Do you have Bible questions today?

[Deeje]

Christendom just means the Christian World. Do JWs define it differently?

In our view, Christendom is a product of the foretold apostasy. Just as Judaism in Jesus’ day was the only accepted form of the Jewish faith at that time, Jesus soon exposed them as disobedient frauds who misrepresented their God to the people and were no longer acceptable to God as the serial covenant breakers that they proved themselves to be. John the Baptist also summed them up. (Matthew 3:7-10)

Jesus foretold that the “weeds” of fake Christianity would be sown by God’s adversary, resulting in the great apostasy that produced Roman Catholicism and her many daughters. Christendom is not real Christianity...not in its beliefs or its practices. Just like Judaism before it, men in positions of power corrupted what was once pure. Christendom was the only “Christianity” that existed for over 1500 years. It was only at ”the time of the end” that Daniel foretold a ‘cleansing and refining’ of God’s worship. (Daniel 12-9-10)

We are in the time of the end now. The March of world powers featured in Daniel’s prophesy, end with the current world powers. This is the time for God’s kingdom to “come” (Daniel 2:44) and for his will to be “done on earth as it is in heaven.....isn’t this what Jesus taught us to pray for?

The Kingdom of God in not some emotional experience felt in the heart, but a display of God’s power to crush satan’s entire world system out of existence, and replace it with a real government that will bring peace and security to this earth......bring it on!

 

[Deeje]

That's a terrible way to see the world and people. It makes me sad. It got people killed all throughout history.

And why would that surprise you? The giver of life also has the right to terminate it as he has shown down through history. He is a God of justice, not sentiment. If you deserve life, he will permit you to live it under his terms, but if you wish to dictate your own terms, then...you just disqualified yourself from keeping it.

Logically (without morals involved), I guess when people ignore god they will suffer the consequences. What is the benefit of believing in god if not out of fear for the consequences?

How does this have to do with the love of god?
Does JW believe the love of god? if so, how do they define love?

What is love? From God's perspective it is summed up by the Greek word agape.....which is love based on principle, not emotion. His justice is sometimes tempered with mercy, but never based on sentiment.

Tough love is often more beneficial than overindulgence. Those who are overindulged end up being a burden on everyone around them because they have no sense of responsibility and demonstrate the mentality that they are owed something.....God does not owe us anything.

You forget that God is also the restorer of life, so no one's death has to be permanent unless God deems it so. Its up to us to form a deep and personal relationship with God so that he will never forget us. Nothing can separate us from him. (Romans 8:38-39)

Those who have peace without god most likely wont go into a house they are not invited to. If they do come without being invited, I can see the consequence since it's not their "home." Though, many people who are at peace without the christian god may accept their mistake and leave. Only the owner finds threat to strangers in their home rather than humility to invite strangers to their table instead.

If you follow the analogy?

Its a faulty analogy IMO. God invites all....no one is rejected unless they reject the rules of God's house.
As I have often said...we must change to suit God because he will never change to suit us.
If he is not your Universal Sovereign, then you will see no need to obey him...but if he has your life in his hands and you throw it back at him because you don't see him that way, will he welcome you? I don't think so.
You can't have your own way with God. Its his way or the highway.

I mean more is it beneficial for believers that non-believers suffer consequences by you believing they rebelled against god?

I'm not sure how death as a consequence brings people to the love of god rather than fear of him.

You seem to be carried away by emotion again. God is not one to base his actions on emotions. He sees what is in a person's heart and he has already told us that the heart is a treacherous thing, justifying all manner of things that he tells us to avoid.

God has no desire to destroy anyone, as Peter says...
"Jehovah is not slow concerning his promise, as some people consider slowness, but he is patient with you because he does not desire anyone to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance." (2 Peter 3:9)

If there is no repentance, there will be no forgiveness, Christ's sacrifice will not apply. There is no room in God's plans for rebels.
You have to bring your thinking into alignment with his.....or you simply don't belong in the place where he is taking us.... a new world of righteousness. (2 Peter 3:13)

Do you believe god out of fear?

