Democrats say the damnedest things.....

[Epigram]

Business types know that they generally work with others. This isn't really in dispute.
When Obama says "you didn't build that" & "somebody else made that happen", this is
entirely different from a more reasonable claim that we didn't do it alone. No, he was
dismissive with these utterly false statements. Of course, he later modified them to have
a different & more plausible meaning, but he nonetheless said something damnable.

Listen to his speech again. I can't post links to videos but I am watching one from July 16, 2012 which seems to be where you are pulling your quote from out of context and just harping on it. There is an argument to be made against what Obama is saying though but his core argument presented in that speech is pretty accurate.

Don't get it twisted though. I am not a huge Obama fan.

 

[Epigram]

Would you say these 2 guys didn't build their businesses, & that someone else made it happen?

Umm did Fat Beard Wozniak not have a hand in helping Jobs? (ERB) Gates has already said he was incredibly lucky and privileged but he definitely put in the hours. (Both of them did)

They worked hard to build their businesses but they did it with help and were extraordinarily lucky. Bill would probably not have been able to build Microsoft if he was born to a poor family in Detroit yet Steve did what he did when he was given up at birth. (And its important to note that hard work alone won't guarantee success.)

 

[Revoltingest]

Listen to his speech again. I can't post links to videos but I am watching one from July 16, 2012 which seems to be where you are pulling your quote from out of context and just harping on it. There is an argument to be made against what Obama is saying though but his core argument presented in that speech is pretty accurate.

Don't get it twisted though. I am not a huge Obama fan.

I've heard the whole speech, & I've dissected it in detail before.
He clearly made these ignorant & disparaging statements, & his fans have been
bending over backwards trying to spin them in some fashion that they can be
seen as plausible. But his biggest sin is still unaddressed by the left, ie, that
his subsequent ad hoc rescue was a straw man argument about business being
about cooperation....he argues about something which isn't in dispute.
The whole speech was an attempt to minimize the contribution of business
founders in order to justify higher taxes on them, ie, they don't deserve their
income or wealth. This is the context. But the statements are still bogus.

 

[Revoltingest]

They worked hard to build their businesses....

Not according to Obama. Someone did it for them. So he says, anyway.
And his saying this is why he's so prominently featured in a thread entitled,
"Democrats Say The Damnedest Things". Even the most tortured rationalization
cannot undamn such bone headed remarks.

 

[Epigram]

I've heard the whole speech, & I've dissected it in detail before.
He clearly made these ignorant & disparaging statements, & his fans have been
bending over backwards trying to spin them in some fashion that they can be
seen as plausible. But his biggest sin is still unaddressed by the left, ie, that
his subsequent ad hoc rescue was a straw man argument about business being
about cooperation....he argues about something which isn't in dispute.
The whole speech was an attempt to minimize the contribution of business
founders in order to justify higher taxes on them, ie, they don't deserve their
income or wealth. This is the context. But the statements are still bogus.

Ok I guess we disagree. I could take issue with other components of that speech but not with the way it is being presented by you. Honestly I could be missing what you are driving at however I don't think his whole speech or even that part of his speech was to minimize the contribution of business nor do I think despite some of my many other reservations of him being in office that he has been an opponent of small business. Obama repeats over and over like a mantra that its the nation's small business that traditionally create most of our country's new jobs.

 

[Revoltingest]

Ok I guess we disagree. I could take issue with other components of that speech but not with the way it is being presented by you. Honestly I could be missing what you are driving at however I don't think his whole speech or even that part of his speech was to minimize the contribution of business nor do I think despite some of my many other reservations of him being in office that he has been an opponent of small business. Obama repeats over and over like a mantra that its the nation's small business that traditionally create most of our country's new jobs.

Every business owner I know IRL saw Obama's speech as disparaging of us.
It grates that such power resides in a guy who never even ran a lemonade stand.

Btw, check post #596. Hillary & Dirty Penguin disagree with Obama, saying that
businesses don't create jobs after all.

 

[Epigram]

Every business owner I know IRL saw Obama's speech as disparaging of us.
It grates that such power resides in a guy who never even ran a lemonade stand.

Btw, check post #596. Hillary & Dirty Penguin disagree with Obama, saying that
businesses don't create jobs after all.

There is a bias that exists that causes people to say everyone I know feels this way... confirmation bias or something... NOT saying that is at play here just I may need to research this later.

