That was a lot of verbiage...
Are you saying that your own ego is lying to oneself and the world?
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Do You All Want the End of Humanity?
- Thread starter wizanda
- Start date
Are you saying that your own ego is lying to oneself and the world?
WhyIsThatSo
Well-Known Member
"Jesus said, "Let him who is seeking, keep seeking until he finds. When he finds, he will be DISTURBED.
And when he is disturbed, he will be ASTONISHED, and he will rule over the ALL "
(Gospel of Thomas....saying #2)
And when he is disturbed, he will be ASTONISHED, and he will rule over the ALL "
(Gospel of Thomas....saying #2)
QuestioningMind
Well-Known Member
WHERE? This is the first time we've communicated on this thread, so I seriously doubt that you've stated anything or shown anything to ME. If you actually have verifiable evidence I'd love to hear what you think it is. You can start with the SINGLE prophesy that you think provides the best indisputable evidence that Christ has already returned. Then you can inform us all as to where exactly Christ is currently residing.
WhyIsThatSo
Well-Known Member
…." and I said to the angel, give me the LITTLE BOOK, and he gave it to me and I ate it up.
And it was bitter in my stomach, but in my mouth it was as sweet as honey " ( Revelation 10:9 }
And it was bitter in my stomach, but in my mouth it was as sweet as honey " ( Revelation 10:9 }
WhyIsThatSo
Well-Known Member
speaking
QuestioningMind
Well-Known Member
Laughing
So you say god is not relevant to christians and that 85% of the bible is a waste of time.
Could it be that you cannot answer that simple question about the bibleand Christianity so you shoot the messenger, how i have come to expect such diversion from religion
Sorry that you are too ignorant of reality to comprehend.
That was an apology for my omission, i im so glad that Christianity still turns out humble and magnanimous human beings... Oh wait a moment, that's not right.
And i considered that the most efficient and politest way to explain the ignorance of having to lie to protect your faith. Sorry if that flew over your head
"Ahhhhh... so you couldn't find anything. Let me remember what you said, and I quote:
Let me rephrase in the quote:
Or the Christine who somehow doesn't want to answer the difficult question so it is sidestepped or the goal-post is moved."
As I said.... you didn't want to answer the question! Why? Because you KNOW Jesus never said those things.
So... let's move forward here!
Please quote me where I said that. If you cannot find the quote... it is called "Fake News" -- and proves my point that your really don't have a case for dialogue and that everything you accused Christians of doing -- you are doing it!
What question? I think the Bible is FULL of important information. BUT, YOUR interpretation of the facts are simply different from mine.
So... what is the final answer for those who really don't have substance...
The Tu quoque Fallacy
The tu quoque fallacy (Latin for "you also") is an invalid attempt to discredit an opponent by answering criticism with criticism -- but never actually presenting a counterargument to the original disputed claim.
In the example below, Ken makes a claim. Instead of presenting evidence against Ken's claim, Christine levels a claim against Ken. This attack doesn't actually help Christine succeed in proving LKen wrong, since he/she doesn't address his original claim in any capacity.
You probably can look it up in the dictionary
Let me rephrase in the quote:
Or the Christine who somehow doesn't want to answer the difficult question so it is sidestepped or the goal-post is moved."
As I said.... you didn't want to answer the question! Why? Because you KNOW Jesus never said those things.
So... let's move forward here!
Please quote me where I said that. If you cannot find the quote... it is called "Fake News" -- and proves my point that your really don't have a case for dialogue and that everything you accused Christians of doing -- you are doing it!
What question? I think the Bible is FULL of important information. BUT, YOUR interpretation of the facts are simply different from mine.
So... what is the final answer for those who really don't have substance...
The Tu quoque Fallacy
The tu quoque fallacy (Latin for "you also") is an invalid attempt to discredit an opponent by answering criticism with criticism -- but never actually presenting a counterargument to the original disputed claim.
In the example below, Ken makes a claim. Instead of presenting evidence against Ken's claim, Christine levels a claim against Ken. This attack doesn't actually help Christine succeed in proving LKen wrong, since he/she doesn't address his original claim in any capacity.
You probably can look it up in the dictionary
Trust me when I say that I'm fine with your opinion! It is just different interpretations.
"Ahhhhh... so you couldn't find anything. Let me remember what you said, and I quote:
Let me rephrase in the quote:
Or the Christine who somehow doesn't want to answer the difficult question so it is sidestepped or the goal-post is moved."
As I said.... you didn't want to answer the question! Why? Because you KNOW Jesus never said those things.
So... let's move forward here!
Please quote me where I said that. If you cannot find the quote... it is called "Fake News" -- and proves my point that your really don't have a case for dialogue and that everything you accused Christians of doing -- you are doing it!
