Desire and pleasure

[SalixIncendium]

I don't see why sex can't be part of one's spirituality.

Okay...step away from the Wicca...

 

[SalixIncendium]

I have no idea what "fleshly desires" are...

You like steak, right?

 

[SalixIncendium]

Right. It does end up in a weird contradictory loop, though: is the desire not to be a slave to your desires then a desire you need to be "freed" from?

No. Yearning for spiritual improvement is not considered a worldly desire.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Desire and seek pleasure from healthy things like...watching tv...

*blinks*

 

[Trailblazer]

Desire and pleasure are major obstacles in my spiritual path.

A life where one seeks to satisfy their fleshly desires is a destructive one. However, it is tempting and feels good at the moment.

Sex was once very important to me, but after I read what Baha'u'llah wrote about it I realized that it was coming in between me and God, so I decided to give it up, since I have enough trouble being close to God as it is! Of course the passage below could apply to more than just sex, but let's get real. I don't think Baha'u'llah was referring to food and drink because we have to eat and drink whereas nobody has to have sex, except for procreation. One thing that so attracts me to the Baha'i Faith is its very high standards of sexual behavior. I was always this way even before I became a Baha'i.

"It behoveth the people of Bahá to die to the world and all that is therein, to be so detached from all earthly things that the inmates of Paradise may inhale from their garment the sweet smelling savor of sanctity, that all the peoples of the earth may recognize in their faces the brightness of the All-Merciful, and that through them may be spread abroad the signs and tokens of God, the Almighty, the All-Wise. 101 They that have tarnished the fair name of the Cause of God, by following the things of the flesh—these are in palpable error!"
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 100-101

Sex activity
The happiness is fleeting
then it is over

Yeah, I finally figured that out, after I dropped the addiction.

Are you above desire, at this stage of your life? Is pleasure a detriment to you? My need for pleasure is.

Ultimate satisfaction comes from morality and spirituality, yes? I know this from personal experience.

I was above it about 25 years ago, but we are all very different in this regard. I was never so happy as to be rid of that desire.
I believe that ultimate satisfaction comes from being close to God, and I am still working in that.

 

[Trailblazer]

But there is also a cost to the avoidance of pleasure. And it can be severe.

So what is the cost?

 

[Trailblazer]

I have no idea what "fleshly desires" are and how they might be different from just "desires."

You never read the Bible?

John 3:5-7 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

1 John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

 

[SalixIncendium]

I personally don't have an issue with sex, but don't leave me in the room with a good lookin' cake...

 

[Trailblazer]

You like steak, right?

No, I prefer a good hamburger with fries, but I get your point.

 

[Exaltist Ethan]

I don't see why sex can't be part of one's spirituality.

Though obsession with sex can be bad for one's spirit.. Obsession with anything can be.

Sex is a part of being human. It's a part of nature. Restraining yourself from a part of nature that is healthy for you is silly. Sure, sometimes sex can be wrong, if it's rape or you're cheating on someone, but to me restraining yourself from something like that is making you less divine and less connected to God, not more. I completely agree with @JustGeorge 's comment.

 

[an anarchist]

Right. It does end up in a weird contradictory loop, though: is the desire not to be a slave to your desires then a desire you need to be "freed" from?

No. Yearning for spiritual improvement is not considered a worldly desire.

I wonder...

If one wants to be enlightened, perhaps they are unable to be enlightened.

"Wei wu wei" is the chinese concept of inaction. To do without doing. It seemed like an oxymoron to me at first. To understand inaction causes a paradigm shift in one's view.

perhaps the true sage wants without wanting. Desires without desiring. He doesn't desire to be enlightened, because he is enlightened.

 

[Trailblazer]

*blinks*

It all depends upon what you are watching on TV. I like nature shows with animals and programs with nice scenery.

 

[Trailblazer]

Sex is a part of being human. It's a part of nature. Restraining yourself from a part of nature that is healthy for you is silly.

That might be true if you have a desire for sex, but if you have no desire for sex I see no reason to try to drum it up.
A person can be perfectly healthy with or without sex.

Sure, sometimes sex can be wrong, if it's rape or you're cheating on someone, but to me restraining yourself from something like that is making you less divine and less connected to God, not more. I completely agree with @JustGeorge 's comment.

I don't see how sex makes anyone more connected to God. Sex is a physical activity that is engaged in for physical pleasure.
Sex has nothng to do with spirituality. That is my biased personal opinion, FWIW.

 

[Exaltist Ethan]

That might be true if you have a desire for sex, but if you have no desire for sex I sex not reason to try to drum it up.
A person can be perfectly healthy with or without sex.

Unless they are inclined enough to have sex but bottle it up instead. Most people do view sex as a need most people have. Being as old as you are, you probably don't need sex anymore, but could you imagine never having sex with your late husband? Unnecessary restraint of a bodily function is not healthy when the occasional urge happens. But as @JustGeorge says, obsession is the unhealthy part. And some people become obsessed with sex when they don't get it for awhile.