No way....I lost that fear when I left Christendom. What is to fear? All that was ever offered to mankind from the beginning was 'life or death'.....there never was a 'heaven or hell' scenario ever mentioned...so what have I got to fear....not even death?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

And why would that surprise you? The giver of life also has the right to terminate it as he has shown down through history. He is a God of justice, not sentiment. If you deserve life, he will permit you to live it under his terms, but if you wish to dictate your own terms, then...you just disqualified yourself from keeping it.

Termination of life isn't a bad thing. Both life and death are one and the same strand.

I'm learning through my spiritual practice not to separate life and death as our society make us think as a big deal. I know many people don't want to die eternally however defined; but, what you're saying sounds more of a blessing than a curse.

What is the logic behind eternal death from JW perspective?

Is it because god says so?

What is love? From God's perspective it is summed up by the Greek word agape.....which is love based on principle, not emotion. His justice is sometimes tempered with mercy, but never based on sentiment.

Interesting. I learned something new. Mercy and love aren't interrelated?

A lot of believers would say sacrifice and obedience is an act and evidence of god's love.

Tough love is often more beneficial than overindulgence. Those who are overindulged end up being a burden on everyone around them because they have no sense of responsibility and demonstrate the mentality that they are owed something.....God does not owe us anything.

I'm not sure how eternal punishment (death) and touch love go together?

You forget that God is also the restorer of life, so no one's death has to be permanent unless God deems it so. Its up to us to form a deep and personal relationship with God so that he will never forget us. Nothing can separate us from him. (Romans 8:38-39)

I'm confused, though. If people rebel against god, they loose their personal and permanent relationship with him, right? Nothing can separate us from him?

I would agree that it makes more sense god and people are not separate since god is life/breathe that is the spirit that brings people alive, type of thing. Once you get to the rebel, death, and all of that, it kind of invalidates the first statement.

Its a faulty analogy IMO. God invites all....no one is rejected unless they reject the rules of God's house.
As I have often said...we must change to suit God because he will never change to suit us.

If he is not your Universal Sovereign, then you will see no need to obey him...but if he has your life in his hands and you throw it back at him because you don't see him that way, will he welcome you? I don't think so.
You can't have your own way with God. Its his way or the highway.

That's more a difference of opinion rather than fact. God or breathe of life has no favorites. We are born into being, out of being, and within that "breathe". We can't rebel. That's like committing suicide. No matter how much we try to go away from living and life (aka how much we want to end our lives), our body and mind still pulls us to survive. It's the cycle of life. When we age and die, our spirits move on.

Are you afraid of death if god just left you since he can do anything?
(If you can think about it for a bit?)

You seem to be carried away by emotion again. God is not one to base his actions on emotions. He sees what is in a person's heart and he has already told us that the heart is a treacherous thing, justifying all manner of things that he tells us to avoid.

I'm not one for obedience. That sounds more political than it does spiritual and relationship wise.

I'm not seeing the positiveness in your religion. What pulls people to god if it isn't emotions? Obedience? Fear?

If there is no repentance, there will be no forgiveness, Christ's sacrifice will not apply. There is no room in God's plans for rebels.

You have to bring your thinking into alignment with his.....or you simply don't belong in the place where he is taking us.... a new world of righteousness. (2 Peter 3:13)

This only applies to those who want to believe and take these things up as truth. It doesn't apply to all people.

But, I can see what you're saying. It does go back to is this all based on obedience and fear?

What brings people to the god you describe?
Do they have a choice to come to god or just a choice to rebel?

No way....I lost that fear when I left Christendom. What is to fear? All that was ever offered to mankind from the beginning was 'life or death'.....there never was a 'heaven or hell' scenario ever mentioned...so what have I got to fear....not even death?

I read this from top to bottom so you'll see this question asked above.

The reason I said fear is because you mentioned there is no emotions involved, people rebel, god is a god of touch love, and eternal death and consequence for not believing and following him.

So, if you lost god, would you be alright with these things?

How would you feel without god?

