did jesus exist?

[outhouse]

The very statement "he was a rabbi" refers to a role or position that didn't exist in Jesus' day.

ok ill buy that

the context i used was simply a traveling jewish teacher explaining a new movement about gods kingdom

 

[dogsgod]

The peanut gallery, no forum should be without one.

 

[Oberon]

It would be tough to exist in Jesus' day since there was no day that Jesus existed.

Still waiting for your analysis of Paul's use of kurios and why it matters.

When looking at history (according to the mythicists here) it is important to use the following methods:

1) Assume your conclusion from the beginning. Paul couldn't be talking about Jesus' brother because we assumed Jesus didn't exist. This allows us to create wild speculations about some title/

2) In order to write off the evidence, don't bother to use historical methods. Rather, talk about terms used in entirely different fields with different purposes, like the court system.

3) Ignore the consensus or scholarly arguments when you don't like them, such as the virtual unanimity on the historical Jesus, but DO use them when you do like them, as when talking about Q or markan priority. It's only jumping on the bandwagon when the other guy does it.

4) Make claims about the constructions, syntax, and pragmatics of a language you can't read, like Paul's reference to Jesus' brother.

5) when a text is inconvenient for your theory, such as the Josephan reference to James, Jesus' brother, it should be ignored simply because you don't like it.

6) The best sources are online, or books for the public written mainly by amateurs. The experts are all fooling themselves.

7) When you can't address an argument, sarcastic responses are just as effective for pretending you have any idea what you are talking about.

8) Write off massive amounts of scholarship on issues you don't know anything about, like gospel genre, in favor of the work of amateurs who can't even read the original texts (e.g. R. G. Price).

9) Logic is not your friend.

and so on.

All of this allows you to safely conclude what you assumed in the first place.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

The peanut gallery, no forum should be without one.

Your full participation is not lacking.

 

[mjgpgh]

I know the TDS of my water is in between 27 and 32 depending onthe season with no flouride.

I know conspiracy, and I know people who are so wrapped up in it they lost all sense with reality.

No, I'm beyond the conspiracy pal, I know whos behind it all, and what the endgame of the elite is, (have you ever heard of the Georgia Guidestones) but as I said, I'm beyond that, now it's a spiritual awakening.

THE RESISTANCE - THE CODE TO THE MATRIX - THE UNIVERSITY OF THE WORLD - WHOLENESS - IN THE KNOW where you will find nothing but truth, no religions, its all about raising your vibrations to a higher level, and knowing your higher self.

Again, don't sit here and try to debunk what I'm saying, go and find out for yourself, you people sit here everyday, and watch for people to come and present something, then all you can do is put the people down. I mean is that all you people do here? that's sad. I guess you need to do something though, while your waiting for your Messiah to return, which will never happen, unless of course it involves Project Blubeam.

 

[Oberon]

its all about raising your vibrations to a higher level

I'm all for raising my vibrations. We are talking massage chairs right?

 

[outhouse]

all you can do is put the people down. I mean is that all you people do here

this is a education proccess. some teach, some learn, some dont and never will.

we have people here that ride the short bus and scientist and scholars and high school drop outs.

people that take the bible literally to people that would use it as firewood and complain about that.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

No, I'm beyond the conspiracy pal, I know whos behind it all, and what the endgame of the elite is, (have you ever heard of the Georgia Guidestones) but as I said, I'm beyond that, now it's a spiritual awakening.

You should stop drinking.

And perhaps check yourself into the nearest mental hospital.

 

[mjgpgh]

The very statement "he was a rabbi" refers to a role or position that didn't exist in Jesus' day.

Sadly mistaken friend, Rabbi in hebrew means teacher. It has no special meaning other than that.

 

[dogsgod]

No contradictions here :no:


According to evidence in Josephus we might place the execution of John the Baptist as late as 35-36 CE.

And Epiphanius says James' pontificate lasted for 24 years after the departure of Jesus; given Josephus' date for James' death, this would place Jesus' death about 38 CE.

And the Acts of Pilate which the Christian Gospel of Nicodemus replaced dated Jesus' execution in 21 CE.

Irenaeus imagined Jesus dying at age 50, under Claudius, while the Talmud has him crucified under Alexander Jannaeus!

And would the Creeds have bothered to affirm that Pilate executed Jesus unless some were denying it?


