Deism 101

[Neo Deist]

Many people have not heard of the term "deism." Those that have are probably not familiar enough with it to explain what it is. I would like to take a moment and go over deism in depth, and shed some light as to why it is growing at a rate of 700% per year (US statistics).

Deism is a natural religion. That means that all you have to do to believe in God is to look at the world around you. God is viewed as the creator. Life as we know it did not happen by random chance. Someone, or something, designed it all. There are no deistic prophets that had revelations from God, there is no deistic bible, and no official church. It is not a religion, but rather a philosophy that individuals adhere to, much like Buddhism. Many deists consider themselves spiritual, but not religious.

Deism gained prominence during the Age of Enlightenment, a time period in Europe and the USA, between the 1600s and 1700s. Intellectuals started asking questions, looking for answers, and promoting individualism. Science, they realized, could explain many things that religion could not, or that religion contradicted scientific observations. Religious traditions went by the wayside, and scholars started looking to human understanding and reason. "Moses did not have a telescope" is a classic talking point of deism.

Deism is a very broad umbrella term by itself. There are two main subcategories of deism: classical and modern. There are other subcategories, but let's focus on these two for now.

Classical Deism
This is typically the view that God is the creator of life, the universe and nature. He made natural law, set everything in motion and then walked away, having nothing to do with humans, the earth, or the universe. He does not answer prayers, He does not interfere, and He does not perform miracles. Classical deists reject revealed religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam), holy books, and divine revelation (prophets are always alone when receiving divine revelations...no witnesses). Many of the Founding Fathers of the USA were classical deists, most notably Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin.

Modern Deism
This philosophy shares many beliefs with classical deism, but expands on some of them. God did not abandon us and walk away. He gave us free will and He does not interfere with it. That is why He does not answer prayers, perform miracles or give divine revelation. To do so means it is no longer free will. He cares about us, He watches the world and universe to see how we evolve, yet He has a "look but don't touch" approach.

Deists typically do not believe in the supernatural. There is no devil, demons, magic, boogie men, etc. There is no evil force working against us. Bad things happen because either someone chose to do something bad (murder), or nature is just following its course (tornado).

Deistic views on the afterlife will vary from person to person. Some believe that there is life after death and/or a paradise, others believe that death is the end; game over. Deists understand that the afterlife can't be proven one way or another, so they try to focus on living morally in the here and now, and "hope for happiness beyond this life" (Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason).

Prayers can be recited as a deist, however, since God does not interfere with free will, those prayers are usually "giving thanks" instead of "asking for something." Free will is not something that is limited to just you in the present. If your ancestors did something that affects you today (think genetics), God won't interfere.

From here, deism breaks down into further subcategories. Some people claim to be a Christian deist, and while that may seem like an oxymoron, when understood in context it actually works. They believe in God and that Jesus was a prophet. His messages are an example to live by, and it is to that end that they follow Him. He was a man who did die on the cross during the time of the Roman Empire. Whether or not He was the divine Son of God is a belief that is up to the individual. They still reject organized religion (denominations), and tend to view the Bible as a collection of stories that are allegorical, metaphorical, poetry or simply early literature. Others believe in pandeism (God became the universe) or panendeism (the universe is a part of God, but God is still a separate entity).

Regardless of personal beliefs, deists have no problems with science and technology. They view knowledge and wisdom to be attributes of progression. God gave us the ability to reason, and so we should.

 

[Bunyip]

Many people have not heard of the term "deism." Those that have are probably not familiar enough with it to explain what it is. I would like to take a moment and go over deism in depth, and shed some light as to why it is growing at a rate of 700% per year (US statistics).

Deism is a natural religion. That means that all you have to do to believe in God is to look at the world around you. God is viewed as the creator. Life as we know it did not happen by random chance. Someone, or something, designed it all. There are no deistic prophets that had revelations from God, there is no deistic bible, and no official church. It is not a religion, but rather a philosophy that individuals adhere to, much like Buddhism. Many deists consider themselves spiritual, but not religious.

Deism gained prominence during the Age of Enlightenment, a time period in Europe and the USA, between the 1600s and 1700s. Intellectuals started asking questions, looking for answers, and promoting individualism. Science, they realized, could explain many things that religion could not, or that religion contradicted scientific observations. Religious traditions went by the wayside, and scholars started looking to human understanding and reason. "Moses did not have a telescope" is a classic talking point of deism.

Deism is a very broad umbrella term by itself. There are two main subcategories of deism: classical and modern. There are other subcategories, but let's focus on these two for now.

