people do that research and the shape and form of your average festival.

Like I said, it depends if you want to follow the original beliefs accurately as possible, or follow a reformed view.

I like to do what works to induce people optimally into altered states of consciousness.


yes, lets explore those variations.

Well for instance, some Pagans like myself, might have a Monist view of deity, meaning we believe the gods may be one whole, and hence giving us a commonality with the Abrahamic faiths. Then some might be Polytheist, or Pantheist. Pagans try not to be dogmatic or pushy about our views.

yes.

I think somebody might mention along about now...

Dianics, Eclectics, Fairy, Gardnerian, Alexandrian, Georgian, Seax Wica,
Stregheria, Wicce, C.O.G,


GENERAL DESCRIPTION OF MAJOR TRADITIONS

 

[enchanted_one1975]

So, what I'm reading here, is that we know nothing and you know it all and have it all figured out?

Oh no, not another mickiel!

 

[prometheuspan]

Oh no, not another mickiel!

I read a few of his threads and find some of the things he says to be interesting.

I'm interested in the things that people do know.

I have a lot of things figured out.

Its not meaningful to make a comparison, nor is it meaningful to attack me with an ad hominem based on predjudice against me for having knowledge.

I work very hard for people, not to be on top but to be present with them and serve them.

I think that this more than works out and that thus I warrant your respect for being respectful.

please lets discuss core axioms and how these different groups relate to them.

Thank you.

 

[Azakel]

1) To worship the old gods and goddesses in peace,and it harm none, do as you will.

This right here is a modern day thought right here, there wasn't always worshiping in peace let alone the Harm none part...that's started with Wicca and is not something you will find in Paganism if you truly look at history.

2) Egyptian, Greco-Roman, Gaelic, Celtic, Druidry, several others

This is all on the individual and is not always true. My Pagan path is my own and despite the gods is Farly new compared to the way there are in the past. There are a lot of things one can not do now a days that one could back then.

 

[prometheuspan]

yes, good point about when those axioms were added.

 

[Gentoo]

I read a few of his threads and find some of the things he says to be interesting.

I'm interested in the things that people do know.

I have a lot of things figured out.

Fantastic

Its not meaningful to make a comparison, nor is it meaningful to attack me with an ad hominem based on predjudice against me for having knowledge.

I work very hard for people, not to be on top but to be present with them and serve them.

I think that this more than works out and that thus I warrant your respect for being respectful.

please lets discuss core axioms and how these different groups relate to them.

Thank you.

To what end?

 

[Herr Heinrich]

I read a few of his threads and find some of the things he says to be interesting.

I'm interested in the things that people do know.

I have a lot of things figured out.

Its not meaningful to make a comparison, nor is it meaningful to attack me with an ad hominem based on predjudice against me for having knowledge.

I work very hard for people, not to be on top but to be present with them and serve them.

I think that this more than works out and that thus I warrant your respect for being respectful.

please lets discuss core axioms and how these different groups relate to them.

Thank you.

That is some logic:yes:. Technically he is correct that is a Fallacy of Relevance. Specifically it is a abusive ad hominem because you are attacking his character to get him to conform to your specific view point that he does not have it figured out.

edit: It could also be an Argument from Ignorance. Meaning you (Gentoo) are assuming that he does not have it figured based on the lack of evidence of other people having things figured out to the extent of which he is speaking. It is possible that he does have it figured out so further evidence is required for us to make the claim that he does or does not.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

What do you want to know about Kemetic Orthodoxy prometheus?

 

[Gentoo]

That is some logic:yes:. Technically he is correct that is a Fallacy of Relevance. Specifically it is a abusive ad hominem because you are attacking his character to get him to conform to your specific view point that he does not have it figured out.

edit: It could also be an Argument from Ignorance. Meaning you (Gentoo) are assuming that he does not have it figured based on the lack of evidence of other people having things figured out to the extent of which he is speaking. It is possible that he does have it figured out so further evidence is required for us to make the claim that he does or does not.

That wasn't what I was trying to say... I don't like "being processed", which this thread, and the others APPEAR to be doing.

 

[Herr Heinrich]

That wasn't what I was trying to say... I don't like "being processed", which this thread, and the others APPEAR to be doing.

I can understand that you don't like being processed. But you are making assumptions based off appearances which is where you are erring logically. I am just saying. I am sorry if I am offending you. He seems very knowledgeable from what I have read on his threads. So I want to see where he takes it. It is interesting. I am also writing in very broken sentences.