Do you Believe in the Trinity?

[tarasan]

Would it thus be fair to say that this is an accurate summation of the Bible using your analogy?

Cerberus made a covenant with mankind, which mankind broke. Mankind became sinful so fido sent spike, of whom he is somehow a father despite the fact they are in the same entity, to die as a sacrifice for mankind's sins, whereupon scruffy went off to carry on the Good Word?

hmmmm I think u guys need to hear of the onotological trinity. XD

but yeah..... if I follow you..... I think thats right..... please let any christian correct me because I only know the basis of the trinity.

 

[Noaidi]

it would be this

three distinction persons/consciouses, which co-exists in one substance/entity.

aka three unique seperate entities that are one,

Okay, but what does that actually mean - three unique separate entities that are one? If they are separate, how can they simultaneously be one?

 

[DeitySlayer]

And is any of the parts greater than any other?

 

[tarasan]

And is any of the parts greater than any other?

well lets put it this way your boss ok it above you, but he is also your equal, I mean that just because he has a position over you doesnt mean that he is better than you does it?

thats how we explain how Jesus seems to answer to The father and so forth. they are there to complete certian roles which require to raise another above himself however they are all equal, like how you take orders from your boss however you are still equal with your boss as in your both humans with the rights etc.

 

[DeitySlayer]

well lets put it this way your boss ok it above you, but he is also your equal, I mean that just because he has a position over you doesnt mean that he is better than you does it?

thats how we explain how Jesus seems to answer to The father and so forth. they are there to complete certian roles which require to raise another above himself however they are all equal, like how you take orders from your boss however you are still equal with your boss as in your both humans with the rights etc.

So did Jesus only come 'into being' when he was born onto Earth? He didn't exist before that as a separate entity?

 

[tarasan]

Okay, but what does that actually mean - three unique separate entities that are one? If they are separate, how can they simultaneously be one?

well its the same as the cerberous analogy you could fairly say that each head of cerberous had a name and personality, but yet he still had an idenity as cereberous, as in the three heads as well as having their own identity also had this single idenity as the one animal the same is kinda like God.

 

[tarasan]

So did Jesus only come 'into being' when he was born onto Earth? He didn't exist before that as a separate entity?

ohhh yes he did, theologians put him as the one wrestling Jacob and the one appearing to Ezekial in the vision. In john we put Christ as what John describes as the "word". They all were there at the beginning all seperate yet one, sorry if i implied otherwise.

 

[Yaqub]

The Trinity (father, son, holy ghost) is quite similar to the Hindu concept of Trimurti (Brahma, Shiva, Vishnu), three gods in one.

 

[YmirGF]

To me, they are simply different aspects of a multidimensional godhead. The key here is that they are not separate parts, but rather different aspects of the same thing, depending on the viewpoint taken. Those who see this as three separate aspects or as some less than deep thinkers tend to say, that the Trinity is three different gods, are mistaken, imo. It isn't three, it is one, looked at from three perspectives.

Oh well, what would I know, though I do tend to think of myself as a friend of the "family", rather than a follower, as it were.

 

[tarasan]

The Trinity (father, son, holy ghost) is quite similar to the Hindu concept of Trimurti (Brahma, Shiva, Vishnu), three gods in one.

it could be i havnt read into it.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

why because its a part of my religion.... and the bible seems to support it.

Do you mean the Comma Johanneum, or are you talking about something else?

ohhh yes he did, theologians put him as the one wrestling Jacob and the one appearing to Ezekial in the vision. In john we put Christ as what John describes as the "word". They all were there at the beginning all seperate yet one, sorry if i implied otherwise.

But here's the something I wonder about: how is this reconciled with the idea that Christ was begotten?

Begotten things are created - they have a beginning. Eternal things don't. I don't see how one thing can be both at the same time.

 

[Noaidi]

it would be this

three distinction persons/consciouses, which co-exists in one substance/entity.

aka three unique seperate entities that are one,

Can you explain this idea of three separate entities, yet who are one at the sam time, using the terms god, jesus and the holy spirit?

 

[tarasan]

Do you mean the Comma Johanneum, or are you talking about something else?


But here's the something I wonder about: how is this reconciled with the idea that Christ was begotten?

Begotten things are created - they have a beginning. Eternal things don't. I don't see how one thing can be both at the same time.

firstly NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I am not that wasnt in the original manuscripts, its the first few verses of John ill show you them.

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. gospel of John 1:1-4

and for your last point begotten was used to show jesus's special relationship with the father, that is why in the Nicene Creed is says "begotten not made, of one substance with the father".

also read the
Athanasian Creed,


it is specifically devoted to describing hte trinity because of the Arian attack on the Trinity.

 

[tarasan]

Can you explain this idea of three separate entities, yet who are one at the sam time, using the terms god, jesus and the holy spirit?

firslty your terminology is wrong it actually is

God
Jesus
Holy Spirit
father

ok so, Jesus, Father and the Holy spirit, are all seperate entities, they all can act independantly of each other and they all have different Jobs, but hey are all of the same substance they are all one with each other so calling them God(s) would be a mistake, rather I would like to describe them as this.

Jesus is God
Holy Spirit is God
The father is God

They are God

no plural.

think of it as 1x1x1=1

if that helps at all.

 

[Noaidi]

ok so, Jesus, Father and the Holy spirit, are all seperate entities, they all can act independantly of each other and they all have different Jobs, but hey are all of the same substance they are all one with each other...

They are all of the same substance? Wasn't jesus a flesh and blood human? And what is this substance that they are all made of? And how can they be at one with each other? What are the jobs that each has to do?

I realise that, to you, I am probably asking the same questions repeatedly. Apologies if I am, but I genuinely can't get my head round this concept of being separate but being all one at the same time.

 

[tarasan]

They are all of the same substance? Wasn't jesus a flesh and blood human? And what is this substance that they are all made of? And how can they be at one with each other? What are the jobs that each has to do?

I realise that, to you, I am probably asking the same questions repeatedly. Apologies if I am, but I genuinely can't get my head round this concept of being separate but being all one at the same time.

no these are important questions.

ill tackle your first statment first, Jesus was human "incarnate" remember he wasnt always a human/God he was with God at the beginning, so for the time he was with us he was made of blood and flesh.

I guess basically without going into too much detail it was the

The father who sent the Son to man
The Son who the did the redemptive work
and who sent the holy spirit who is the mediator between God and man

The father predestined us and gave those he predestined to the Son.

I added that last bit in so as not for you to think the father does nothing! but seriously I tried to answer it as basically as possibleso as to give you a kind of taste as the kind of work that they do.

 

[logician]

Why does a supposed god need a mediator, and for that matter, why does a supposed god even want to communicate with a lowly species like homo sapiens?

 

[tarasan]

How can the Holy Spirit, who is in essence, God, be the mediator between God and Man?

Sorry that is just me being an idiot and using religious Jargon.

The holy spirit enters us and through him we are able to communicate with God recieve Gifts and ultiamtely know what God wants in our lives.

Thats what we mean by mediator, through him we recieve the ability to Know what God wants from us.

 

[tarasan]

Why does a supposed god need a mediator, and for that matter, why does a supposed god even want to communicate with a lowly species like homo sapiens?

this thread is about the trinity so i wont answer your second statement but the first is me stupidly using religious Jargon.

The Holy spirit is God, who enters and indwels within us, he lets us know what God wants from us, etc there are other things he does like bestow gifts.

 

[sandandfoam]

They say about Harley Davidsons that if you have to ask you wouldn't understand.
Perhaps the Trinity is a bit like that - you get it or you don't.