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Could we all be right?

TJ73

Active Member
It can be a lot to think about but suppose...
At some point we are somehow informed, we have a simultaneous revelation or epiphany that we are right. All forms of belief are correct. I think it is possible.
That we could find out that yes, the universe is full of love and hate, good and bad. The choices available can be both right and wrong.
That the different manifestations thought to be God, all are. All scripture is also true and the only thing that changes is perspective. And even atheism is correct in that everything is everything and always has been and it is OK to call God or not.
It's hard to get this out in any sensible manner, but I swear it looks right swirling around in my head.
 

kylixguru

Well-Known Member
It can be a lot to think about but suppose...
At some point we are somehow informed, we have a simultaneous revelation or epiphany that we are right. All forms of belief are correct. I think it is possible.
That we could find out that yes, the universe is full of love and hate, good and bad. The choices available can be both right and wrong.
That the different manifestations thought to be God, all are. All scripture is also true and the only thing that changes is perspective. And even atheism is correct in that everything is everything and always has been and it is OK to call God or not.
It's hard to get this out in any sensible manner, but I swear it looks right swirling around in my head.
I can sense what you are grasping for and the truth in it.
We take for granted our very own capacities in so many ways.

I believe it is a sign of true progress when a person can step into the perspective of others and see things from their point of view and be able to appreciate why they think and behave as they do, even while at the same time you disagree with them.
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
At least you're thinking.

Like I dismiss .... 'this religion better than that one....' routine.

In fact, I make no practice of religion....no dogma.

This reduces a lot of contention.

Still, heaven will likely to have standards.
Stand before angels and say 'nay' to something?.....
and would They agree?

What if Their sense of discretion is different than yours?
 
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Breathe

Hostis humani generis
I like your question. :D

I don't believe anyone is "wrong", per se - I think everyone, even atheists, can potentially reach "God" - I don't think anyone is going to be punished for not believing 'in the right things'. There's a verse from the Rigveda, which I like very much:

इन्द्रं मित्रं वरुणमग्निमाहुरथो दिव्यः स सुपर्णो गरुत्मान |
एकं सद विप्रा बहुधा वदन्त्यग्निं यमं मातरिश्वानमाहुः ||

indraṃ mitraṃ varuṇamaghnimāhuratho divyaḥ sa suparṇo gharutmān |
ekaṃ sad viprā bahudhā vadantyaghniṃ yamaṃ mātariśvānamāhuḥ ||


They call him Indra, Mitra, Varuṇa, Agni, and he is heavenly nobly-winged Garutmān.
To what is One, sages give many a title; they call it Agni, Yama, Mātariśvan​
.
- Rig Veda Book 1, Hymn 164, Verse 46. [Griffith Translation]​


I don't think anyone even has 'the whole truth'. I don't think truth is exclusive. I think all have their crumbs. :)
 

outhouse

Atheistically
It can be a lot to think about but suppose...
At some point we are somehow informed, we have a simultaneous revelation or epiphany that we are right. All forms of belief are correct. I think it is possible.
That we could find out that yes, the universe is full of love and hate, good and bad. The choices available can be both right and wrong.
That the different manifestations thought to be God, all are. All scripture is also true and the only thing that changes is perspective. And even atheism is correct in that everything is everything and always has been and it is OK to call God or not.
It's hard to get this out in any sensible manner, but I swear it looks right swirling around in my head.

well written with a beautiful idea.

because we all would wish it true, sadly does not make it so.
 

Rainbow Mage

Lib Democrat/Agnostic/Epicurean-ish/Buddhist-ish
Yes to an extent it's all true, even atheism is true. There is one reality, and it's all understandings of the one reality, limited by the limited human perception. If there is an all-knowing God, it could not fault us for having a wrong perception of truth, since our understanding is far too limited to entirely perceive it.

Even Atheism is true. Look at it this way. If striving for truth means to perceive the one reality/all mind as it is, Atheism removes a lot of the illusionary levels/maya that belief systems tack onto the one, hence making it easier for enlightenment.
 

Penumbra

Veteran Member
Premium Member
It can be a lot to think about but suppose...
At some point we are somehow informed, we have a simultaneous revelation or epiphany that we are right. All forms of belief are correct. I think it is possible.
That we could find out that yes, the universe is full of love and hate, good and bad. The choices available can be both right and wrong.
That the different manifestations thought to be God, all are. All scripture is also true and the only thing that changes is perspective. And even atheism is correct in that everything is everything and always has been and it is OK to call God or not.
It's hard to get this out in any sensible manner, but I swear it looks right swirling around in my head.
This is known as subjective or relative reality, and it is self-refuting (but makes for a worthwhile discussion, usually).

The reason this proposition is self-refuting is that if the truth is that all reality is subjective, then the objective fact regarding the universe is that everything else is subjective. So, it still is ultimately objective. Someone who correctly identifies this fact (assuming it was true) would be more accurate than someone who did not.

In other words, say both Allah and Krishna exist. Would both Muslims and Hindus be right? Well, not really. Many Muslims claim that Allah is the only god, so they would be partially wrong. Hindus may acknowledge the existence of various gods, but would reject the notion that the Qur'an is the ultimate and complete word from god. And if either of these gods exist, then atheists did not have a correct view of the world either, because they didn't believe in any gods yet all gods do exist.

