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Could we all be right?

TJ73

Active Member
I'm in a mood tonight. I'm gonna just keep going "out there". When I read scriptures that say things that elude to God's desire to be acknowledged, I see it like this: The main request of God is acknowledgment and it seems to lead to salvation, or continuation. I personally see that there is a Creator a God. It may also be acceptable to acknowledge there is a greatness, or even just something more than you can readily observe. So if you acknowledge this you are invited to see more. If you don't, you're not invited.
It makes sense because if someone really wants to see more of what you have and they attempt to get it with good intentions and without arrogance it's easy to say yes.
Likewise if someone has no desire and is certain of the contrary why bother?
 

Tathagata

Freethinker
Islamic doctrine says Allah is the one true God.
If everyone is right, then Vishnu is also a true God.
But if Vishnu and all the other Gods are true, then Islamic doctrine that states Allah is the ONE true God, is automatically rendered false.

There are just so many logical contradictions that arise when it is asserted that "all religions are correct."



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Blackheart

Active Member
It can be a lot to think about but suppose...
At some point we are somehow informed, we have a simultaneous revelation or epiphany that we are right. All forms of belief are correct. I think it is possible.
That we could find out that yes, the universe is full of love and hate, good and bad. The choices available can be both right and wrong.
That the different manifestations thought to be God, all are. All scripture is also true and the only thing that changes is perspective. And even atheism is correct in that everything is everything and always has been and it is OK to call God or not.
It's hard to get this out in any sensible manner, but I swear it looks right swirling around in my head.

I agree with everything you are saying until you get to the atheist part. To be an atheist means that you cannot see anything beyond your own existance which is why they cannot see any other creator other than the physical universe which in turn created itself. Therefore it is well outside of the other beliefs you are talking about which have the validity of recognising that we are not the ultimate beings.
 

Blackheart

Active Member
Islamic doctrine says Allah is the one true God.
If everyone is right, then Vishnu is also a true God.
But if Vishnu and all the other Gods are true, then Islamic doctrine that states Allah is the ONE true God, is automatically rendered false.

There are just so many logical contradictions that arise when it is asserted that "all religions are correct."



.

Not quite. Being the one true God of the Jews/Christians and Muslims does not mean that there are no other Gods in existance.
 

kylixguru

Well-Known Member
Islamic doctrine says Allah is the one true God.
If everyone is right, then Vishnu is also a true God.
But if Vishnu and all the other Gods are true, then Islamic doctrine that states Allah is the ONE true God, is automatically rendered false.

There are just so many logical contradictions that arise when it is asserted that "all religions are correct."
Contradictions are only apparent when you don't take into consideration the context. Allah is the God of Abraham. All that He says in His Word is within the context of Abraham's posterity. It should not be taken that way by anyone else.

ADD: Of course, people can simply be wrong too.
 
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Tathagata

Freethinker
Not quite. Being the one true God of the Jews/Christians and Muslims does not mean that there are no other Gods in existance.

Being the one true God does mean that there can't be other true Gods in existence. My argument still stands.


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Penumbra

Veteran Member
Premium Member

But they could all be right. Krishna/Allah could be the same and just a means of communicating a fundamental truth.

But they say completely different things. Their fundamental truths are almost completely opposed.

In Hinduism, other gods are typically recognized as lesser deities or incomplete revelations of truth. In Islam, Allah and only Allah is god. So many aspects of their characters are completely and utterly different.

Allah wants submission, while Krishna approaches people the way they approach him. Some religions say all people live once and then are judged to a permanent afterlife, while other religions say all people reincarnate until reaching Moksha/Nirvana/etc. You can't have both. Even if it were true that some people reincarnate and some people live only one life and then are judged, it means both are partially wrong.

If you believe in the salvation through Jesus, then it is the only way, unless you follow the Eightfold path which is the way.
But that's not what I said. There are a subset of Christians that believe that Jesus is the only way to salvation. This subset does not make exception clauses for Buddhists. If the Noble Eightfold Path achieves what it says, then that subset of Christians is factually inaccurate.

Likewise, there are a subset of Buddhists that assert that there are no creator gods capable of saving you. You have to liberate yourself.

And those who do not need salvation and do not believe in afterlife just cease. May be we can all be a little wrong and all be a little right. I dunno. Just thinking.....
An atheist that doesn't believe in any gods doesn't believe in any gods. If it turns out there is a god that offers an afterlife for people that believe a certain thing, then the atheist was inaccurate.


It's a completely different thing to propose syncretism and to propose subjective reality. If the truth was that, say, whatever people believe will happen to them will indeed happen to them, then that is the objective truth, and other truths that say otherwise are partially or completely wrong.

Tolerance and acceptance are valuable traits, but should not be taken too far. Some people are simply more accurate than others.

I'm in a mood tonight. I'm gonna just keep going "out there". When I read scriptures that say things that elude to God's desire to be acknowledged, I see it like this: The main request of God is acknowledgment and it seems to lead to salvation, or continuation. I personally see that there is a Creator a God. It may also be acceptable to acknowledge there is a greatness, or even just something more than you can readily observe. So if you acknowledge this you are invited to see more. If you don't, you're not invited.
Plenty of people have at one time acknowledged only to eventually deconvert from their religion.

