Date Rape

[Fluffy]

My husband talked to a couple of police officers while I reported being raped. The officers said that nine out of ten women who come in to report a rape are obviously lying and, sadly, the judges know that so the conviction rate is dismal. The women who lie make it much more difficult to actually put the guilty behind bars, and are enabling rapists to walk free and prey again. Out of all the women I've talked to about rape, sexual assault and molestation, only one has not been through it. It is an epidemic. It is absolutely heartbreaking that most of the women who've been through it do not come forward, while most of the women who do are lying.

I know a lot of girls who claim to have been raped but where I've had sufficient enough reason to believe they were lying. I don't know if those who have had sex and then regret it could be said to be lying because it seems like a form of denial. What I mean to say is that they must have something seriously wrong with them if they are able to go through with something like that (potentially destroying another person's life) and so it seems like they might truly believe what they say. Also when people are younger, parents of girls are very quick to tell them they have been raped if they regret it.

It makes me angry that people have this sort of attitude towards rape. It must be so difficult for the law enforcement agencies to enact justice in these cases .

So generally, people seem to agree that if you voluntarily drink alcohol, have sex and then later withdraw consent, this should not be considered rape. What about when you are coerced into drinking through peer pressure or by the rapist themselves?

ok but i can definately say that i have had sex with women that i would not have had sex with had i not been drinking.and i have women friends who tell me the same.
if the women is drunk and the man is not i think that is rape if they are both drunk its not quite so clear is it. surely we have all done things we have regretted the morning after, thats why drink needs to be treated with respect.

Okay so you are saying that if a women is drunk but the man isn't it should be considered rape. Is this irregardless of whether the woman later regrets it or not? If it relies on the woman backdating a lack of consent, could a person who has been jailed for statutory rape be freed when their "victim" comes of age and backdates consent?

 

[kai]

Okay so you are saying that if a women is drunk but the man isn't it should be considered rape. Is this irregardless of whether the woman later regrets it or not? If it relies on the woman backdating a lack of consent, could a person who has been jailed for statutory rape be freed when their "victim" comes of age and backdates consent?

if the women doesnt regret it or has no problem with it then no its not rape , you have to have a victim or complaintant, statutory rape would be at the time of the offence . I think this is best answered by women maybe some have experienced the sex and drink thing regrets or not, i can only say that drink effects people in strange ways.

 

[Bishka]

if the women doesnt regret it or has no problem with it then no its not rape , you have to have a victim or complaintant, statutory rape would be at the time of the offence . I think this is best answered by women maybe some have experienced the sex and drink thing regrets or not, i can only say that drink effects people in strange ways.

If a woman doesn't have a problem with a man sticking drugs in her drink--unaware, then taking her away---drugged up and unaware, then raping her--drugged, unaware, vuleranble and unable to fight back then that's just fine?

 

[kai]

If a woman doesn't have a problem with a man sticking drugs in her drink--unaware, then taking her away---drugged up and unaware, then raping her--drugged, unaware, vuleranble and unable to fight back then that's just fine?

she would be a strange woman if she didnt have a problem with it,
and i didnt say anything like that!
and that is most certainly RAPE

 

[Fluffy]

If a woman doesn't have a problem with a man sticking drugs in her drink--unaware, then taking her away---drugged up and unaware, then raping her--drugged, unaware, vuleranble and unable to fight back then that's just fine?

I think the subject of date rape drugs hasn't come up yet. So far we have focused specifically on alcohol. The scenario that kai and others are talking about is where the women is only under the effect of drugs that she has self administered.

 

[kevmicsmi]

ok but i can definately say that i have had sex with women that i would not have had sex with had i not been drinking.and i have women friends who tell me the same.
if the women is drunk and the man is not i think that is rape if they are both drunk its not quite so clear is it. surely we have all done things we have regretted the morning after, thats why drink needs to be treated with respect.

If someone has a few beers, goes out and buys cigarettes with a credit card, regrets spending the money the next day, should we then charge the store owner with theft? According to the same logic, there is no way he could have legaly authorized a vendor to charge his card?

 

[Faint]

If someone has a few beers, goes out and buys cigarettes with a credit card, regrets spending the money the next day, should we then charge the store owner with theft? According to the same logic, there is no way he could have legaly authorized a vendor to charge his card?

Exactly! In the same scenario, it might only be considered theft as long as the store owner is sober.

There's this common misconception that people who drink don't know what they're doing. It's BS. I'd argue that the only thing you really lose is motor skills. I've been drunk plenty of times...I've been around drunk people plenty of times. I've even been around girls who thought they were drunk because they didn't know their punch was non-alcoholic. Same girls still acted drunk.

