define god

[confused453]

I'd like to avoid discussing the reason for god's existence, because there's already a good thread for that.

As far as I understand, a god is an elderly male person with a white beard who posses unlimited energy source, that can create a universe, and shape elements to his will. He can also create invisible living beings, whom he puts into organic robots to experience the universe, but also be a slave to his will, or else, when those living beings leave their organic robots, they'll experience burning and torture for unlimited time.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

• God moves in extremely mysterious, not to say, circuitous ways. God does not play dice with the universe; He plays an ineffable game of His own devising, which might be compared, from the perspective of any of the other players*, to being involved in an obscure and complex version of poker in a pitch-dark room, with blank cards, for infinite stakes, with a Dealer who won't tell you the rules, and who smiles all the time.
  • Footnote to above: * ie., everybody.

God is an anthropomorphized amalgam of happy feelings, apophenia, the desire for objective morality, and human ignorance.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

I use the term God in a polymorphic way, depending on whom I am discussing the concept with and the context of the discussion, the precise nature of the 'God' concept to which we are referring by use of the term God will change.

On a personal level however, I use the term to denote a minimalist conceptualisation of a possible supernatural existence - which I believe at the minimum would need to be, be the result of, or be capable of a direct contradiction of logic (as opposed to 'merely' the natural laws, though this is also a possible characteristic, I avoid its attribution on the basis of imperfect knowledge of the natural laws).

Any and all characteristics may then be temporarily unreliably attributed to that existence for the purposes of discussion or understanding of other people's God concept.

 

[Leyora]

I'd like to avoid discussing the reason for god's existence, because there's already a good thread for that.

As far as I understand, a god is an elderly male person with a white beard who posses unlimited energy source, that can create a universe, and shape elements to his will. He can also create invisible living beings, whom he puts into organic robots to experience the universe, but also be a slave to his will, or else, when those living beings leave their organic robots, they'll experience burning and torture for unlimited time.

That's Christianity's version of it, correct. You also forgot to mention that in order to correct his mistakes... (Which he is able to see his mistakes before he makes them since he's all-knowing, go figure) he can't actually undo them... but must undergo a complicated process that he makes up on the spot to appease himself because he's annoyed with himself that he created something that annoyed him, which he knew was going to happen in advance.

"God" can be defined differently to each person.

Keep in mind there's "God" -- A person titled as such, and "god" or "gods" in which that definition is different... but also applies to "God."

 

[confused453]

That's Christianity's version of it...

That's the thing, I was raised on Christianity version of things, not that I believe any of it. So I really want to see other versions, as many as possible :shout

Keep in mind there's "God" -- A person titled as such, and "god" or "gods" in which that definition is different... but also applies to "God."

oh, I always thought that it's all the same, that God is capitalized because the person has great respect for it. And god, is if you just don't care.
I'll keep it in mind now..

 

[Leyora]

That's the thing, I was raised on Christianity version of things, not that I believe any of it. So I really want to see other versions, as many as possible :shout

And now you know my curiosity and purpose of my thread I created. =P

While on the subject, I always found it interesting that God was depicted as a buffed out elderly man with a beard.

It's actually really cool... But, quite odd. Especially since seeing God as a mortal will cause you to go blind due to the sheer awesomeness that He is. (In layman's terms, it's a bit more complicated than that.) At the same time, I find it interesting that God could be depicted if this is the case.

Keep in mind this is based of a painting and the literally description from the bible that we're "made in His image." I don't believe the bible literally states his actual appearance as being a buffed out, white bearded, white haired older man with a dark complexion.

oh, I always thought that it's all the same, that God is capitalized because the person has great respect for it. And god, is if you just don't care.

Well, that's actually partially true. You capitalize God out of respect. That's why when referring to that particular god, most religious people capitalize words like "Him" and "He" and "His." Capitalization is used to classify proper nouns. In which God is, in most people's beliefs of "Him," the most proper noun there every is and was.

