Thief
Rogue Theologian
how about any one item you prefer to talk about.
something that can put Father Moses in his grave....
oh....that's right.....God did that too
and there's no evidence
oh well, matters of faith need no proving
see Webster's
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Do you believe Moses parted the Red Sea?
- Thread starter Spiderman
- Start date
something that can put Father Moses in his grave....
oh....that's right.....God did that too
and there's no evidence
oh well, matters of faith need no proving
see Webster's
EverChanging
Well-Known Member
Based on the way the story lines flow in the Torah and many other factors no, I don't believe this was a literal historic event.
As to specifics, the Qur’an does not support the idea that the Red Sea split into two enormous walls of water through which Moses crossed. Instead, the Quran (44:25) states that Moses took advantage of the changing of tides – crossing at ebb tide, when the water recedes so much that one can cross by foot. Here, the Quran employs the word rahwan, which means “calm” as well as “an intervening space” – an apt description of the receding tide. According to the Quran, God told Prophet Moses to cross during the time of low tide, “Then We revealed to Moses, saying, ‘Strike the sea with thy rod.’ Thereupon it parted, and every part looked like a huge sand-hill” (26:64). Pharaoh, following at some distance with chariots and heavy armaments, arrived at the Red Sea after Moses had already crossed and fell victim to the rising tide (26:65-67). In fact, the scientific periodical PLoS ONE recently published an article on the plausibility of this event, particularly examining a phenomenon known as “wind setdown.” In addition, not only is the account scientifically tenable, but the French revolutionary Napoleon survived a similar experience during his life.
Pharaoh’s end, however, was designed to serve as a lesson for all time. Thus, the Quran declares that, despite the flood, Pharaoh’s body will be preserved, “So this day We will save thee in thy body alone that thou mayest be a Sign to those who come after thee. And surely, many of mankind are heedless of Our Signs” (10:93). This declaration is unique to the Quran. It is also remarkable that this declaration was recorded 1,400 years ago amongst the Arabs – a people who only knew that Pharaoh had perished and had no knowledge of the process of mummification. In the late 1800s, Egyptologists discovered Pharaoh’s body, confirming what the Quran had prophesied more than 1,000 years prior.
But aside from an argument in support of the Qur’an’s authenticity, what lesson does this event serve and what relation does it have to our explanation of the phenomenon of divine punishment? The Quran (10:91-92) records that as the water engulfed him, Pharaoh said he wished to be saved because he now submits to the God of Moses. But Pharaoh’s chance had passed, and his soul could not be redeemed. His body, however, would be saved as a reminder for later generations to never obstruct and persecute a prophet and his people.
Having explained Islam’s view of the “splitting of the sea,” one may be mislead into thinking that one must always interpret events within the confines of prevailing scientific knowledge. This is not the case. Islam argues that God does not need to break a law in order to act. When an event such as the “splitting of the sea” occurs, it can rightly be described as a miracle – i.e. an unveiling of a hitherto unknown law. Regarding this discussion, we continue next month.
Pharaoh’s end, however, was designed to serve as a lesson for all time. Thus, the Quran declares that, despite the flood, Pharaoh’s body will be preserved, “So this day We will save thee in thy body alone that thou mayest be a Sign to those who come after thee. And surely, many of mankind are heedless of Our Signs” (10:93). This declaration is unique to the Quran. It is also remarkable that this declaration was recorded 1,400 years ago amongst the Arabs – a people who only knew that Pharaoh had perished and had no knowledge of the process of mummification. In the late 1800s, Egyptologists discovered Pharaoh’s body, confirming what the Quran had prophesied more than 1,000 years prior.
But aside from an argument in support of the Qur’an’s authenticity, what lesson does this event serve and what relation does it have to our explanation of the phenomenon of divine punishment? The Quran (10:91-92) records that as the water engulfed him, Pharaoh said he wished to be saved because he now submits to the God of Moses. But Pharaoh’s chance had passed, and his soul could not be redeemed. His body, however, would be saved as a reminder for later generations to never obstruct and persecute a prophet and his people.
Having explained Islam’s view of the “splitting of the sea,” one may be mislead into thinking that one must always interpret events within the confines of prevailing scientific knowledge. This is not the case. Islam argues that God does not need to break a law in order to act. When an event such as the “splitting of the sea” occurs, it can rightly be described as a miracle – i.e. an unveiling of a hitherto unknown law. Regarding this discussion, we continue next month.
Shad
Veteran Member
Hence why matters of faith can be dismissed by those that do not hold your presuppositions of faith
Shad
Veteran Member
People know about mummification for centuries before hand. Stating something know already is mundane. Egyptologists have discovered no such thing since none can even provide evidence of the Exodus. You are copying Bucaille's conclusion as if he was an expert, he isn't. He was a medical doctor so far outside his field it is laughable.
Shad
Veteran Member
Warmth is just thermal radiation hence it is still part of said giant ball of gases.
But you are still experiencing what results of said mechanics; warmth, thermal radiation.
Neo Deist
Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.
No.
Besides, the actual body of water was the Sea of Reeds, not the Red Sea. In other words, a swamp or marshland area that chariots could not pass through.
Do I believe the story to be true in any shape or form? No.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
and yet ....here we are....
too complex to be an accident times 7billion
First Baseman
Retired athlete
Yeah. Duh!
Demonslayer
Well-Known Member
Here's a question surrounding the God did it vs. Moses did it idea.
So the idea is Moses lifted his magic stick high into the air, and this indicated to God that it was time to part the Red Sea. I've been told 1) it wasn't the magic stick that caused the sea to part 2) that it wasn't Moses' power that made the sea part but 3) it was God's power and Moses raising the mighty stick was just a sign to God that he needed help.
The question is, isn't God omniscient? Wouldn't God have already known the exact moment that Moses needed Him to part the Red Sea? So then what was with the grand gesture with the stick? Shouldn't the sea have parted automatically? If Moses didn't do it, and the stick didn't do it, why did he raise the stick?
rosends
Well-Known Member
Jewish lore teaches that it wasn't even the stick. It was the act of faith - the water didn't part but Nachshon the son of Aminadav walked in anyway. When the water reached his neck and he kept walking, it parted.
Demonslayer
Well-Known Member
I like that story better, but the Bible says there was a stick and the Bible is never wrong.
Akivah
Well-Known Member
In my opinion, the gesture was for the people of Israel.
Demonslayer
Well-Known Member
That's a decent answer actually.
It turns the staff gesture into a bit of a dog and pony show, but it does provide a reason why Moses would have made an unnecessary gesture...to display to the people what was going on.
Not bad!
Shad
Veteran Member
Empty rhetoric
Thief
Rogue Theologian
are you cornered?
Thief
Rogue Theologian
my wife and I enjoy a tv series called....Ancient Mysteries...I like that story better, but the Bible says there was a stick and the Bible is never wrong.
it spins off of 'scientific' explorations and speculations about artifacts.
there seems a huge collection of man-made? items all over this planet
and we have little clue how such things were done
that a man carried a staff and did unusual events with it.......is not explained