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do god really exist?

i have never seen god, have you? but yes i have seen them in the pictures, statues, temples.... i am really confused about how many gods do really exists actually. every religion has their own god.... among them who is the most powerful one? whom should we worship and pray...and if their is god somewhere why don't i see even one of them?
 
There are quite many things you cant see. that does not mean they do not exist. You can not see the wind, but you still know it exist because you can feel it, and see it move leaves and other stuff. Just so with God. You can't see God but you can see the evidence of Gods power and thereby conclude he exist.
 

Zanuku

Member
Bartholomæus;3480146 said:
There are quite many things you cant see. that does not mean they do not exist. You can not see the wind, but you still know it exist because you can feel it, and see it move leaves and other stuff. Just so with God. You can't see God but you can see the evidence of Gods power and thereby conclude he exist.

Don't try to spoil this guys rational thinking by saying there's evidence you yourself can't clarify.
I'm an atheist because I noticed that there is absolutely 0% evidence of gods.
We know the wind exists because we can feel it. :cigar:
 
I think there is evidence. There is no scientific evidence off God existing, neither is there sientific evidence to prove God does NOT exist. Lots of people say we are here because of random events (evolution). Other people think we are here because some being/God created everything (creation). Lokking at the wonders and perfectness of the nature and the universe I myself see that as clear evidence of a creative God. Maybe this won't be accepted as proof by many, and thats ok. They are after all the people with the strongest belief I know of! To believe something material came from nothing MUST take an tremendous belief. Take an old fashioned meat grinder. I consist of rougly 120 parts when taken apart. Now put all the parts in a bucket of water and start shaking the bucket until the meatgrinder is correctly assembled. You can actually make an teoretical number fo the chance of success but in reality it willl NEVE EVER happen. And yet an meatgrinder is such a simple thing compared to an living cell which came to be by itself in some organic soup (if you believe in evolution). If the meatgrinder is correctly assembled its because some person did it. And many see the perfectness of all that sorround us as an evidence of a creator (God)
 

Zanuku

Member
Bartholomæus;3480261 said:
I think there is evidence. There is no scientific evidence off God existing, neither is there sientific evidence to prove God does NOT exist. Lots of people say we are here because of random events (evolution). Other people think we are here because some being/God created everything (creation). Lokking at the wonders and perfectness of the nature and the universe I myself see that as clear evidence of a creative God. Maybe this won't be accepted as proof by many, and thats ok. They are after all the people with the strongest belief I know of! To believe something material came from nothing MUST take an tremendous belief. Take an old fashioned meat grinder. I consist of rougly 120 parts when taken apart. Now put all the parts in a bucket of water and start shaking the bucket until the meatgrinder is correctly assembled. You can actually make an teoretical number fo the chance of success but in reality it willl NEVE EVER happen. And yet an meatgrinder is such a simple thing compared to an living cell which came to be by itself in some organic soup (if you believe in evolution). If the meatgrinder is correctly assembled its because some person did it. And many see the perfectness of all that sorround us as an evidence of a creator (God)

For one, I'm not trying to disprove god, nobody is. As soon as we see concrete evidence for a god we'll believe in him.
You realize this is a perfect example of the argument from ignorance fallacy? The notion that because you have a lack of basic education about the world around you you can't see any other possible way we could exist beside a god.
That is a belief and it is not evidence, it is not proof. And no it does not take a massive amount of belief to say that things evolved, it takes a half rational mind and much less belief than believing that a magic pixie in the sky waved his fingers and created us.
 
I actually only said its evidence for some people. For myslef its clear evidence. But you do realise you arguement goes both ways! You don't have concrete evidence of evolution, its only a theori. Even the farther to evolution (charles darwin) admitted that in his book. The fact remains we have never seen anything come from nothing. 0+0=0 0*0=0 0-0=0
 

Zanuku

Member
Bartholomæus;3480282 said:
I actually only said its evidence for some people. For myslef its clear evidence. But you do realise you arguement goes both ways! You don't have concrete evidence of evolution, its only a theori. Even the farther to evolution (charles darwin) admitted that in his book. The fact remains we have never seen anything come from nothing. 0+0=0 0*0=0 0-0=0

It's not evidence in any way, it's a belief that can't even be called evidence.
And the argument does NOT go both ways, you have proven yourself to lack basic scientific education as to not know what a scientific theory is; it is not a theory as in an idea, a scientific theory has to be backed up by a massive amount of REAL evidence to be as accepted as evolution is.

And I can already tell you've been reading Eric Hovind or Kent Hovind since you've taken their quote and twisted it just like they did, here's the full Darwin quote:

"To suppose that the eye, with all its inimitable contrivances for adjusting the focus to different distances, for admitting different amounts of light, and for the correction of spherical and chromatic aberration, could have been formed by natural selection, seems, I freely confess, absurd in the highest possible degree."
And here's the bit AFTER that which you lot always leave out:
"Yet reason tells me, that if numerous gradations from a perfect and complex eye to one very imperfect and simple, each grade being useful to its possessor, can be shown to exist; if further, the eye does vary ever so slightly, and the variations be inherited, which is certainly the case; and if any variation or modification in the organ be ever useful to an animal under changing conditions of life, then the difficulty of believing that a perfect and complex eye could be formed by natural selection, though insuperable by our imagination, can hardly be considered real. How a nerve comes to be sensitive to light, hardly concerns us more than how life itself first originated; but I may remark that several facts make me suspect that any sensitive nerve may be rendered sensitive to light, and likewise to those coarser vibrations of the air which produce sound."