Hilary as in Hilary Clinton? (Are they not opponents? well past opponents? I am not a fan of Hilary either... Dirty Penguin may say Small Business doesn't create the majority of jobs and maybe he is right but that has not been Obama's mantra and I have not done enough research to support either position)

IRL is in real life? (I am thinking we are around the same age, ~40s) I only shop and support small businesses and always try to avoid walmarts and their ilk yet most small business owners I know hate obama and often irrationally with a lot of emotion and talk about obama phones and other odd notions that they are working their tails off while others are not. It is an interesting argument that a single mother of three on welfare and wic is not working hard but they have clearly never been a single mother of three on welfare and wic or whatever they call these programs today. (Drastically made worse under clinton) I am not a mother but have grown up in conditions I often feel compelled to explain to others that its not the rose garden of lazy reliance on other more well off folks that people seem to make it out to be.

This honestly has little to do with Obama... IMHO There are people trying to get **** done and they are paying a great deal of money to sprinkle fake arguments for people to get distracted and up in arms about rather than pay attention to what is going on. I have no idea why you believe Obama didn't run a lemonade stand or some suitable equivalent or why that would really matter to you. That speech was not made to be disparaging but it was sold as such and some people bought it hook, line and sinker despite what he was actually trying to say. (Poorly, Again he was copy catting EW who said it better to begin with)

 

[Revoltingest]

IRL is in real life? (I am thinking we are around the same age, ~40s)

I'm 61, & have been in business for most of that time (engineering design services,
real estate brokerage, management services, landlording, antique machinery).

This honestly has little to do with Obama...

In the context of the thread, it sure does...along with other
Democrats who say something worth noting as damnedable.

IMHO There are people trying to get **** done and they are paying a great deal of money to sprinkle fake arguments for people to get distracted and up in arms about rather than pay attention to what is going on. I have no idea why you believe Obama didn't run a lemonade stand or some suitable equivalent or why that would really matter to you.

Obama's pre-prez record is one with no executive or business experience.
His woeful lack threof is not important per se, but it offers insight into his
stunningly bogus remarks about business.

That speech was not made to be disparaging but it was sold as such and some people bought it hook, line and sinker despite what he was actually trying to say. (Poorly, Again he was copy catting EW who said it better to begin with)

No matter how it's rationalized, he said what he said. What it means on the surface
is pretty clear, despite strident & desperate denials by his apologists. But the
subtext is....well....you & I will disagree.

 

[Epigram]

I'm 61, & have been in business for most of that time (engineering design services,
real estate brokerage, management services, landlording, antique machinery).

In the context of the thread, it sure does...along with other
Democrats who say something worth noting as damnedable.


Obama's pre-prez record is one with no executive or business experience.
His woeful lack threof is not important per se, but it offers insight into his
stunningly bogus remarks about business.


No matter how it's rationalized, he said what he said. What it means on the surface
is pretty clear, despite strident & desperate denials by his apologists. But the
subtext is....well....you & I will disagree.

Why? It happens. I have seen two really religious people argue and end not only their friendship but their family interactions for the rest of their lives over simple disagreement with the interpretation of a scripture. (Confirmation bias) But I did think there is a better way. You are not going to be able to convince people to change their beliefs whether you employ the Socratic method or make really convincing arguments or just state the facts as you see them. (Which still may not be factual exasperating the problem)

I am not an Obama Apologist but I am trying to explain a marketing exercise that was ultimately unsuccessful as Mitt didn't end up winning but was successful on other levels. I don't want to disparage your views in anyway and as I mentioned I am not a fan of Obama and still he has seemingly helped small businesses and constantly touts them as the number one job creator which seems at odds with your opinion. (I referenced it as his mantra earlier and I cant post video links but if you youtube search Obama small business you will see a metric ton of videos of him praising small businesses and mom and pop shops)

 

[Revoltingest]

Why? It happens. I have seen two really religious people argue and end not only their friendship but their family interactions for the rest of their lives over simple disagreement with the interpretation of a scripture. (Confirmation bias) But I did think there is a better way. You are not going to be able to convince people to change their beliefs whether you employ the Socratic method or make really convincing arguments or just state the facts as you see them. (Which still may not be factual exasperating the problem)

I don't expect to change anyone's beliefs in this thread.
It's about fun with partisan quotes.