Robert Eiseman's "James the Brother of Jesus": A Higher-Critical Review

 

[minimal_mineral]

Christianity is religion that doesn't even ackowledge its own roots. Christianity has created its own saviour Jesus.The Messiah in the bible and the Jesus guy are two totally different ppl. Look at the amount people who have been butcherd or murdered in the name Jesus. Thats not a saviour its murder.Jesus Is not the enlightened man who was crucified for speaking truth Jesus is not the same man we read about in the new testament. The man who was written about in the gospels had a hebrew/aramaic name and guess what ....it aint Jesus....Jesus is greek name. So who's the imposter? Wake up people time is running out for ya all........Yahshua was the elightened man they replaced with Jesus. For evil gains. Didnt the sciptures warn you all of an imposter coming as false messiah.

 

[mjgpgh]

You should stop drinking.

And perhaps check yourself into the nearest mental hospital.

Sorry friend, I dont drink, nor do drugs, again, instead of trying to debunk with little tid bits of nothing, read and learn, get your head out of a fallacy that you have been conditioned to believe in your whole life.

 

[dogsgod]

You should stop drinking.

And perhaps check yourself into the nearest mental hospital.

That was low.

 

[Oberon]

Still waiting for that analysis.

According to evidence in Josephus we might place the execution of John the Baptist as late as 35-36 CE.

Why? What evidence in josephus?

And Epiphanius says James' pontificate lasted for 24 years after the departure of Jesus; given Josephus' date for James' death, this would place Jesus' death about 38 CE.
And the Acts of Pilate which the Christian Gospel of Nicodemus replaced dated Jesus' execution in 21 CE.

I forgot this as a method for mythicists. All sources can be treated equally when you want to. Clearly apocryphal texts far removed from their time which are simply and obviously attempting to build onto the early christian literary tradition can be used as evidence as long as it leads you to reject the early sources.

Irenaeus imagined Jesus dying at age 50, under Claudius, while the Talmud has him crucified under Alexander Jannaeus!

Oh NO! Contradictions between one man's imagination and a jewish tradition composed hundreds of years later!!!

And would the Creeds have bothered to affirm that Pilate executed Jesus unless some were denying it?

They were denying it. Not that Jesus was executed by Pilate, but that it was actually Jesus who died.

 

[mjgpgh]

You should stop drinking.

And perhaps check yourself into the nearest mental hospital.

yea that's the spirit of Jesus, you sure are a righteous soul my friend. Wow, didn't expect insults from a religious forum. Religious my a**!

 

[Oberon]

Jesus is greek name.

No it isn't. It's a transliteration, more or less.

 

[minimal_mineral]

You should stop drinking.

And perhaps check yourself into the nearest mental hospital.

This really shows the jesus spirit that murdered so many his name.

Yahshua said Mat21........You have heard that it was said to our people long ago, 'Don't kill any person. And any person that kills will be judged.' But I tell you, don't be angry with another person. Every person is your brother. If you are angry with other people, you will be judged. And if you say bad things to another person, you will be judged by the Jewish council. And if you call another person a fool, you will be in danger of the fire of hell.

 

[dogsgod]

The following is one way to write a story. Take oral traditions and gossip, blend, and serve:


"In the Triumphal Entry of Jesus into Jerusalem to "cleanse" the Temple which had become a "robber's den," can we not recognize the entry of messiah Simon bar-Giora into the city at the invitation of the priesthood to "cleanse" the Temple of rival freedom fighters? And (as Eisenman and John Dominic Crossan both note) is not the mute flogging of Jesus by priests and Roman Procurator for predicting the Temple's doom suspiciously similar to that of Jesus ben-Ananias? Jesus' mockery as a king during a visit of a Herodian "king" sounds remarkably like the Carabas incident reported by Philo in Against Flaccus (again, Crossan notes this), which also echoes Barabbas, as if it needed pointing out. The attempt by the crowd to force Pilate into condemning Jesus by threatening to report his delinquency to Caesar recalls the actual complaint against Pilate made by Samaritans after he butchered the partisans of the Samaritan Taheb on Mount Gerizim, a deed which actually did result in Pilate's recall to Rome. Jesus' execution as King of the Jews reminds us of Simon bar-Giora's in Rome." R.M.Price

 

[blueman]

There is sufficient evidence for the existence of Jesus Christ. The onus would be on the skeptic to prove He did not.

 

[dogsgod]

There is sufficient evidence for the existence of Jesus Christ. The onus would be on the skeptic to prove He did not.

What can be declared without providing supposed evidence can rightfully be dismissed without evidence.