Do Parents Have To Teach Their Children To Be Bad?

[agorman]

If we don't have to teach children to be bad, they must . . . commit sin of their nature. Children and adults sin.

Again with that concept that we're all wretched sinners! I wish abrahamic religions would stop implanting lack of self-worth and guilt in people. This would be a better World. Those two; lack of self-worth and guilt, are the main problems of Mankind! Very convenient for the Elite to keep enslaving people of course.

 

[MrMrdevincamus]

Again with that concept that we're all wretched sinners! I wish abrahamic religions would stop implanting lack of self-worth and guilt in people. This would be a better World. Those two; lack of self-worth and guilt, are the main problems of Mankind! Very convenient for the Elite to keep enslaving people of course.

First if you don't believe in God whats the harm? I don't care what atheists believe. I mean I don't sit around wringing my hands and posting ignorant (meaning devoid of factual information) things like the above.All that does is show you know very little about what you seem to hate. That said as a Christian I do care about those people that are going to die of old age never knowing the truth about religions, in particular Christianity. If your self-worth is based on the fact you as well as I and every christian that walks the earth is a sinner, your fears are groundless! It's human nature to sin, I sin every day, most likely every hour! I know however that my sins are forgiven. So as I said earlier just as you would worry about someone standing too close to a 1000 ft drop off I worry about people dying without knowing about God. The result is the same, death. So I will take the chance that I might POff someone for witnessing to them, just as you probably would if that person was about to walk off into the abyss, and most probably death.

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[Shadow Wolf]

If we don't have to teach children to be bad, they must . . . commit sin of their nature. Children and adults sin.

It's not being actively taught, but rather the lack of parental guidance teaching them otherwise.
And I am no sinner, and if I ever have kids I'll have no pity or sympathy for the fool who dares call them a sinner.

 

[bobhikes]

Well, do they?

Children just are, they act mostly on emotion without thought. We teach them both Good and Bad and what those values are. Children without being taught could never do good or bad. They will just act on emotional needs.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

It's human nature to sin, I sin every day, most likely every hour!

Just because you sin doesn't mean I do. And, no, it is not "human nature" to sin. We make mistakes, we mess up, we do things that we learn later we shouldn't have, but I have too much compassion to view people as sinners who are damned to Hell. Rather, they are human beings, complete with all the wonderful yet difficult, fascinating yet frustrating, pleasantries and hardships that comes with. They are people, not sinners.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Both genes and environment probably play rolls in how kids turn out. Moreover, the relative weight of each set of factors most likely varies from trait to trait. For instance, genes might account for, say, 90% of a child's ability to feel compassion, but only 60% of a child's feelings of fairness.

I've always viewed genes as a potential range, and environment as where in that range one ends up. This is a simplified model, but I have encountered various studies and experiments over the years which support this framework.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I feel sorry for any kids who are raised in an environment where they are taught they are (and treated as) "sinners." What a great way to end up messed up for your entire life.

 

[SkepticThinker]

First if you don't believe in God whats the harm? I don't care what atheists believe. I mean I don't sit around wringing my hands and posting ignorant (meaning devoid of factual information) things like the above.All that does is show you know very little about what you seem to hate. That said as a Christian I do care about those people that are going to die of old age never knowing the truth about religions, in particular Christianity. If your self-worth is based on the fact you as well as I and every christian that walks the earth is a sinner, your fears are groundless! It's human nature to sin, I sin every day, most likely every hour! I know however that my sins are forgiven. So as I said earlier just as you would worry about someone standing too close to a 1000 ft drop off I worry about people dying without knowing about God. The result is the same, death. So I will take the chance that I might POff someone for witnessing to them, just as you probably would if that person was about to walk off into the abyss, and most probably death.

;{>

I don't find agorman's post to be ignorant at all. My uncle drilled this dirty sinner crap into my father's head for years, I guess in an attempt to cure him of his drinking problem. My father took this nonsense to heart and determined that he was a worthless human being who wasn't worthy of anyone's love or kindness or compassion (despite the fact that he was an extremely kind-hearted and compassionate guy). So he just gave up. It defeated him. He didn't beat his drinking problem, in fact, he just drank more and fell into severe depression. Guess what happened to him?

