Do mantras and rituals really work?

[Spirit_Warrior]

The Purva Mimamsa tradition is still very influential in present day Hinduism. We still strongly believe in the powers of mantras, yantras, gem stones, sacrifices etc. There is a whole market online for mantras for wealth, for love, for career, for relationships, for success, passing exams etc. Like this:

But do they work? I really can't think of a single rational explanation for why chanting "Om Kleeem" will cause me to become very attractive?

Have they ever worked for you and how do you know they have really worked, and it is not just wishful thinking?

 

[George-ananda]

I think they do. There are gods. I can't speak for everything like OM Kleem.

 

[sayak83]

The Purva Mimamsa tradition is still very influential in present day Hinduism. We still strongly believe in the powers of mantras, yantras, gem stones, sacrifices etc. There is a whole market online for mantras for wealth, for love, for career, for relationships, for success, passing exams etc. Like this:

But do they work? I really can't think of a single rational explanation for why chanting "Om Kleeem" will cause me to become very attractive?

Have they ever worked for you and how do you know they have really worked, and it is not just wishful thinking?

LINK1


LINK2
Please read the articles in full. Then consider what the Upanisads say, which is considered to the true explanations of what all the Vedas, its Gods and its rituals mean. (BHU 2.5)

This very Self (atman) is the Lord and King of all beings. As all the spokes are fastened to the hub and the rim of a wheel, so to one's Self (atman) are fastened all beings, all gods, all the worlds, all the breaths, and all these bodies.

They knew what was going on and told it quite plainly. The Mimansika's too were partially correct in their own way (its the rituals that are effective, not the Gods they invoke). But the Upanisads explain why that is, its because the Self provides the motive power that makes them effective.

As science is beginning to find out in an objective fashion in its double blind studies. And these are mere shadows of the elaborate rituals of the Vedic era cojoined by faith and belief. I have no doubt they were highly effective (though not likely in bringing rain..that part remains dodgy...as Buddha would point out later.)

Edit: There were two articles. LINK2 article reposted.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I really can't think of a single rational explanation for why chanting "Om Kleeem" will cause me to become very attractive?

They work for some, if not for us. We are too attached to rationality for things which lie beyond the realm of rationality.

p.s. I have a college friend who resembles Kaptchuk very much.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Personally, I think they are an unwanted distraction because they attach people to something that is not real or true and then when you try and present truth to these people they reject it because to them rituals and ceremonies are truth.

In other words, rituals and ceremonies immunize people against accepting reality and truth. No Prophet or Messenger revealed rituals or idol worship or even the sacraments.

Man has created these rituals and substituted them for truth. Now people largely follow these superstitions and reject truth.

 

[Vinayaka]

Work? Yes, but its subtle. It is like a wind, not a club. Anyone expecting some dramatic changes overnight will be in for great disappointment.

 

[Kirran]

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[Kirran]

That done, yeah, I think they have an impact, sounds hold their own vibrations and those vibrations have an impact. I'm skeptical of 'mantras for passing your exams' and 'mantras for making you attractive to potential lovers' and 'mantras for getting more money' though.

 

[Spirit_Warrior]

LINK1


LINK2
Please read the articles in full. Then consider what the Upanisads say, which is considered to the true explanations of what all the Vedas, its Gods and its rituals mean. (BHU 2.5)



They knew what was going on and told it quite plainly. The Mimansika's too were partially correct in their own way (its the rituals that are effective, not the Gods they invoke). But the Upanisads explain why that is, its because the Self provides the motive power that makes them effective.

As science is beginning to find out in an objective fashion in its double blind studies. And these are mere shadows of the elaborate rituals of the Vedic era cojoined by faith and belief. I have no doubt they were highly effective (though not likely in bringing rain..that part remains dodgy...as Buddha would point out later.)

Edit: There were two articles. LINK2 article reposted.

So effectively you are indicating here the power of belief. I think I tend to agree with you that the power of mind over matter is not fully appreciated. In the cases you described how suggestion to the mind can in some cases cure diseases, cause tumours to disappear or it can learn how to manufacture its own medicines is actually well supported by the theories of Ayurveda that we can strengthen the immune system to the extent that it can resist all diseases and germs, and the Vedic theories which considers all diseases to begin at the level of mind, and therefore if mind can create a disease, it can also reverse a disease. That said, as I was telling you in the other thread, vijnanamaya kosha and manomaya kosha being the more subtle layers of our bodies(plural) are harder to access and control. If you could, then you could probably command the physical body to grow twice in size(siddhi of mahima) One of the easier ways is to control the physical body is though the pranamaya kosha, because the pranamaya kosha is more directly correlated with the physical body.