What question? I think the Bible is FULL of important information. BUT, YOUR interpretation of the facts are simply different from mine.
So... what is the final answer for those who really don't have substance...
The Tu quoque Fallacy
The tu quoque fallacy (Latin for "you also") is an invalid attempt to discredit an opponent by answering criticism with criticism -- but never actually presenting a counterargument to the original disputed claim.
In the example below, Ken makes a claim. Instead of presenting evidence against Ken's claim, Christine levels a claim against Ken. This attack doesn't actually help Christine succeed in proving LKen wrong, since he/she doesn't address his original claim in any capacity.
You probably can look it up in the dictionary
What you said in reply to my statement
"No i do not. I have nothing against christianity other than teaching people that genocide, murder, theft, rape and slavery to be ok."
Was
"proof is self evident - I don't remember Jesus teaching any of that. Would you like to quote me where he did?"
In which you obviously deny the OT is relevant to christianity.
So please don't try to discredit me, you are not good enough yet.
And of course you have diverted this conversation from the original point in post #139, "do you know the meaning of proof"
To which you first tried to shift the onus onto me, then obfuscating, then shift subjects, then ad hom. And now you are attempting to tu quoque fallacy me.
Can you please just answer the questions or admit you don't know? It is after all the, honest thing to do.
Actually what you attempted was sarcasm that failed
And its not an opinion, it is factual
Again... assumptions and conclusions that were placed at your discretion. Interpretation of evidence that was wrong...
HOWEVER,
Another question (since you don't seem to want to answer it: "Is Christianity (which you mentioned) based on THE LAW or on Jesus Christ since you DID say: "christianity other than teaching people that genocide, murder, theft, rape and slavery to be ok."
Because Christianity is based on Jesus Christ.
So please don't try to move the goal post or change what we are talking about. And YES, your position (not you) has been discredited and you never DID provide evidence.
So... "do you know the meaning of proof" is quite correct (still waiting for it" and then you calling me "ignorant" when I have asked cogent questions (with no reply except to call me ignorant" validates my position that you have used a fallacy and it is YOU that has not answered the issue.... DOES JESUS PROMOTE OR SAY THAT GENOCIDE, MURDER, THEFT, RAPE AND SLAVERY IS OK"
Now don't try to wiggle out of this. 
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
No, that passage was written to the kings and rulers who lived during Baha’u’llah’s lifetime, enjoining them to arise to aid His Cause. That passage IS NOT about any future king or ruler.I've been sent to announce the Great Tribulation is coming, so regardless of if you believe Baha'i texts, the Judgement is still coming.
"How great the blessedness that awaiteth the king who will arise to aid My Cause in My kingdom, who will detach himself from all else but Me! Such a king is numbered with the companions of the Crimson Ark--the Ark which God hath prepared for the people of Bahá. All must glorify his name, must reverence his station, and aid him to unlock the cities with the keys of My Name, the omnipotent Protector of all that inhabit the visible and invisible kingdoms. Such a king is the very eye of mankind, the luminous ornament on the brow of creation, the fountainhead of blessings unto the whole world. Offer up, O people of Bahá, your substance, nay your very lives, for his assistance." - (Bahá'u'lláh, Kitáb-i-Aqdas, 1873)
This very clearly says one is to come, and the idea you're against Baha'i prophecy, when the fate of humanity depends on it, means you've got very little compassion for people's survival.
Baha’u’llah was saying that if a king arose to aid His Cause everyone should glorify his name, reverence his station, and aid him to unlock the cities with the keys of Baha’u’llah’s Name.
It could be read that way as well, as clearly the rest of the context refers to earthly kings, and not Godly ones, even though context of the Crimson Ark is a Spiritual king, and Shoghi Effendi believed it meant one was to come, to establish the Message on earth.
Thank you for being so challenging, you make me study the Baha'i texts more, and Baha'u'llah shows so many flaws in comprehension, it is clear he wasn't what he claims.
86 Say: O King of Berlin! Give ear unto the Voice calling from this manifest Temple: “Verily, there is none other God but Me, the Everlasting, the Peerless, the Ancient of Days.”
To claim yourself as God incarnate is megalomania; the Source of our reality is like a CPU in a universal quantum computer, anything less is limiting the God Most High in some way.
101 O ye leaders of religion! Who is the man amongst you that can rival Me in vision or insight? Where is he to be found that dareth to claim to be My equal in utterance or wisdom? No, by My Lord, the All-Merciful! All on the earth shall pass away; and this is the face of your Lord, the Almighty, the Well-Beloved.
This is delusions of grandeur claiming we know more than the religions; when we've got most of the world's religions contextually wrong in some way.