I know firsthand how harmful this type of attitude can be to the human psyche.

It devalues human life/worth, in my opinion. It bothers me that there is a large segment of the population that views human beings in such a degrading and debasing way. Imagine how LGBTQ people must feel.

 

[agorman]

First if you don't believe in God whats the harm? I don't care what atheists believe. I mean I don't sit around wringing my hands and posting ignorant (meaning devoid of factual information) things like the above.All that does is show you know very little about what you seem to hate. That said as a Christian I do care about those people that are going to die of old age never knowing the truth about religions, in particular Christianity. If your self-worth is based on the fact you as well as I and every christian that walks the earth is a sinner, your fears are groundless! It's human nature to sin, I sin every day, most likely every hour! I know however that my sins are forgiven. So as I said earlier just as you would worry about someone standing too close to a 1000 ft drop off I worry about people dying without knowing about God. The result is the same, death. So I will take the chance that I might POff someone for witnessing to them, just as you probably would if that person was about to walk off into the abyss, and most probably death.

;{>

So according to your way of thinking an all-knowing God created sinners so He could grant them forgiveness and feel magnanimous (!). Sorry but that's such a sick game! FYI, I'm no materialist; I believe that the one you consider a devil (Lucifer) is actually a liberating spirit (similar to a buddha). I doubt the existence of a Universal God; at least one that cares about us humans.

BTW, If I don't know more about abrahamic religions it's because I got tired of reading. You know, after a while it's always the same story; "kill the infidel", "we are wretched sinners", "fear God", "be meek", "be obedient", "give the other cheek", "pay the tithe", "God doesn't want you to know too much, lest you become like Him/Them", etc. I don't know how can't you realize that the "God" depicted in those scriptures was based on human tyrants.

Also, you'll really go into some afterlife sort of hell if you keep underestimating yourself, thinking that you're a sinner. Oh, but "God" will forgive you. Yeah, right. Are you sure?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Imagine how LGBTQ people must feel.

Like absolute, terrible, worthless piles of ****. Depressed and left in very dark and deep ruts. The agony of suffering in silence. Suicidal thoughts and behaviors. Myself, I could probably go on and fill a few posts to max length describing just how badly it messed me up, and the years of struggling to get myself emotionally elevated and keep myself there.

 

[Sunstone]

The human brain is not born fully made up. For instance, it is not wired for true compassion much before the age of seven. Some folks think this means we are born sinners. Such folks probably don't have much in the way of a concept of child development. If we're normal, we're born with the genetic potential to become fully developed humans, but we are not fully developed at birth.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Like absolute, terrible, worthless piles of ****. Depressed and left in very dark and deep ruts. The agony of suffering in silence. Suicidal thoughts and behaviors. Myself, I could probably go on and fill a few posts to max length describing just how badly it messed me up, and the years of struggling to get myself emotionally elevated and keep myself there.

That is ******* heartbreaking, and it's exactly the kind of crap that I can't stand about this stuff. I'm so sorry you had to go through that.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Again with that concept that we're all wretched sinners! I wish abrahamic religions would stop implanting lack of self-worth and guilt in people. This would be a better World. Those two; lack of self-worth and guilt, are the main problems of Mankind! Very convenient for the Elite to keep enslaving people of course.

Yet advocating self-love and self-empowerment have not stopped man from committing heinous deeds, and most studies show confession to one another and communicating with one another (as the Bible suggests) are as effective as meeting with a counselor who tells you to love yourself more.

The Bible further says, "No one hates their own self, they nourish and cherish themselves." If I really hated myself, I would want to suffer more trials and wish I could be downtrodden, which is silly.

Here's the crux of the problem, though--man cannot make utopia as he does indeed sin (would ruin utopia for others). Only transformation by Jesus Christ can make a person fit for Heaven. Looking forward!