It makes sense because if someone really wants to see more of what you have and they attempt to get it with good intentions and without arrogance it's easy to say yes.
Likewise if someone has no desire and is certain of the contrary why bother?
Because if anything, such a thing would be due to poor communication skills by this deity and its followers.

People run around claiming all sorts of things in philosophies, extinct religions, and current religions. One can't acknowledge them all, because they contradict. I notice it as a common tactic of theists to assert that people who don't agree with them are either arrogant or uninterested, which is rather poor tact and misguided.
 

Caladan

Agnostic Pantheist
It can be a lot to think about but suppose...
At some point we are somehow informed, we have a simultaneous revelation or epiphany that we are right. All forms of belief are correct. I think it is possible.
I think that all forms of beliefs are wrong. by default. because they are mere beliefs.
beliefs about what another man has said. beliefs about what a religious leader explained to us about the scriptures. beliefs about the scriptures. beliefs about the political reality around us.
experience, on the other hand. defies all beliefs. and even then it means you only need to work on regular basis to gain more experience and perfect your distinct and chosen beliefs. and if you are good enough. usually these beliefs will be challenged the next day.
which is by far the most healthy option for any normal society. in a communal existence where everyone agrees with everyone on everything. you get a colony of blind termites, who like in nature, feed on the empty shell of dead organism or plants.
while a healthy community, would have strong individuals who not only love to argue, but have a strong urgency to do so, in order to 'get to the bottom' of the political affairs around them, and to conjure a viable political solution, or action.
this is why I usually hold to my mind the distinction that I make between ants and termites. ants would boldly travel for miles outside their colony under the uncompromising sun, and would fiercely disagree with any creature on their way. while the termites cannot withstand the sun or survive without their colony. this whole time the ant, even when travelling far in its search for food will find its way back to its colony, and not only that but would bring a prize 6 times its body weight.

If even insects. the most dominating body of species on our planet is at constant war with each other, and for millions of years engage in battles for survival. ranging from the use of chemical weapons, to slavery.
How can we even reconcile for example. the distinction between eastern men and men from the developed world. or eastern religion, and the dying patriarchy of the west?
these are different breeds of cultures, and religions. why would we eliminate them with pretending that they all say the same, while obviously they were all bred out of different geographical locations. why would we bend and reshape their philosophies against everything that reality tells us, just so we can excuse ourselves from observing and engaging the disagreements and differences between people. and perhaps God forbid. come to appreciate it on occasion. instead of trying to reconcile ourselves into an intellectual bankruptcy.
I am definitely not aspiring to conform to the political understanding of other men. especially when so many of them lack the direct experience stretching years into my own personal history and the history that my culture has with some of the most widely debated political issues and current events.
 
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Blackheart

Active Member
Meaning what, though?

But what is "image"?
And why the emphasis on "us"?

Not that I take the Bible as anything at all. Not my scripture.

My point is that it doesnt say that God said 'Let Me make man in My image'. Its plural and therefore raises the question as to who the 'we' are?
 

Breathe

Hostis humani generis
My point is that it doesnt say that God said 'Let Me make man in My image'. Its plural and therefore raises the question as to who the 'we' are?
Ah, I see.

Still doesn't hold any meaning for me though - but I get your point. :)
 

BruceDLimber

Well-Known Member
Greetings! :)

Suffice it to say the Baha'i scriptures say something similar!:

"There can be no doubt whatever that the peoples of the world, of whatever race or religion, derive their inspiration from one heavenly Source, and are the subjects of one God. The difference between the ordinances under which they abide should be attributed to the varying requirements and exigencies of the age in which they were revealed. All of them, except a few which are the outcome of human perversity, were ordained of God, and are a reflection of His Will and Purpose. Arise and, armed with the power of faith, shatter to pieces the gods of your vain imaginings, the sowers of dissension amongst you. Cleave unto that which draweth you together and uniteth you."

—(The Proclamation of Baha'u'llah, p. 114;
also Gleanings, CXI, pp. 217-8)

Best! :)

Bruce
 

PolyHedral

Superabacus Mystic
Greetings! :)

Suffice it to say the Baha'i scriptures say something similar!:

"There can be no doubt whatever that the peoples of the world, of whatever race or religion, derive their inspiration from one heavenly Source, and are the subjects of one God. The difference between the ordinances under which they abide should be attributed to the varying requirements and exigencies of the age in which they were revealed. All of them, except a few which are the outcome of human perversity, were ordained of God, and are a reflection of His Will and Purpose. Arise and, armed with the power of faith, shatter to pieces the gods of your vain imaginings, the sowers of dissension amongst you. Cleave unto that which draweth you together and uniteth you."

—(The Proclamation of Baha'u'llah, p. 114;
also Gleanings, CXI, pp. 217-8)

Best! :)

Bruce
So God is lying to at least half of the world? (After all, no one religion covers more than 50% of all people, and most religions contradict each other to varying degrees.)
 
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