Cultural Appropriation

[Audie]

Can't have "master" & "slave" cylinders anymore.
Or refer to the "black death" or "dark arts".

And whatabout "yellow fever"???

 

[Wandering Monk]

There are some people who can't wait for a reason to be offended. Why the hell do we give them any attention at all?

Virtue signalling.

 

[Revoltingest]

And whatabout "yellow fever"???

Or "Chinese fire drill".

 

[Curious George]

What I meant that Americans make delicious pizza too..

And btw...pepperoni doesn't exist in Italy...lol..it is not an Italian word

But it seems that Italians don't like to share anymore than other groups.

 

[Audie]

Or "Chinese fire drill".

NOW you've done it. I am reporting you, you blighter.

 

[Estro Felino]

But it seems that Italians don't like to share anymore than other groups.

So if some American call a bikini brand "pizza" or "spaghetti" we will care...you think...
Yes...sure

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Kim Kardashian shapewear drama: Kardashian West drops "Kimono" name from underwear line as Japan accuses her of cultural appropriation - CBS News

I know there has been a thread on this topic in the past, since it appears to be an ongoing issue which crops up from time to time. The latest example is Kim Kardashian's new line of underwear which was named "Kimono." However, after a letter from the mayor of Kyoto asking her to reconsider the name, she has decided to change the name.



Although Kardashian agreed to change the name, the Japanese sent an official from their Patent Office to discuss the situation with the US government.



To be honest, I'm not sure exactly what the complaint is here. Was the clothing line itself disrespectful to Japanese culture, or is it just the choice of the name? Are they claiming that the Japanese would lose money or that it might confuse consumers who are looking to buy an authentic Japanese kimono (yet accidentally buying one of Kardashian's kimonos instead)?

Do cultural symbols only belong to the country they come from? As a counter-example, should Japanese baseball teams or rock-and-roll bands now disband, since they embrace elements of another culture which is not their own? How far can one take this notion of "cultural appropriation"?

This is ridiculous and overkill, especially as Japan loves to push its culture on the West through anime, manga and video games. I guess they're just mad because they wouldn't be profiting from it.

 

[Curious George]

So if some American call a bikini brand "pizza" or "spaghetti" we will care...you think...
Yes...sure

No but if they made an processed american cheese called asiago plenty would.

 

[Ellen Brown]

I don't take her seriously.

I do so want one of those little chains that go from the ear lobe to the nose ring, but I got yelled at for "Cultural Appropriation". I may do it anyway, and wear it with my Bindi. AND, it could easily be said that a Hijab is the same.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

This is ridiculous and overkill, especially as Japan loves to push its culture on the West through anime, manga and video games. I guess they're just mad because they wouldn't be profiting from it.

I think it is because it involves a Kardashian. I don't think the Japanese want their culture associated with one of them

 

[Howard Is]

What a dilemma.
Genealogically, I am a Black Irish Jew.

So if I want to sing the blues in a yamulka while kissing the Blarney Stone, am I being culturally insensitive ?

 

[PureX]

I'm guessing that the problem is that what is being called and sold as "kimono" is not a kimono. And the people who invented and wear actual kimonos didn't appreciate the appropriation and misrepresentation of the name of their iconic clothing invention.

Sort of like if gay men began wearing silk "camo hunting outfits" as a fashion statement.

 

[Milton Platt]

Lets take it as far as to give the entire bible back to
the Jews.

This could get interesting (the Kardashians aside).

I can come up with a seemingly endless list of things that can go into the bucket labeled "cultural appropriations" (I promise I won't do so). We would have to jettison a significant part of the English language, for starters.
To be sure, there are some situations where it might seem crude or insensitive.....but by and large, everybody has appropriated from everybody else for millennia. Let's all just agree that cultures mix, blend and share all sorts of things and get on with life.

 

[Quintessence]

Can a "culture" claim anything? with copyrights, at least a physical being exists to make claims... but who can claim to represent a culture? And by what authority?

The irony is the very notion of copyrights is a cultural idea and a claim being made by some authority. All cultural norms - whether it's the idea of copyright or the meaning of something like a kimono - are based on social consensus. Sometimes that consensus is codified as a law, other times it is more informal than that. Either way, to exist harmoniously with your fellow persons within that culture, it behoves os to respect those cultural norms. If we don't, there are consequences enforced by various authorities. Unless you live in total isolation from other humans, you have to deal with enforcement of cultural norms in some fashion or another.