 

[BilliardsBall]

It's not being actively taught, but rather the lack of parental guidance teaching them otherwise.
And I am no sinner, and if I ever have kids I'll have no pity or sympathy for the fool who dares call them a sinner.

Um, I have kids, have raised them right, and they do bad things all the time "just because". Children like adults, sin.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Children just are, they act mostly on emotion without thought. We teach them both Good and Bad and what those values are. Children without being taught could never do good or bad. They will just act on emotional needs.

I have two children. They act on selfish, sinful, prideful, envious and other needs, not just emotional needs.

Are adults like children but older? Should we excuse rapists and murderers because they are only acting per emotional needs? Is sin real? Sin is real and affects adults who were once children who were sinners.

 

[sayak83]

Well, do they?

Research shows that parents have little influence on children
Breaking News, Analysis, Politics, Blogs, News Photos, Video, Tech Reviews - TIME.com

 

[bobhikes]

I have two children. They act on selfish, sinful, prideful, envious and other needs, not just emotional needs.

Are adults like children but older? Should we excuse rapists and murderers because they are only acting per emotional needs? Is sin real? Sin is real and affects adults who were once children who were sinners.

Once you have taught them to be selfish, sinful, prideful and envious otherwise you are applying your views to their's. A child that can't talk yet see's a toy and want's that toy and grabs it from another child that can't talk. This is in our minds selfish, envious, prideful and sinful but the child has no way of knowing this. The other child starts to cry, the other child still keeps the toy, this must be a sin now because surely they know the other child is upset because of the toy being gone. This is also wrong the child could think the other child is just hungry or wants his mommy. Without being able to express logical thought there is no sin. Sins are all logical wrongs. If you accidentally kill a bug is that a sin? If you accidentally kill a deer with your car is that a sin? If you accidentally kill a person is that a sin? If you accidentally take your life is that a sin? To sin you have to knowingly and purposely do something that is wrong, you can't sin without knowledge.

As to rapists and murderers in most religions they can be forgiven for there crimes. In a lot of religions it is possible to atone for sins. Fortunately they broke government law which also relies on logic (You can only be found guilty if legally sane) so as an adult or a child they can be imprisoned for their crimes.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Um, I have kids, have raised them right, and they do bad things all the time "just because".

Kids don't know any better. One of my friends, her daughter got blue food coloring all over everything in their living room, cats and dog included. But she didn't know any better, she didn't comprehend the destructiveness of such an action, nor the ability to understand what she had actually done. That is not sin, but rather that children are not at a very high level of mental/cognitive development.

Children like adults, sin.

No one sins. Not unless that is something you want to weigh yourself down with.

Are adults like children but older? Should we excuse rapists and murderers because they are only acting per emotional needs? Is sin real? Sin is real and affects adults who were once children who were sinners.

A child's brain is many, many years from reaching maturation. A person's brain is not fully developed until about their early-to-mid 20s. A person's brain goes through many changes, and as it develops different skills become easier, and certain concepts become easier to grasp.
And funny how sin has not affected me for about 14-15 years, not since I gave up on that soul crushing and emotionally draining and damaging ways. As a child I was tormented, shackled, and heavily weighed down by these ideas of sin and threats of damnation. As an adult, I am free and without these burdens, and pretty much everyone that knows me has acknowledged tremendous improvements in my emotional health. When god and sin where a part of my life I had no self-esteem, very little confidence, and had no sense of self-worth to speak of. That was taken away, but I regained it, and life has become so much better.

 

[metis]

Then perhaps you will once, in hundreds of posts we've shared, affirm anything I've said about the scriptures. ANYTHING. Your claim to be open-minded goes against your desire to constantly harangue where the Bible is wrong or off or immoral.

You must be confusing me with someone else. I never posted that that the Bible is "immoral". I have posted, however, that since I'm not a literalist, that there can be errors in the scriptures, but such errors do not invalidate the general teachings found within the Bible.