I am not an Obama Apologist but I am trying to explain a marketing exercise that was ultimately unsuccessful as Mitt didn't end up winning but was successful on other levels. I don't want to disparage your views in anyway and as I mentioned I am not a fan of Obama and still he has seemingly helped small businesses and constantly touts them as the number one job creator which seems at odds with your opinion. (I referenced it as his mantra earlier and I cant post video links but if you youtube search Obama small business you will see a metric ton of videos of him praising small businesses and mom and pop shops)

I don't see Obama as so helpful to small business....he talks the talk,
but won't walk the walk. He's more of a big business crony capitalist.

 

[Epigram]

I don't expect to change anyone's beliefs in this thread.
It's about fun with partisan quotes.


I don't see Obama as so helpful to small business....he talks the talk,
but won't walk the walk. He's more of a big business crony capitalist.

Most politicians are going to be big business crony capitalists why focus on Obama. (Side note he seems to be walking the walk but not talking the talk as far as I am following your argument)

To try and drastically change the subject I would say check out move to amend, wolf pac and mayday and forget about supporting the democrats or republicans who have long since outlived their usefulness.

Watch Sarah Palins 2012 CPAC speech and then rationally try to think if she offers anything Obama is not offering. (I am suggesting this as she really gets inside the head of her audience and taps into their emotional hatred but at the end of the day if we elected her and Mccain they are still just all crony capitalists cowtailing their message to play on mass emotions in order to get elected... currently her message is not a majority view but its pretty close) What does it matter if everyone you vote for doesn't care about the people they rule over. (George Carlin's speech they don't care about you)

 

[Revoltingest]

Most politicians are going to be big business crony capitalists why focus on Obama.

Why not focus upon him?
Given that the thread is about Dems, & he is top dog in
their party, I'd say this focus is entirely appropriate.

(Side note he seems to be walking the walk but not talking the talk as far as I am following your argument)

He's been bad for the real estate business.
How has he helped small business?
What business are you in?

To try and drastically change the subject I would say check out move to amend, wolf pac and mayday and forget about supporting the democrats or republicans who have long since outlived their usefulness.
Watch Sarah Palins 2012 CPAC speech and then rationally try to think if she offers anything Obama is not offering. (I am suggesting this as she really gets inside the head of her audience and taps into their emotional hatred but at the end of the day if we elected her and Mccain they are still just all crony capitalists cowtailing their message to play on mass emotions in order to get elected... currently her message is not a majority view but its pretty close) What does it matter if everyone you vote for doesn't care about the people they rule over. (George Carlin's speech they don't care about you)

Just so you know....I'm a Libertarian, & I don't like the Republicans' agenda either.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Listen to his speech again. I can't post links to videos but I am watching one from July 16, 2012 which seems to be where you are pulling your quote from out of context and just harping on it. There is an argument to be made against what Obama is saying though but his core argument presented in that speech is pretty accurate.

Don't get it twisted though. I am not a huge Obama fan.

I'll do it for you since you can't...Here's his whole speech and not the one liners republicans and the like use to demonize what he said.....

‘You Didn’t Build That,’ Uncut and Unedited

There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me — because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)

If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.


The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together. There are some things, just like fighting fires, we don’t do on our own. I mean, imagine if everybody had their own fire service. That would be a hard way to organize fighting fires.
So we say to ourselves, ever since the founding of this country, you know what, there are some things we do better together. That’s how we funded the GI Bill. That’s how we created the middle class. That’s how we built the Golden Gate Bridge or the Hoover Dam. That’s how we invented the Internet. That’s how we sent a man to the moon. We rise or fall together as one nation and as one people, and that’s the reason I’m running for President — because I still believe in that idea. You’re not on your own, we’re in this together.

The fact check article goes on to say....

In fact, Romney himself during a July 17 speech in Pennsylvania provided a more complete account of what the president actually said. Romney acknowledged “you really couldn’t have a business if you didn’t have those things” as described by Obama, including teachers and firefighters.