Darwin continues with three more pages describing a sequence of plausible intermediate stages between eyelessness and human eyes, giving examples from existing organisms to show that the intermediates are viable.

Your move. :cigar:
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
i have never seen god, have you? but yes i have seen them in the pictures, statues, temples.... i am really confused about how many gods do really exists actually. every religion has their own god.... among them who is the most powerful one? whom should we worship and pray...and if their is god somewhere why don't i see even one of them?

That is a fairly good question, and it seems to me that the very diversity of mutually exclusive answers is evidence that it is also a fairly unimportant one.

Ultimately, people just do as they will.
 

idea

Question Everything
Bartholomæus;3480146 said:
There are quite many things you cant see. that does not mean they do not exist. You can not see the wind, but you still know it exist because you can feel it, and see it move leaves and other stuff. Just so with God. You can't see God but you can see the evidence of Gods power and thereby conclude he exist.

I think this is going in the right direction. Essentially religious people embrace more than the materialistic elements of life.

Information - a non-materialistic entity.

Intelligence - another non-materialistic entity.

I also believe that "feeling" something extends to more than just being able to physically touch something - we can feel sad, or happy, feel loved, or feel excited. To feel comforted, peaceful, spiritual is as legitimate as feeling something through physically touching it. Our feelings extend to realms beyond interactions with the materialistic world, and it is through these deeper feelings that many come to their religious beliefs.

How do you know this table is there? Ans: because I felt it.
How do you know God is there? Ans: because I felt His presence.

Ultimately, people just do as they will.

People do what "feels" right.
 
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I don't even know of Eric Hovind or Kent Hovind. And yes, I don't have an scientific education. But you still haven't commented as to how something comes from NOTHING.
My arguement that zero + zero equals zero still stands. You can never get anything from nothing. Care to explain to me how that works for evolution? How did the first amino acids come to be? Your turn ;P
 

Zanuku

Member
Bartholomæus;3480330 said:
I don't even know of Eric Hovind or Kent Hovind. And yes, I don't have an scientific education. But you still haven't commented as to how something comes from NOTHING.
My arguement that zero + zero equals zero still stands. You can never get anything from nothing. Care to explain to me how that works for evolution? How did the first amino acids come to be? Your turn ;P

That's not a fact you know, there is no testable way of determining that there was in fact nothing before the big bang.
For starters, we have evidence of the big bang through Redshift, creation has NOTHING. You have absolutely 0 smidgens of evidence or proof, such total nothing that it is absurd that you can even begin to start thinking about asserting that god created the universe.

You know why god is an acceptable reason for you?

"Because MAGIC can do anything!
Hey I just did a card trick, you can't see how I could possibly have done that with my hands, therefor GOD did it!"
~Matt Dillahunty

:cigar:
 

Zanuku

Member
Oh and as for amino acids and evolution, you are clearly uneducated if you are not slightly versed in abiogenesis.

:cigar: :cigar:
 

idea

Question Everything
Bartholomæus;3480330 said:
... how something comes from NOTHING....

I think most people agree that something has always existed, the problem comes when trying to understand what that eternal something is.
 

FranklinMichaelV.3

Well-Known Member
Bartholomæus;3480330 said:
I don't even know of Eric Hovind or Kent Hovind. And yes, I don't have an scientific education. But you still haven't commented as to how something comes from NOTHING.
My arguement that zero + zero equals zero still stands. You can never get anything from nothing. Care to explain to me how that works for evolution? How did the first amino acids come to be? Your turn ;P

If you're talking about the Universe science does not make the claim something comes from nothing.

If you're talking about amino acids. You do understand that they are not alive right? They are organic compounds not living compounds.
 
Nothing material, living or not comes from nothing. And since when was the Big Bang the beginning of the universe? As i can read it the Big Bang theory explains what happend a splitsecund AFTER the universe came to be. So i don't have any problem believing a big bang. I just know someone created the elementary stuff that was.
 
I agree the Universe dosen't come from nothing. But that still leaves the question: How did it all start. Thats what i would like Zanaku to explain instead of circeling around the fact that nothing material comes to be by itself.
 
Abiogenesis or biopoiesis is a natural process by which life arises from simple organic compounds.

Where did the 'simple organic compounds' come from ?
 

chinu

chinu
i have never seen god, have you? but yes i have seen them in the pictures, statues, temples.... i am really confused about how many gods do really exists actually. every religion has their own god.... among them who is the most powerful one? whom should we worship and pray...and if their is god somewhere why don't i see even one of them?
There are so many people in this world who aren't capable to see God, Thus.. what's new in.. if You are also not capable to see God ?
Just mean to say that.. God doesn't care such small issues. :)
 

MrOmega

Member
i have never seen god, have you? but yes i have seen them in the pictures, statues, temples.... i am really confused about how many gods do really exists actually. every religion has their own god.... among them who is the most powerful one? whom should we worship and pray...and if their is god somewhere why don't i see even one of them?

Why can't a micro organism see you from your head down to your feet?

Surely when compared to a micro organism, I am a God.
 

Jainarayan

ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
Staff member
Premium Member
i have never seen god, have you? but yes i have seen them in the pictures, statues, temples.... i am really confused about how many gods do really exists actually. every religion has their own god.... among them who is the most powerful one? whom should we worship and pray...and if their is god somewhere why don't i see even one of them?

One God, many names and representations. "Jaki rahi bhavna jaisi, Prabhu murat dekhi tin taisi", everyone sees God as is in their heart.
 
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