If referring to just a god, it would be lowercase. Unless again, it's out of respect and it's a proper noun. For example, Zeus is a god. God is not Zeus.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

Well its not hard to work out the reason for that type of appearance: He is depicted as male because that is how the bible depicts him, he is depicted as old because he is the oldest thing in existence and because he is a usually stern sometimes kind figure of authority (like the grandfather/patriarch of a family), he is given a beard because it was a common cultural norm of the people who worshipped him (he was depicted as darker of skin for the same purpose most likely, or perhaps that was the influence of sun gods) and he was depicted as buff because he was considered all-powerful (which btw would actually mean he would not develop muscles because muscle development occurs as a result of muscle fatigue - so if he WAS buff that would be out of vanity)

 

[Riverwolf]

A God becomes a God in the eyes of someone who Deified Him/Her/It. Often (though not always) this deification comes with the imposition of the observer's personal ideals upon this God.

This thing being Deified can be anything from a tangible object (example: the Sivalingam) to an abstract concept ("First Cause").

 

[Rocky S]

I'd like to avoid discussing the reason for god's existence, because there's already a good thread for that.

As far as I understand, a god is an elderly male person with a white beard ,

umm no not really

that can create a universe, and shape elements to his will.

Yeah

He can also create invisible living beings,

Umm not sure what u mean

whom he puts into organic robots to experience the universe, but also be a slave to his will,

I do not see God forcing himself on anyone,or making them a slave actually he brings freedom. Is he forcing him self on you in your life and causing you to be a robot for his will?;,I doubt it. Man is a free moral agent not robots.

or else, when those living beings leave their organic robots, they'll experience burning and torture for unlimited time

Again humans have a free moral agency. The choice is up to man to believe or not. It is called faith that is all God requires. I do not see anything bad,or evil, or complicated about that.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

God is an anthropomorphized amalgam of happy feelings, apophenia, the desire for objective morality, and human ignorance.

Exactly

 

[Leyora]

mm not sure what u mean

I'm sorry... You can see souls? Last I recall souls aren't visible.

Man is a free moral agent not robots.

Take away the soul and what is the biomatter that is "man?" It's an organic robot. Robots that exist are not humans or "man."

This is what he meant.

 

[waitasec]

umm no not really Yeah Umm not sure what u mean I do not see God forcing himself on anyone,or making them a slave actually he brings freedom. Is he forcing him self on you in your life and causing you to be a robot for his will?;,I doubt it. Man is a free moral agent not robots. Again humans have a free moral agency. The choice is up to man to believe or not. It is called faith that is all God requires. I do not see anything bad,or evil, or complicated about that.

my question to you is...why are you editing his view of god?

confused453 isn't doing that to you...

he's just giving his view....

so please for the sake of not coming off as arrogant...everyone has an opinion and yours isn't more valid than confused453's

 

[outhouse]

a compilation of different cultures mythology into a mythical charactor that evolved for thousands of years.

and every one of the abrahamic gods were different

 

[Levite]

I'd like to avoid discussing the reason for god's existence, because there's already a good thread for that.

As far as I understand, a god is an elderly male person with a white beard who posses unlimited energy source, that can create a universe, and shape elements to his will. He can also create invisible living beings, whom he puts into organic robots to experience the universe, but also be a slave to his will, or else, when those living beings leave their organic robots, they'll experience burning and torture for unlimited time.

God is neither elderly nor young. God is neither male nor female. God is not necessarily a "person" in any kind of human sense. God is eternal, beyond all gender, without physical form, paradoxical, omnipresent, omnipotent, and omniscient, utterly transcendent of space and time, and yet utterly immanent. God is wholly Other, ineffable and incomprehensible to mortal, finite creatures; and yet is not without shared characteristics. God loves, has compassion, affection, sadness, anger, perhaps many other feelings and modes of familiar thought or expression as well.

God created the universe, and designed it to produce reasoning, self-aware beings of intelligence, that He gifted with free will, to make their own choices, so that they are not, in fact, slaves to any will but their own.

I can't speak to the concept of Hell, because, as a Jew, I don't believe in Hell. Therefore, I can think of no plausible defense for the idea.

 

[confused453]

... transcendent of space and time, and yet utterly immanent.

I understand everything you're saying, which is very interesting, except for the "transcendent of space and time" part. Would it be OK if you could explain what it means? or should I create a new thread for that instead?

Thanks

 

[arthra]

I'd like to avoid discussing the reason for god's existence, because there's already a good thread for that.