Classical Deism
This is typically the view that God is the creator of life, the universe and nature. He made natural law, set everything in motion and then walked away, having nothing to do with humans, the earth, or the universe. He does not answer prayers, He does not interfere, and He does not perform miracles. Classical deists reject revealed religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam), holy books, and divine revelation (prophets are always alone when receiving divine revelations...no witnesses). Many of the Founding Fathers of the USA were classical deists, most notably Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin.

Modern Deism
This philosophy shares many beliefs with classical deism, but expands on some of them. God did not abandon us and walk away. He gave us free will and He does not interfere with it. That is why He does not answer prayers, perform miracles or give divine revelation. To do so means it is no longer free will. He cares about us, He watches the world and universe to see how we evolve, yet He has a "look but don't touch" approach.

Deists typically do not believe in the supernatural. There is no devil, demons, magic, boogie men, etc. There is no evil force working against us. Bad things happen because either someone chose to do something bad (murder), or nature is just following its course (tornado).

Deistic views on the afterlife will vary from person to person. Some believe that there is life after death and/or a paradise, others believe that death is the end; game over. Deists understand that the afterlife can't be proven one way or another, so they try to focus on living morally in the here and now, and "hope for happiness beyond this life" (Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason).

Prayers can be recited as a deist, however, since God does not interfere with free will, those prayers are usually "giving thanks" instead of "asking for something." Free will is not something that is limited to just you in the present. If your ancestors did something that affects you today (think genetics), God won't interfere.

From here, deism breaks down into further subcategories. Some people claim to be a Christian deist, and while that may seem like an oxymoron, when understood in context it actually works. They believe in God and that Jesus was a prophet. His messages are an example to live by, and it is to that end that they follow Him. He was a man who did die on the cross during the time of the Roman Empire. Whether or not He was the divine Son of God is a belief that is up to the individual. They still reject organized religion (denominations), and tend to view the Bible as a collection of stories that are allegorical, metaphorical, poetry or simply early literature. Others believe in pandeism (God became the universe) or panendeism (the universe is a part of God, but God is still a separate entity).

Regardless of personal beliefs, deists have no problems with science and technology. They view knowledge and wisdom to be attributes of progression. God gave us the ability to reason, and so we should.

Thanks for the explanation, very interesting. In what way is deism distinct from atheism (other than in terms of the descriptive labels applied to things .)

 

[Neo Deist]

Atheism: there is no god.

Deism: there is a God, but not because of revealed religions.

 

[Bunyip]

Atheism: there is no god.

Deism: there is a God, but not because of revealed religions.

But your god is not theistic, it has none of the attributes of theism and so does not seem to conflict with atheism in any meaningful sense as I can see it.

I can accept god as you describe it without seeing where it intersects with my atheism. The only differences seem to be in what labels are used to identify creation, after all atheists do not believe that life began by random chance either.

 

[Neo Deist]

But your god is not theistic, it has none of the attributes of theism and so does not seem to conflict with atheism in any meaningful sense as I can see it.

I can accept god as you describe it without seeing where it intersects with my atheism. The only differences seem to be in what labels are used to identify creation, after all atheists do not believe that life began by random chance either.

Atheists do not believe in God in any shape or form. Deists do believe in God, but not because a revealed religion says that God exists. That is a huge difference.

 

[Draupadi]

The major difference between deism and theism is that the latter is based on revealed texts, prophets, etc. Deism is more of a natural/scientific approach to belief in God. There are various types of theism like Islam, Zoroastrianism, etc. But till now there is no such classification for deism. But the common thing is belief in God.

 

[Bunyip]

The major difference between deism and theism is that the latter is based on revealed texts, prophets, etc. Deism is more of a natural/scientific approach to belief in God. There are various types of theism like Islam, Zoroastrianism, etc. But till now there is no such classification for deism. But the common thing is belief in God.

I'm not trying to reduce deism, but see nothing about the deist conception of god that troubles my atheism. Sure, there could be some force that created the universe and so on - it is just aother way of looking at it.

 

[Draupadi]

I never thought so .

 

[Bunyip]

I never thought so .

When I look up at the stars and across the bush I have a sense of wonder that I'm sure is not so radically different. The notion of god as a creative force is poetic and rational, but this is a very different critter to Yahweh.

 

[Neo Deist]

I'm not trying to reduce deism, but see nothing about the deist conception of god that troubles my atheism. Sure, there could be some force that created the universe and so on - it is just aother way of looking at it.

This thread is not about your atheism. It is about deism, in the Deism DIR.

 

[Bunyip]

This thread is not about your atheism. It is about deism, in the Deism DIR.

Yes, and my question was polite and genuine.