Therefore, what you are doing here is to "bear false witness", and it's not logically possible to say you believe in the Bible but then choose to ignore one of it's main teachings that's found in the Decalogue. It is unethical to blame someone for that which they didn't do, and never did I "harangue" the Bible itself.

In closing, it seems that your disingenuousness and hostility shows that you are not connecting well morally, so maybe a switch in denominations is in order whereas they hopefully would teach you how to avoid such problems. Just a recommendation.

Micah 6[8] He has showed you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice [fairness], and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

 

[MrMrdevincamus]

So according to your way of thinking an all-knowing God created sinners so He could grant them forgiveness and feel magnanimous (!). Sorry but that's such a sick game! FYI, I'm no materialist; I believe that the one you consider a devil (Lucifer) is actually a liberating spirit (similar to a buddha). I doubt the existence of a Universal God; at least one that cares about us humans.

DISCLAIMER:::: THE REFERENCES IN MY REPLIES CONCERNING ACTIVIST ATHEISTS AND HATERS OF GOD AND RELIGION AND RELIGIOUS PPEOPLE ARE NOT REFERENCING ANYONE SPECIFICALLY, BUT ARE ONLY A GENERAL NAME FOR THE LOST.

That paragraph demonstrates you know absolutely nothing about Christianity. God created man and gave him free will, to have free will one must be able to make choices. God could of easily created do gooder robots but that was not the plan. He wanted fellowship with man not lapdogs. I believe that this life is one of many schools where we learn to grow up and to cleanse ourselves to meet other star-children and be granted eternal life. The sad truth is we humans like our war and pestilence, we wallow in greed and hate our fellow man, especially f he happens to have different ideas or beliefs. To stand before God and to be accepted to his domain his realm we must be be free as possible of the stink of hate and other sin. Of course anyone that has cracked a bible knows everyone sins. (if we use the common definition of sin). EVERYONE SINS! But that is not a bad thing, unless we live to sin. There was over 600 laws man was to obey to be forgiven. Jesus came to change the old Moasic law and he did just that.
Today Christians simply repent for their slip ups and are forgiven for them. I will say I don't waste my time or Jesus time with haters after the first time. Its no skin off my butt if a hater is so blinded and mentally sickened by their hate for their fellow man and God (that they claim not to believe exists, now how in the Hades can a goober hate something they don't believe exists? Lol!

BTW, If I don't know more about abrahamic religions it's because I got tired of reading. You know, after a while it's always the same story; "kill the infidel", "we are wretched sinners", "fear God", "be meek", "be obedient", "give the other cheek", "pay the tithe", "God doesn't want you to know too much, lest you become like Him/Them", etc.

I am truly sorry you gave up on trying to read or understand the bible. Again and with due respect your words confirm your clam that you don't know very much about Christianity. I hope one day you will again attempt to learn about God and Christianity.

I don't know how can't you realize that the "God" depicted in those scriptures was based on human tyrants.

I too can not believe you can so hate something that you do not come close to understanding. The reason I don't believe God is based on 'human tyrants' is related to a lot of schooling, a lot of life experience, an NDE, and looking at the religion from many critical perspectives which it came out on top every time! I agree with William Craig (PhD, ThD) that Christianity is the most rational, logical explanation for how and why the universe was created by God, and why we sentient find ourselves on a beautiful planet perfectly suited for life!

Also, you'll really go into some afterlife sort of hell if you keep underestimating yourself, thinking that you're a sinner. Oh, but "God" will forgive you. Yeah, right. Are you sure?

I know I am a sinner because of the thoughts I had reading some of the dim witted replies to these threads, lol. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG WITH SINNING. Well that is true unless we dwell on immoral thoughts intentionally! Lastly, yes I am absolutely as humanly possible as can be that I will be forgiven for any and all sins. I do not underestimate myself and I and Jesus) have been successful with every endeavor that meant anything to me. I would be profoundly lonely without God though.

AMEN and praise Jesus!

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