Difference between rebirth and reincarnation

[no-body]

I never noticed before that Buddhism stresses rebirth and not reincarnation since there is no immortal soul. What exactly are the differences? Why is it said the Buddha experienced all of his rebirths?

 

[Surya Deva]

Not much difference really, just semantics.

 

[Onkara]

Hi No-body
My current understanding is that in Theravada that which is reborn comes to an end in Nirvana because it is anatta, whereas in Sanatana Dharma (and perhaps Sikhism) there is no end to that which is reincarnated (i.e. Atman continues to take a body or incarnation), rather for some schools there is merging or a continued service with the Divine when the Atman is realised but it never ends because the Atman is eternal.

Rebirth fits in with the Buddha's dependent origination. Birth is one of the 12 Nidanas and can (arguably) be repeated multiple times within this life time also.

Hope that helps.

 

[Straw Dog]

I never noticed before that Buddhism stresses rebirth and not reincarnation since there is no immortal soul. What exactly are the differences? Why is it said the Buddha experienced all of his rebirths?

There is a difference in these philosophies. Of course, the actual non-duel state doesn't even indulge in such differences, but the rest of us must discern. Reincarnation involves the transmigration of souls, that is of individual souls. Rebirth only involves the transition of karma itself outside the existence of souls where the mental impressions carry on from one form to another. Am I wrong?

Personally I favor reduce, reuse, and recycle.

 

[Secret Chief]

since there is no immortal soul

I think you answered your own question there!

 

[no-body]

Rebirth only involves the transition of karma itself outside the existence of souls where the mental impressions carry on from one form to another. Am I wrong?

I think you answered your own question there!

So does that mean there is a mortal soul that takes on the aspects of the egos it thinks itself to be as it rebirths?

 

[Onkara]

Hi No-body
I see a few days have past so offer a reply, please ignore if you are waiting for Straw Dog or Magog specifically.

There is no soul in Buddhism, it is mind/consciousness which continues to be reborn due to karma. The ego is a part of the mind which considers itself to be an individual doer and thinks it has been born.

 

[Anatta]

I never noticed before that Buddhism stresses rebirth and not reincarnation since there is no immortal soul. What exactly are the differences? Why is it said the Buddha experienced all of his rebirths?

At death a person abandons
what he construes as mine.
Realizing this, the wise
shouldn't incline
to be devoted to mine.

Just as a man doesn't see,
on awakening,
what he met in a dream,
even so he doesn't see,
when they are dead
— their time done —
those he held dear.

When they are seen & heard,
people are called by this name or that,
but only the name remains
to be pointed to
when they are dead.

(Khuddaka Nikaya, Sutta Nipata, Atthakkavagga, Jara Sutta - Sn 4.6)


Does this sound like someone who believes in "reincarnation"?

Beware of men in orange dresses. Many mean well and are helpful, but some will twist, enhance, and elaborate the Buddha's words to justify their own existence.

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

For those who believe in reincarnation, each person has an eternal, individual, ego-self that survives death, and it's this that is reincarnated into it's next life. In Buddhism, there is no such thing as an eternal, independently existing ego-soul, instead, it's one's karma, or, for those schools that follow Yogachara philosophy, the eighth consciousness, that is reborn into it's next life. The difference comes in the idea of the ego-soul. So, in order to clear confusion about what Buddhists believe, the term rebirth is used instead of reincarnation.

 

[no-body]

Hi No-body
I see a few days have past so offer a reply, please ignore if you are waiting for Straw Dog or Magog specifically.

There is no soul in Buddhism, it is mind/consciousness which continues to be reborn due to karma. The ego is a part of the mind which considers itself to be an individual doer and thinks it has been born.

If you mean it is all metaphorical I am aware of this interpretation and is not really what I am asking about.

At death a person abandons
what he construes as mine.
Realizing this, the wise
shouldn't incline
to be devoted to mine.

Just as a man doesn't see,
on awakening,
what he met in a dream,
even so he doesn't see,
when they are dead
— their time done —
those he held dear.

When they are seen & heard,
people are called by this name or that,
but only the name remains
to be pointed to
when they are dead.

(Khuddaka Nikaya, Sutta Nipata, Atthakkavagga, Jara Sutta - Sn 4.6)


Does this sound like someone who believes in "reincarnation"?

Beware of men in orange dresses. Many mean well and are helpful, but some will twist, enhance, and elaborate the Buddha's words to justify their own existence.

I'm not sure, I don't see any mention of reincarnation or rebirth in that poem it is about death and I'm guessing the true self.

For those who believe in reincarnation, each person has an eternal, individual, ego-self that survives death, and it's this that is reincarnated into it's next life. In Buddhism, there is no such thing as an eternal, independently existing ego-soul, instead, it's one's karma, or, for those schools that follow Yogachara philosophy, the eighth consciousness, that is reborn into it's next life. The difference comes in the idea of the ego-soul. So, in order to clear confusion about what Buddhists believe, the term rebirth is used instead of reincarnation.

Then why is it said that the Buddha remembered his past lives? Was it apocryphal or are such stories metaphorical in nature as with much of Buddhism?

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

Then why is it said that the Buddha remembered his past lives? Was it apocryphal or are such stories metaphorical in nature as with much of Buddhism?

This goes back to the aspect of the person that is reborn. It's a part of one's consciousness, specifically the part that holds karmic seeds, and the Buddha was able to see the chain of karma leading back through previous lives. It's because of karma and dependent origination that he was able to look back and see how his karma formed over countless numbers of past lives.

 

[no-body]

This goes back to the aspect of the person that is reborn. It's a part of one's consciousness, specifically the part that holds karmic seeds, and the Buddha was able to see the chain of karma leading back through previous lives. It's because of karma and dependent origination that he was able to look back and see how his karma formed over countless numbers of past lives.

You mean like he had some sort of psychic connection? Or was it a vision of some sort? Or is it just one of those things like nirvana where you have to take the Buddhas word and find out for yourself and the texts never delve into a natural explanation?

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

You mean like he had some sort of psychic connection? Or was it a vision of some sort? Or is it just one of those things like nirvana where you have to take the Buddhas word and find out for yourself and the texts never delve into a natural explanation?

It's more along the lines of, he deciphered the chain of causation. I guess you might call it psychic, but not exactly.

 

[no-body]

It's more along the lines of, he deciphered the chain of causation. I guess you might call it psychic, but not exactly.

I can see it as a metaphor for how he realized that we are all one in essence since we are all connected. But to say he literally had knowledge of and experienced all the literal rebirths that affected him requires more of an explanation to me.

 

[Satyamavejayanti]

I think rebirth and re incarnation are much similar, in rebirth the Atman takes birth again in human form, in reincarnation the Atman takes birth is another form.