And if a subset of Christians claims that only Jesus can lead to salvation, but it turns out that the Noble Eightfold Path of Buddhism can lead to salvation too, then this subset was partially incorrect.

Basically, because many religions (and non-religious philosophies) make objective claims regarding the universe, and a lot of them logically contradict, they inevitably cannot all be correct. Some will inevitably be more or less accurate than others.

It's worthwhile to note, though, that people of different perspectives could have equally correct ways of analyzing information, even though they differ. If two people have different beliefs, but both came to their beliefs due to rational reasons based on the information that was available to them (each person would have a different subset of the total available information), then each person may have been "right" for believing what they did even though they were wrong about the universe. Their methodology may have been appropriate and reasonable, yet ultimately lead to the wrong conclusion. Different people have different levels of understanding and appropriate methodology, and have different degrees of worldviews and are more skilled when it comes to acknowledging their level of certainty regarding a thing. Some have small worldviews while others are aware of and knowledgeable regarding several worldviews.
 

TJ73

Active Member
In other words, say both Allah and Krishna exist. Would both Muslims and Hindus be right? Well, not really. Many Muslims claim that Allah is the only god, so they would be partially wrong. Hindus may acknowledge the existence of various gods, but would reject the notion that the Qur'an is the ultimate and complete word from god. And if either of these gods exist, then atheists did not have a correct view of the world either, because they didn't believe in any gods yet all gods do exist.

And if a subset of Christians claims that
only Jesus can lead to salvation, but it turns out that the Noble Eightfold Path of Buddhism can lead to salvation too, then this subset was partially incorrect.

Basically, because many religions (and non-religious philosophies) make objective claims regarding the universe, and a lot of them logically contradict, they inevitably cannot all be correct. Some will inevitably be more or less accurate than others.



But they could all be right. Krishna/Allah could be the same and just a means of communicating a fundamental truth. If you believe in the salvation through Jesus, then it is the only way, unless you follow the Eightfold path which is the way. And those who do not need salvation and do not believe in afterlife just cease. May be we can all be a little wrong and all be a little right. I dunno. Just thinking.....

 

TJ73

Active Member
How about this?...

There is only one Almighty.

Anything else is wrong.
Ok. And i just feel like when "this" is all said n done what is revealed will make us all say"oh, I get it, sorry". I actually feel like some how it is all right there and very plain but we are missing it.
 

PolyHedral

Superabacus Mystic
But they could all be right. Krishna/Allah could be the same and just a means of communicating a fundamental truth.
But that is not the statement being made. Allah is generally believed to be the only God, whereas Krishna is generally believed to be one of many. Obviously, there cannot be only one and many gods simultaneously.
I actually feel like some how it is all right there and very plain but we are missing it.
Personally, I think you're right, in that the truth is incredibly plain. But we aren't missing it.
 

TJ73

Active Member
But that is not the statement being made. Allah is generally believed to be the only God, whereas Krishna is generally believed to be one of many. Obviously, there cannot be only one and many gods simultaneously.
But may be it can. We are talking about an undefinable God, so what's not possible?
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
But may be it can. We are talking about an undefinable God, so what's not possible?

How many words will it take to define 'what' God might be?

I think 'Almighty' is self explanatory.

Bigger, faster, strongest, most intelligent, and all experienced.

No one greater.
 

kylixguru

Well-Known Member
Ok. And i just feel like when "this" is all said n done what is revealed will make us all say"oh, I get it, sorry". I actually feel like some how it is all right there and very plain but we are missing it.
Yes, that day is coming. All of the contradictions we think we see are a matter of perspective and context. When you get these two critical lens to their proper focus and read God's Word in a very plain and practical sense (penetrating the metaphors) then it all snaps into a crystal clear image. It's like a stereogram. Once your focus and perspective is calibrated to the image, whammo! Then its contents become obvious.
 

TJ73

Active Member
Yes, that day is coming. All of the contradictions we think we see are a matter of perspective and context. When you get these two critical lens to their proper focus and read God's Word in a very plain and practical sense (penetrating the metaphors) then it all snaps into a crystal clear image. It's like a stereogram. Once your focus and perspective is calibrated to the image, whammo! Then its contents become obvious.
But I also get the feeling it's all very simple. Very light and easy. Like we have put a lot of weight on ourselves that was never really there, although we had to go through it. I feel like we will wake up, see the truth and after a moment of shock, all start laughing at how obvious it really was.
 

kylixguru

Well-Known Member
But I also get the feeling it's all very simple. Very light and easy. Like we have put a lot of weight on ourselves that was never really there, although we had to go through it. I feel like we will wake up, see the truth and after a moment of shock, all start laughing at how obvious it really was.
Well, unfortunately, that will only be for those who remain after the calamities that are coming. If man really wanted peace, we would be standing right where you intuitively sense we can stand. There are those who take the very plain and simple common sense issues and twist them into something that fuels an agenda that makes a mess of everything. Either that or they willfully deny the plain and simple things because they aren't fantastic enough.
 
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