As far as I understand, a god is an elderly male person with a white beard who posses unlimited energy source, that can create a universe, and shape elements to his will. He can also create invisible living beings, whom he puts into organic robots to experience the universe, but also be a slave to his will, or else, when those living beings leave their organic robots, they'll experience burning and torture for unlimited time.

In my Faith God is Unknowable and cannot be defined or limited to the imaginations of men...

To every discerning and illuminated heart it is evident that God, the unknowable Essence, the Divine Being, is immensely exalted beyond every human attribute, such as corporeal existence, ascent and descent, egress and regress. Far be it from His glory that human tongue should adequately recount His praise, or that human heart comprehend His fathomless mystery. He is, and hath ever been, veiled in the ancient eternity of His Essence, and will remain in His Reality everlastingly hidden from the sight of men. "No vision taketh in Him, but He taketh in all vision; He is the Subtile, the All-Perceiving."...

~ Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 46

 

[Leyora]

In my Faith God is Unknowable and cannot be defined or limited to the imaginations of men...

This is what the OP's main topic is flawed... because part of his question was based off of man-made imagery of God... Which depicts him as an elderly man with white/grey hair, long beard, and muscular body.

IE. http://frontpagemag.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/god-creator.jpg

 

[Levite]

I understand everything you're saying, which is very interesting, except for the "transcendent of space and time" part. Would it be OK if you could explain what it means? or should I create a new thread for that instead?

I mean that God is simultaneously and paradoxically both within and external to the universe, is both remote from the material world and also to be found within it; God is both utterly foreign to human experience and incomprehensible to us, and at the same time present in our lives and knowable.

"Transcendant of space and time" also means that God is both the source of Creation and life, but also the laws and boundaries that define the universe and life within it. He Himself is not bound by those laws and boundaries, either those of physical space or those of time, or any facet or aspect of those phenomena, or any related phenomena.

 

[confused453]

external to the universe

OK. Now I'd really like to know what is the place of external to the universe?
How is that state even possible, when the universe is all there is? I don't want to debate God. I just want to know more about that place.

 

[kerravon]

I'd like to avoid discussing the reason for god's existence, because there's already a good thread for that.

As far as I understand, a god is an elderly male person with a white beard who posses unlimited energy source, that can create a universe, and shape elements to his will. He can also create invisible living beings, whom he puts into organic robots to experience the universe, but also be a slave to his will, or else, when those living beings leave their organic robots, they'll experience burning and torture for unlimited time.

When I was still an atheist, I was debating with another atheist, who insisted that all atheists should take the stance that it is impossible to answer the question "do you believe in god" because the term "god" does not have a definition (something that can be tested via the scientific method).

I disagreed with him, and eventually came up with a definition of "intelligent entity capable of creating the laws of physics". The intelligence part could be measured with e.g. an IQ test. Demonstrating the creation of the laws of physics would not actually be provable beyond doubt, but e.g. a video showing the creation of the laws of the physics could potentially be provided as evidence for us to ponder. He wasn't able to fault this definition as "incomprehensible", but he still didn't change his stance.

Since then, I realized that there was a perfectly good model for the universe - that of a computer simulation, with God as the computer programmer (or maybe operator). Just the same as when you play a game of Pacman, except the Pacmen have artificial intelligence. You are god to them. You created (by firing up the program) their universe, and you can destroy their universe at any time (by powering down your computer). Depending on your debugging tools, you can even zap the computer memory in real time, e.g. perhaps changing Pacman's colour from yellow to red. God could well be a snotty 10 year old kid.

This provides an explanation as to where God exists (different dimension) and why you can't be sure what he looks like, but the bible verse "God made us in his own image" makes a hell of a lot of sense. ie the 10 year old kid looks like us, rather than being e.g. a giant intelligent cockroach-like creature.

I would also hazard a guess that God himself is implemented in silicon (or some equivalent), so asking what he physically looks like doesn't make a great deal of sense, since, just like Pacman, he can look like anything he or you wants. It's just a matter of rearranging a few bytes of computer code.

Computer code is extremely flexible. A better question to ask is - what sort of God and universe would you like to live in for eternity?