Now, all that said, is it just then the power of belief that manifests effects within or outside the body and the ritual and mantra is just a tool to enforce that suggestion, or does the ritual and mantra have some intrinsic potency that causes that effect?

I don't understand for example why chanting the Gayatri, Ganesha or whatever mantra 108 times would lead to the supposed effects they produce, is it simply because we believe it will produce those effects, or does the mantra actually produce those effects? What if I switched the Gayatri and Ganesha mantras for somebody whose never heard them before, and said Gayatri is for removing obstacles and Ganesha is for improving memory and intelligence, will it produce the same effect or opposite effects?

 

[Kirran]

I think there's more to it than belief, there's more than a kind of placebo effect going on here. At subtler levels, sounds carry their vibrations, and those vibrations do impact you, they cultivate certain attitudes and priorities. You know how a sound can feel soft, harsh, gentle, rough? It's like that, but subtler.

 

[Jainarayan]

Work? Yes, but its subtle. It is like a wind, not a club. Anyone expecting some dramatic changes overnight will be in for great disappointment.

This is what I believe also and am seeing... tiny changes and effects. Is it psychological and "psychosomatic"? I don't know, but maybe that's how the gods work!

 

[Spirit_Warrior]

I think there's more to it than belief, there's more than a kind of placebo effect going on here. At subtler levels, sounds carry their vibrations, and those vibrations do impact you, they cultivate certain attitudes and priorities. You know how a sound can feel soft, harsh, gentle, rough? It's like that, but subtler.

I can understand this, that sounds elicit certain affects on the mind, this much is a scientific testable claim and there are plenty of studies to show this, but to extend this to sounds being able to produce definite manifest effects like make you more attractive, bring wealth and prosperity into your mind, remove obstacles in your life etc goes into the territory of magik. How could this possibly happen through a combination of sounds? Is it the sounds that produce this, or the meaning of the mantra that produces it, or simply the belief that it does?

I have also often wondered whether any ritual works. Rituals are also practised in Tantra, in Wicca, Druidism and other neo-pagan religions. I have friends who practice spells to produce certain effects and they swear by it. Either all of this is superstitious nonsense, or there is some unknown science that allows it. I want to understand this science. I have always felt really silly participating in my friends rituals, such as calling on the elements, "Earth I summon you, Fire I summon you, Air I summon you etc" while waving a dagger in the air and sending around a cup of wine for everybody to sip.

 

[Nyingjé Tso]

Vanakkam,

I share Kirran's opinion on this.

Just to add that mantras and rituals do carry specific vibrations. Sometimes powerful. A trip to a local temple during puja time or going to an old active temple in India will clear any doubt on that. In some temples you can even physically feel it.

Aum Namah Shivaya

 

[Aupmanyav]

I can understand this, that sounds elicit certain affects on the mind, this much is a scientific testable claim and there are plenty of studies to show this, but to extend this to sounds being able to produce definite manifest effects like make you more attractive, bring wealth and prosperity into your mind, remove obstacles in your life etc goes into the territory of magik. How could this possibly happen through a combination of sounds? Is it the sounds that produce this, or the meaning of the mantra that produces it, or simply the belief that it does?

I have also often wondered whether any ritual works. Rituals are also practised in Tantra, in Wicca, Druidism and other neo-pagan religions. I have friends who practice spells to produce certain effects and they swear by it. Either all of this is superstitious nonsense, or there is some unknown science that allows it. I want to understand this science. I have always felt really silly participating in my friends rituals, such as calling on the elements, "Earth I summon you, Fire I summon you, Air I summon you etc" while waving a dagger in the air and sending around a cup of wine for everybody to sip.

If sounds can affect the mind (and they do. My meditation depended on that), if you can be at peace with yourself and the world, then, in your behavior and talk you will be more attractive and more successful in a business environment. That is how mantras affect a person. It is molding and not placebo.