I don't see how sex makes anyone more connected to God. Sex is a physical activity that is engaged in for physical pleasure.
Sex has nothng to do with spirituality. That is my biased personal opinion, FWIW.

I'm a pantheist. For pantheists, the physical and the spiritual are undoubtedly one and the same.

 

[an anarchist]

to me restraining yourself from something like that is making you less divine and less connected to God

I don't see how sex makes anyone more connected to God. Sex is a physical activity that is engaged in for physical pleasure.
Sex has nothng to do with spirituality. That is my biased personal opinion

I think this is an interesting topic. I don't have this in the debate section, perhaps I should start a thread there.

We exist because of sex. Every person is a direct product of sexual intercourse. We are sure of this. We are not sure there is a god. Yet we say god created us. Sex is god?

 

[Exaltist Ethan]

I think this is an interesting topic. I don't have this in the debate section, perhaps I should start a thread there.

We exist because of sex. Every person is a direct product of sexual intercourse. We are sure of this. We are not sure there is a god. Yet we say god created us. Sex is god?

No, sex is NOT God. Sex is a very tiny byproduct of biologically bisexual animals. It's only there to preserve the species and make sure there's enough DNA alterations so if, say, there's a massive virus killing lots of people, there's still some of the population that eventually becomes immune to the viral defect. It's only a small part of our biology and should be viewed the same as urinating, defecating, etc.

In other words: there's more to life than sex and procreation.

 

[Trailblazer]

Unless they are inclined enough to have sex but bottle it up instead. Most people do view sex as a need most people have.

I see it more as a want than a need. We need food, water, air and sleep, but nobody actually needs sex, unless they want to have children.
I know I am not the norm, but I lived fine without it till I got married at age 32.

Being as old as you are, you probably don't need sex anymore, but could you imagine never having sex with your late husband? Unnecessary restraint of a bodily function is not healthy when the occasional urge happens. But as @JustGeorge says, obsession is the unhealthy part. And some people become obsessed with sex when they don't get it for awhile.

I never needed sex but I wanted sex when I first got married and for a long time after that, until I went through menopause. Then around the same time I realized that it had become too important in my life. I was probably obsessed with sex since I waited so long to have it.

Many women continue having sex after menopause well into their 60s, 70s and 80s, but I lost interest a long time ago when I realized there were better things to do with my time and energy, and when I realized sex was coming in between me and God. I don't have to worry about that anymore unless I get married again, but I will cross that bridge if and when I come to it.

I'm a pantheist. For pantheists, the physical and the spiritual are undoubtedly one and the same.

You are not the only one who believes that. There are many men who conflate sexuality with spirituality, like on the Spiritual Singles dating site.
I joke around that they should call it Sexual Singles.

 

[Trailblazer]

I think this is an interesting topic. I don't have this in the debate section, perhaps I should start a thread there.

We exist because of sex. Every person is a direct product of sexual intercourse. We are sure of this. We are not sure there is a god. Yet we say god created us. Sex is god?

Sure we exist because a man and a woman had sex but most sex that people have is recreational sex. We all know that.
The purpose of sex is for procreation, so the species would not die out, but that does not mean people cannot have sex for pleasure. The only thing I wish is that they would come clean and admit that is the reason they are having sex, instead of saying sex is spiritual. Just because some people might feel spiritual during sex that does not mean sex is spiritual in the sense that it brings them closer to God. I go by the scriptures, not my own whims.

No, sex is not God, but some people worship it as if it is God.

 

[Trailblazer]

It's only a small part of our biology and should be viewed the same as urinating, defecating, etc.

In other words: there's more to life than sex and procreation.

*WINNER*

 

[Twilight Hue]

In the Dhammapada the Buddha says -
"Just like rain breaks through the roof of a poorly thatched house, lust breaks through the non vigilant mind.
Just like rain does not break through the roof of a skillfully thatched house, lust does not break through the vigilant mind."

I must build up my temple. I must be spiritually active. If I am spiritually lazy, I will not have the power to control my impulses. If I am not being spiritually minded, I can convince myself that there is nothing wrong with unrestrained sexual behavior, and go at it. I must look out for it, and be honest with myself about the results of my actions.

I suppose one can channel their sexual energy into a committed relationship. That is a method I'm trying/tried. But being in a relationship where sex is available isn't a proper solution. Because what happens then when my interests starts to wane? If I am simply relying on a partner to satiate me, I don't think it'll do. I must solve the issue from within. Being in a relationship is helping me, on this front, though. In order to achieve honor, I cannot sleep around while dating. And sometimes that matters to me. But sometimes it doesn't.

Get some toys.

All the fun and release , none of the guilt.