 

[The Hammer]

I'm not trying to reduce deism, but see nothing about the deist conception of god that troubles my atheism. Sure, there could be some force that created the universe and so on - it is just aother way of looking at it.

I would say that if you can see and agree with the concept of Deity as presented by Deism, then you are not Atheist. You are Agnostic.

Atheism = There is no conceivable/inconceivable god
Deism = There is a universal creator god, but not religiously revealed.

 

[The Hammer]

This is a wonderful explanation of deism. I held this lable for quite some time, and in a way it still kinda fits. But not completely . Like most labels nowadays.

 

[Neo Deist]

This is a wonderful explanation of deism. I held this lable for quite some time, and in a way it still kinda fits. But not completely . Like most labels nowadays.

Thanks!

The people that I have talked to that claim to be Christian, more often than not agree with most of what modern deism is about. I find it interesting that deism is not more mainstream than it is. I am guessing that is because many people have not heard of it, even though they share the same beliefs.

 

[The Hammer]

Thanks!

The people that I have talked to that claim to be Christian, more often than not agree with most of what modern deism is about. I find it interesting that deism is not more mainstream than it is. I am guessing that is because many people have not heard of it, even though they share the same beliefs.

The way I see it though, to be deist, you have to believe in non-interventionist theory, and that negates a lot of the bible. Which in turn invalidates their dogma. Tereby invalidating there religion.

I know a lot of people who cannot grasp the concept that the US was founded by Deistic Scholars. They were most certainly "puritanical christians" in their eyes. But that is a whole 'nother arguement.

 

[Neo Deist]

The way I see it though, to be deist, you have to believe in non-interventionist theory, and that negates a lot of the bible. Which in turn invalidates their dogma.

I agree. However, Christian thinking has changed quite a bit in the last 25 years. More people are becoming open to the idea of "liberal Christianity" and they are redefining their beliefs based on either reason or scientific evidence. I dare say that only the die hard fundamentalists are the ones holding to "traditional" views.

It does not matter to me what someone claims to be, or what label they choose to identify with. I try to be respectful toward all religions and beliefs. What works for me (deism) obviously does not work for others. But I absolutely love deistic concepts. They explain the tough questions I faced growing up as a Southern Baptist.

 

[columbus]

In casual conversation I identify as atheist, even though that isn't technically true. What I mean by that is I have explored many many religions and have come to the conclusion that they are all fictions invented by humans. They have nothing to do with any God or supernatural anything. The label I'm an inclined to use in a more sophisticated environment like RF is agnostic deist.

I don't believe that humans know all that much. The more we learn, the more obvious it becomes how little we know compared to how much there is to know. It is still a lot more than the folks who wrote Scripture.

But I want to believe in God, so I just do. I define God as the reason there is something instead of nothing. And I developed my own image of god, which is rather Buddhist. It makes me happier to believe in this image. That is the only reason I do. It is totally a Faith based belief, ie: I believe it not because there is any evidence, I just prefer to live in a world where it is true so I do. That's the deist part.

The agnostic part is just as important. While I believe in God, I am also sure that I don't know anywhere near enough to be correct. My beliefs about God do not reflect the reality, they reflect me and my preferences. The true reality is no more available to me and my abilities than nuclear physics is available to an ameoba. So I am agnostic.




Agnosticism is often described as the wishy-washy fence-sitting mid-point between theism and atheism. To me it is not. That is deism. I believe in God, but not religion. So I am a deist.
Agnosticism isn't about God at all. It is about humans. Humans are not capable of understanding stuff as important as God, so we don't. Might better understand with more knowledge and time, but as of now we are ignorant. We are as ignorant about God as the Bible authors were about paleontology and the internet. Agnosticism isn't about God, it is about humans and their limitations.

Tom

 

[Bunyip]

I would say that if you can see and agree with the concept of Deity as presented by Deism, then you are not Atheist. You are Agnostic.

Atheism = There is no conceivable/inconceivable god
Deism = There is a universal creator god, but not religiously revealed.

No. I am atheist in relation to theistic, personal gods. Deists identifying whatever created the universe as 'god' presents no cpnflict with atheism. Atheism is not the declaration that there are no conceivable or inconceivable gods - it is the lack of belief in a theistic god.

 

[The Hammer]

No. I am atheist in relation to theistic, personal gods. Deists identifying whatever created the universe as 'god' presents no cpnflict with atheism. Atheism is not the declaration that there are no conceivable or inconceivable gods - it is the lack of belief in a theistic god.

I disagree, but it is not up to me to label you .

 

[Neo Deist]

Agnosticism is often described as the wishy-washy fence-sitting mid-point between theism and atheism. To me it is not. That is deism.

Tom

I am not wishy-washy!