 

[Spirit_Warrior]

If sounds can affect the mind (and they do. My meditation depended on that), if you can be at peace with yourself and the world, then, in your behavior and talk you will be more attractive and more successful in a business environment. That is how mantras affect a person. It is molding and not placebo.

Sure, this makes sense that a certain sound could calm the mind, then you would be more at peace with yourself and hence more successful and attractive, but this could be true for anything that can calm you, and thus being successful etc would be a secondary effect. The claims here, are different though, it is saying there is a mantra for very specific effects, and it this that I want to understand. How does a certain combination of sounds produce specific manifest effects.

Perhaps, I will do my own experiment and chant OM KLEEM for a month and report back whether I became universally attractive

 

[ShivaFan]

It depends on who is the "servant" of the mantra (ie devotee or savant), the "caster", their own demeanor etc. that enables the very real balance of life and soul. One first needs to work on one's own demeanor in most cases, a great way is via Bhakti and calling on the Names of the Lord which can "set one" into proper "flight" (it is more about flying than grounding), then one will see the power and force and it is all natural actually.

Some are just born right out of the womb with such ability.

I have seem amazing things happen by those using mantra, including visionary ability and "moving things".

 

[Aupmanyav]

Perhaps, I will do my own experiment and chant OM KLEEM for a month and report back whether I became universally attractive

Seems that 'Om Kleem' is not your mantra. Try some other. For me it was 'Om namo Narayanaya'.

 

[ShivaFan]

The other thing about mantras is they can change the shape of things - like the shape of the brain.

And in fact, even some scientists think (using brain?) personality traits are linked to the shape of the brain (see link below).

If so, then for example a growing bhakta whose personality CHANGES by means of Mantra to their Lord with devotion is also changing the shape of the Bhatar's brain. Literally.

About every 7 years, according to my path of Hinduism, "every cell in your body is replaced" and thus your body is not the same body you had 7 years ago. Normally this can be changing into an "adult" or growing "old". While one cannot avoid growing "old", I have noticed bhaktas seem to always look young even when old.

With very powerful mantra use, one can actually change into a demigod.

LINK >

Nasty or nice? Study links personality to brain shape

 

[Sw. Vandana Jyothi]

I can understand this, that sounds elicit certain affects on the mind, this much is a scientific testable claim and there are plenty of studies to show this, but to extend this to sounds being able to produce definite manifest effects like make you more attractive, bring wealth and prosperity into your mind, remove obstacles in your life etc goes into the territory of magik. How could this possibly happen through a combination of sounds? Is it the sounds that produce this, or the meaning of the mantra that produces it, or simply the belief that it does?

I have also often wondered whether any ritual works. Rituals are also practised in Tantra, in Wicca, Druidism and other neo-pagan religions. I have friends who practice spells to produce certain effects and they swear by it. Either all of this is superstitious nonsense, or there is some unknown science that allows it. I want to understand this science. I have always felt really silly participating in my friends rituals, such as calling on the elements, "Earth I summon you, Fire I summon you, Air I summon you etc" while waving a dagger in the air and sending around a cup of wine for everybody to sip.

Hinduism unequivocally teaches that all that is created emanated and emanates from the divine sound (AUM) and its iterations--not that all are pleasant to experience. From AUM all originates; likewise, in the Bible we have, "In the beginning was the Word, the Word was with God and the Word was God." (Some Christians believe this Word to be referring to the Bible, but that is incorrect, of course.) Hinduism also teaches that the Name of God and God are one and the same.

@Kirran and others here, as well as myself, can decidedly attest to the efficacy of the practice and embrace of mantra (maan = mind; tra = beyond). Anybody who's gone to a great bhajan session or puja performed by a devotional and knowledgeable pujari knows that bhajan or puja will do one thing to our temple unit (body/mind et al), while a heavy metal concert will do quite another.

 

[Kirran]

Hinduism unequivocally teaches that all that is created emanated and emanates from the divine sound (AUM) and its iterations--not that all are pleasant to experience. From AUM all originates; likewise, in the Bible we have, "In the beginning was the Word, the Word was with God and the Word was God." (Some Christians believe this Word to be referring to the Bible, but that is incorrect, of course.) Hinduism also teaches that the Name of God and God are one and the same.

Others say the Word was Christ!