Drunkeness in my opinion is a SCAPEGOAT that people use to blame their wild behavior on. The idea that "she was drunk but he wasn't so it's rape" is stupid.


Now, here's a situation...tell me what you think:

A girl on Spring Break gets drunk for the first time, not realizing what being drunk feels like until she's at that stage. She meets a guy at a party, starts making out with him, gets turned on, and then gladly has sex with him in his hotel room. She remains conscious and active through the whole experience..asking him to do things to her that her boyfriend back home has never done. She seems to enjoy herself.
Later, once sober again, she regrets hooking up with a stranger because of the "****" factor that her friends might now label her with, and the fact that she has a boyfriend who might find out about the act. It turns out that the guy she had sex with wasn't drunk at all and in fact abstains from drinking (as his friends would attest). She tells her friends she never would have done it if she was sober.

So in your opinion is this rape? Because I don't think it is.

 

[The Giz]

First I'd like to say that though I agree to a certain extent that alcohol doesn't affect decisions as much as portrayed. However, many women do have a lower tolerance for alcohol than men. Also I think that if the woman is drunk and the man isn't it should be considered rape in almost all of the cases. Men should be able to assess the situation well enough (especially if sober) to know that sex isn't a good idea at the moment. Also I have a lot of male friends and I've heard them talk about alcohol in the terms of "panty droppers" because when girls drink their easier to have sex with. Honestly if I were a man I wouldn't touch a drunk girl with a ten foot pole. I wouldn't want to risk it.

 

[kai]

I think the subject of date rape drugs hasn't come up yet. So far we have focused specifically on alcohol. The scenario that kai and others are talking about is where the women is only under the effect of drugs that she has self administered.

thank you

 

[kai]

First I'd like to say that though I agree to a certain extent that alcohol doesn't affect decisions as much as portrayed. However, many women do have a lower tolerance for alcohol than men. Also I think that if the woman is drunk and the man isn't it should be considered rape in almost all of the cases. Men should be able to assess the situation well enough (especially if sober) to know that sex isn't a good idea at the moment. Also I have a lot of male friends and I've heard them talk about alcohol in the terms of "panty droppers" because when girls drink their easier to have sex with. Honestly if I were a man I wouldn't touch a drunk girl with a ten foot pole. I wouldn't want to risk it.

alcohol is a very powerful drug that drops your inhibitions , its a mind altering drug, some people get extrememly violent when drinking,i cant see how anyone who hasnt drunk alcohol heavily, would not agree that alcohol alters your whole perspective in decision making whilst drunk

 

[kevmicsmi]

First I'd like to say that though I agree to a certain extent that alcohol doesn't affect decisions as much as portrayed. However, many women do have a lower tolerance for alcohol than men. Also I think that if the woman is drunk and the man isn't it should be considered rape in almost all of the cases. Men should be able to assess the situation well enough (especially if sober) to know that sex isn't a good idea at the moment. Also I have a lot of male friends and I've heard them talk about alcohol in the terms of "panty droppers" because when girls drink their easier to have sex with. Honestly if I were a man I wouldn't touch a drunk girl with a ten foot pole. I wouldn't want to risk it.

Something "not being a good idea" is different from something being a jailable offense.

 

[The Giz]

alcohol is a very powerful drug that drops your inhibitions , its a mind altering drug, some people get extrememly violent when drinking,i cant see how anyone who hasnt drunk alcohol heavily, would not agree that alcohol alters your whole perspective in decision making whilst drunk

I wasn't saying that it doesn't affect your decisions. I was saying that I don't think it's as bad as people like to say it is. I don't drink very often so I have a fairly low tolerance. And Yes my inhibitions are lower, but I still know when enough is enough. I'm still alert enough to say I wouldn't normally do this and I would regret this later so don't do it. It's about drinking responsibly. Now of course I understand not everyone is going to be able to do that.

And Yes I think it should be a jailable offence for either party. You can visibly see if someone is drunk. I tend to treat drunk people like children and that's how I see it. If you're sober, you're the adult in the situation and taking advantage of a child who may not understand the consequences of their decisions. This may not be the most apt analogy, but it's the first one that came to mind.

Obviously there are going to be situations where he/she's not that drunk, he/she's lying, he/she just regrets it, but I think that that's for the courts to decide. There's no easy solution and there is a lot of grey. But I'd rather convict some rapists than let all of them go because a person thinks this isn't really rape.