He said this, “If you’ve got a business, you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.” That somebody else is government, in his view. He goes on to describe the people who deserve the credit for building this business. And, of course, he describes people who we care very deeply about, who make a difference in our lives: our school teachers, firefighters, people who build roads. We need those things. We value school teachers, firefighters, people who build roads. You really couldn’t have a business if you didn’t have those things. But, you know, we pay for those things. Alright? The taxpayers pay for government. It’s not like government just provides those to all of us and we say, “Oh, thank you government for doing those things.” No, in fact, we pay for them and we benefit from them and we appreciate the work that they do and the sacrifices that are done by people who work in government. But they did not build this business.

 

[Revoltingest]

Vincent Sheheen accidentally said the word ‘whore.’ And Ann Romney is not happy about it. - The Washington Post

You probably haven't heard much about South Carolina Democratic gubernatorial candidate
Vincent Sheheen of late for one simple reason: He has virtually no shot of unseating incumbent Gov.
Nikki Haley. But now Sheheen has become a headache for Democrats nationally after calling Haley
a "whore" on the stump.
During an appearance in Florence, Shaheen said, "we are going to escort whore out the door," and
then corrects himself. If you watch the video, it was clearly a slip of the tongue. He obviously meant
to say "her." Yet his almost gleeful interactions with the crowd after the gaffe were not an accident.
He later apologized, but, in the moment, Sheheen made no attempt to correct course and, in fact,
laughed at his gaffe.

Freudian slip perchance?
Now, let the apologetics & spin begin!

 

[4consideration]

Vincent Sheheen accidentally said the word ‘whore.’ And Ann Romney is not happy about it. - The Washington Post
Freudian slip perchance?

No. It's pretty obvious to me he thought it was clever.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Vincent Sheheen accidentally said the word ‘whore.’ And Ann Romney is not happy about it. - The Washington Post
Freudian slip perchance?
Now, let the apologetics & spin begin!

While Haley needs to go there's no excuse for him calling her that. He needs to drop out of the race......

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Vincent Sheheen accidentally said the word ‘whore.’ And Ann Romney is not happy about it. - The Washington Post
Freudian slip perchance?
Now, let the apologetics & spin begin!

Well, maybe he's trying to be more like Italy's former Prime Minister?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lgar-Angela-Merkel-insult-caught-wiretap.html

The Italian prime minister, 74, is accused of insulting his fellow European leader during a conversation with a newspaper editor.
It has been suggested that, in a phone call in early July, Mr Berlusconi referred to 57-year-old Mrs Merkel (Germany's PM) as ‘an un****able fat ****’.

 

[Revoltingest]

Charles Rangel (D-NY) is off my Xmas party list.....
Charlie Rangel: Some Republicans 'Believe That Slavery Isn't Over' - Business Insider

"We have to win. We have to be able to send a national message with Andrew Cuomo. And the thing is: Everything we believe in — everything we believe in — they hate. They don't disagree — they hate! They think if you didn't come from Europe 30 years ago, you didn't even make it. Some of them believe that slavery isn't over and they and think they won the Civil War!"

When a guy repeatedly shouts about "hate", it begins to appear that he's perpetrating some of it himself. Anyway, if I recall my history correctly, twas his party that supported slavery when the Republicans fought it.

But there's more irony to his claim....
CNN.com - Rangel introduces bill to reinstate draft - Jan. 8, 2003

...Charles Rangel introduced a bill in Congress Tuesday to reinstate the military draft....

The military draft is not authorized by the Constitution, which prohibits involuntary servitude....since the draft is involuntary, & certainly looks like servitude. It's the "time share" approach to slavery.

"Those who love this country have a patriotic obligation to defend this country,"

Of course, the obligation extends only to healthy hetero males with low draft lottery numbers & no useful political connections or religious affiliations.

 

[esmith]

Seems that the left has decided to take one of Ayn Rand's characters and change the name. Instead of "Who is John Galt?" it is now "Who is John Gruber?". Of course in the Democrats case they are running scared from their once idolized go to guy to bamboozle the American public.
Democrats’ attempts to get away from Jonathan Gruber, translated - The Washington Post
I guess the Democrats really do think the American public is stupid if they think the American public will accept these lame statements.
The American public is starting to maybe wise up to the cover-ups and lies perpetrated by this administration and those media outlets that enabled it.
Presidential Approval Ratings -- Barack Obama | Gallup Historical Data & Trends
Gallup: 'New numerical low' for Obamacare - Lucy McCalmont - POLITICO

 

[Adramelek]

"Damn these stupid Americans, damn them all to hell!"