 

[Curious George]

The irony is the very notion of copyrights is a cultural idea and a claim being made by some authority. All cultural norms - whether it's the idea of copyright or the meaning of something like a kimono - are based on social consensus. Sometimes that consensus is codified as a law, other times it is more informal than that. Either way, to exist harmoniously with your fellow persons within that culture, it behoves os to respect those cultural norms. If we don't, there are consequences enforced by various authorities. Unless you live in total isolation from other humans, you have to deal with enforcement of cultural norms in some fashion or another.

What to do when that cultural norm imposes legal ramifications on others:
"We think that the names for 'Kimono' are the asset shared with all humanity who love Kimono and its culture therefore they should not be monopolized."

I find it slightly ironic that people in this thread are making "we can't say..." type comments when it is the Japanese government that is trying to keep it so we can use a word (in any font). Is it really anti cultural appropriation to say argue that you cannot prevent others from using a word?

 

[Audie]

What to do when that cultural norm imposes legal ramifications on others:
"We think that the names for 'Kimono' are the asset shared with all humanity who love Kimono and its culture therefore they should not be monopolized."

I find it slightly ironic that people in this thread are making "we can't say..." type comments when it is the Japanese government that is trying to keep it so we can use a word (in any font). Is it really anti cultural appropriation to say argue that you cannot prevent others from using a word?

Oh,I figure them Japanese are smarter than that.
The "cultural appropriation" thing is a bit of american
lunacy. They feed it back to us.

Kind of like how native americans found out that they
have this mystic relationship with nature, so they sell
that back to the white people from where it came. From.

 

[Howard Is]

Sort of like if gay men began wearing silk "camo hunting outfits" as a fashion statement.

I once airbrushed white overalls with a psychedelic camo pattern to perform a music gig in a country town. The local rednecks wanted to kill me after the show.
They were obviously culturally sensitive.
Perhaps they were gay and thought a hetero was appropriating their style.

 

[Howard Is]

Sometimes cultural appropriation is a good and noble thing.

Most people don’t realise that the black people of America owe a huge debt of appreciation to the the white British blues musicians of the 60s.

It was John Mayall and many others including the Rolling Stones who made blues a commercial product in white America.

Until then blues was almost entirely for black people. They were like the famous Irish jazz player who was ‘only in it for the money’, lol.

Jimi Hendrix’s career took off in London with the support of those good souls. Without the British Blues Invasion he may have never broken through that glass ceiling.

Those white boys ‘appropriated’ their music and as a result made it possible for black blues players to make a paying career from their music.

And then there’s the Renaissance, which was triggered by cultural appropriation of a sort. The Muslim empire brought architecture, maths and various other important ingredients to Europe, which triggered the Renaissance.

I find it ironic that people who believe in unity and one humanity want to maintain strict demarcation along cultural lines.

Cultures are not museum pieces. What exactly is the virtue of copyrighting cultural features ?

The Australian aboriginal culture used ‘dot paintings’ to make glyphs which were, among other things, maps which used different coloured dots to represent the various natural resources in their region. They were practical survival oriented tools, not ‘art’.

So in a way, the aboriginal people appropriated the white culture’s concept of art. Subsequently, white artists started appropriating the style of dot painting, which created a controversy. Galleries in Australia no longer display or sell dot paintings made by non-aboriginals. Part of the reasoning was that this so-called ‘traditional art’ was one of the few ways for aboriginal people to earn a dollar.

I guess we all need to eat a bag of concrete.

 

[PureX]

The irony is the very notion of copyrights is a cultural idea and a claim being made by some authority. All cultural norms - whether it's the idea of copyright or the meaning of something like a kimono - are based on social consensus. Sometimes that consensus is codified as a law, other times it is more informal than that. Either way, to exist harmoniously with your fellow persons within that culture, it behoves os to respect those cultural norms. If we don't, there are consequences enforced by various authorities. Unless you live in total isolation from other humans, you have to deal with enforcement of cultural norms in some fashion or another.

And what's so bad about respecting the feelings of others, anyway? When did we all become so absurdly selfish in the U.S. that the idea of respecting someone else's cultural heritage strikes us as being so outrageous?

 

[Quintessence]

And what's so bad about respecting the feelings of others, anyway? When did we all become so absurdly selfish in the U.S. that the idea of respecting someone else's cultural heritage strikes us as being so outrageous?

It seems that many of us still live in a culture where actually admitting that one has feelings, much less dealing with them in a mature and sophisticated fashion, remains taboo. We're all supposed to be sociopaths, because that sort of empathy-devoid way of living is what grants people power and profit, which are, of course, the most important things in the world. I say this tongue in cheek, but there does seem to be an undercurrent in American culture that outright encourages sociopathy. It... well, that's not how I was raised within American culture, thank gods.