I think this is the last point required to prove to me Baha'u'llah was Antichrist's teachings for me; I did think we could work with Baha'i to save humanity, yet it is clear you're all quite determined to disregard the rest of the world's religious prophecy, even if that means the end of humanity - Just like all the other fake religions.
The idea Baha'i have overwritten real Messianic prophecy, like a Thief who breaks in to claim it as their own (Matthew 24:43, Luke 12:39); so the actual Messiah struggles to fix the global religious crisis, means they are also accomplices in committing global genocide.
The real Messiah comes before Armageddon (Revelation 16:15-16), to explain the corruption before the End of the Age (Luke 17:20-37); not a cult where most of the world is ungodly, and we accept a man as a God, yet the world isn't transformed into Paradise again.
In my opinion.
Again... assumptions and conclusions that were placed at your discretion. Interpretation of evidence that was wrong...
HOWEVER,
Another question (since you don't seem to want to answer it: "Is Christianity (which you mentioned) based on THE LAW or on Jesus Christ since you DID say: "christianity other than teaching people that genocide, murder, theft, rape and slavery to be ok."
Because Christianity is based on Jesus Christ.
So please don't try to move the goal post or change what we are talking about. And YES, your position (not you) has been discredited and you never DID provide evidence.
So... "do you know the meaning of proof" is quite correct (still waiting for it" and then you calling me "ignorant" when I have asked cogent questions (with no reply except to call me ignorant" validates my position that you have used a fallacy and it is YOU that has not answered the issue.... DOES JESUS PROMOTE OR SAY THAT GENOCIDE, MURDER, THEFT, RAPE AND SLAVERY IS OK"
Total bull and you know it. The evidence is overwhelming. It needs no interpretation. That you will not accept reality is not my problem.
You refuse to answer the one question that commenced your evasion, fair enough, the conclusion is you won't answer for your own personal reasons.
The trail of our conversation is here for all to see. Hide behind your ego if you want, project to your heart's content if it makes you feel good. It makes no difference to me.
You introduced Jesus because the truth hurts you, 85% of the bible is irrelevant to you but you simply will not admit it, again, your choice, fair enough.
You have no use for god in your version of christianity why do you revere and worship such a genocidal maniac? The book says God that committed genocide and murder, he encourages others to murder, he condones theft, adultery, slavery, rape. Your bible book says it all. But you ignore it.
You are not worth talking to if you twist facts to such an extent that you need to massage your ego with bull.
Your demonstrative bias, assumptive statements with no quotes to confirm, lack of ability to answer the question, your evasive answers, your use of fallacies, your goal post moving, your use of the tactics that you accused Christians of doing... make your position quite... well...
irrelevant.
You will have to do much better if you want to convince people. It makes me wonder if you ever were a Christian or whether you simply learned about Christianity and declared yourself a Christian.
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Trailblazer
Veteran Member
It is obvious from the context of that passge that Baha'u'llah never claimed to be God. He ONLY claimed to be the Voice of God:
“Attract the hearts of men, through the call of Him, the one alone Beloved. Say: This is the Voice of God, if ye do but hearken. This is the Day Spring of the Revelation of God, did ye but know it. This is the Dawning-Place of the Cause of God, were ye to recognize it. This is the Source of the commandment of God, did ye but judge it fairly. This is the manifest and hidden Secret; would that ye might perceive it. O peoples of the world! Cast away, in My name that transcendeth all other names, the things ye possess, and immerse yourselves in this Ocean in whose depths lay hidden the pearls of wisdom and of utterance, an ocean that surgeth in My name, the All-Merciful. Thus instructeth you He with Whom is the Mother Book.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 34-35
Baha'u'llah called himself a divine manifestation; he said it was acceptable for divine manifestations to say "I Am" as if they're God.
He changed his name to mean the "Glory of God", claiming he was Yeshua's father.
This isn't someone just claiming to be a 'voice of God', he actually thought he was God incarnate down near Hell.
Most prophets, and even the Messiah had odd wording they were instructed to teach came from the Source; Baha'u'llah claimed all his words are the words of God.
He blatantly made himself into an idol, and a cult leader, that contradicts Yeshua in the Bible directly on numerous points i.e. Antichrist's teachings.
In my opinion.
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I did watch the video, and apparently it's had 22,000,000+ views, so at least some people are watching it. But the question is, what do they do with the information?
Some people are being fooled and manipulated, but I also think some people are probably just defeated and apathetic. A lot of people simply don't care about justice or the state of the world; they just want to grab whatever few scraps they can and huddle inside some gated community or exurban enclave to live out the rest of their lives. They don't care how much CEOs or the super rich actually make, just as long as they have some semblance of security and protection