When I was practicing "christiandom" I didn't get the fear aspect of it. It's an individual's relationship with god not politics. So, when you say that, it's accusing thousands of people are following a false path.

JW does have fear, though. Unless other christian religions sugar coat it, but JW is pretty direct about it.

There's nothing wrong with fear. It's a human emotion.

 

[Deeje]

Termination of life isn't a bad thing. Both life and death are one and the same strand.

Life is a gift...death is a curse. We have no inbuilt program for death, but we sure as heck have one to keep living.

I'm learning through my spiritual practice not to separate life and death as our society make us think as a big deal. I know many people don't want to die eternally however defined; but, what you're saying sounds more of a blessing than a curse.

What is the logic behind eternal death from JW perspective?

Is it because god says so?

It is all God ever offered us...everlasting life or everlasting death.....these are opposites, which if you check out nature...everything has an equal opposite. It speaks of God's perfect balance in all his creation.

The Bible is our guidebook....because when you study it...I mean really study it, you find a depth of wisdom, and a view of life and death that is not really visible on the surface. The problem I feel, is that most who identify as "Christians" have never really studied the Bible for themselves. They usually have a pastor or minister or priest who is supposed to know it all for them....they just rock up to church and do their weekly duty.....going through the ritual but learning very little....and then they go home feeling good about that......some even turn their church services into something akin to a rock concert....but that is not the kind of Christianity that Jesus taught.
Jesus taught us the way to everlasting life....

John 17:3....
"This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ."
The only way to get to know God and his son is to spend time with them.....learning about their thoughts on things and putting into practice the things they teach. All of it is for our benefit.

Interesting. I learned something new. Mercy and love aren't interrelated?

A lot of believers would say sacrifice and obedience is an act and evidence of god's love.

Mercy and love are totally related....God's justice is perfect as is his love. All his qualities are in perfect balance. Please don't equate indulgence with love. Love means that God will act with the best interests of his creation at heart. I believe that those who wish to impose their will on others, (to their detriment) or even on God, (as if he should be ignored) will come to disappointment.

I'm not sure how eternal punishment (death) and touch love go together?

God's love for those who will do the right thing by each other, the planet, and God himself, is demonstrated when he eliminates from existence those who have no intention of ever following his commands. The disobedient ones spoil it for everyone else. They create bones of contention that need not exist.

Can you imagine a military troupe where everyone ignored their commanding officer and instead chose to do their own thing...? Following orders is the first rule of any successful army. Utter chaos would result if that was not the case. Jehovah is a God of order....we are his troupes.

I'm confused, though. If people rebel against god, they loose their personal and permanent relationship with him, right? Nothing can separate us from him?

Nothing of an external nature can separate us from God.....things of an internal nature is something else again.
Our treacherous heart can lead us away from God imagining that we know better than he does or that we must run ahead of him and make known our own thoughts and ideas.....He has never used anyone but his appointed servants to disseminate his wishes to the rest of his household. For Israel, it was Moses and Joshua....for the first century Christians, it was Jesus and his apostles.....in these last days, it is Jesus' "faithful and discreet slave" who are used to feed his fellow slaves their "food at the proper time". (Matthew 24:45) "Who really is" that slave? That is for us to determine, though God is guiding the process. (John 6:44; 65)

I would agree that it makes more sense god and people are not separate since god is life/breathe that is the spirit that brings people alive, type of thing. Once you get to the rebel, death, and all of that, it kind of invalidates the first statement.

You lost me on that one....I can't really follow your train of thought there...

That's more a difference of opinion rather than fact. God or breathe of life has no favorites. We are born into being, out of being, and within that "breathe". We can't rebel. That's like committing suicide. No matter how much we try to go away from living and life (aka how much we want to end our lives), our body and mind still pulls us to survive. It's the cycle of life. When we age and die, our spirits move on.

The spirit of life is God's to give and to take away as he sees fit.
Our spirit is either keeping us alive (animating our physical body)....or once it is extinguished, leads to our death. It doesn't go anywhere. It begins in our lungs at birth and it dies with us once our last breath is gone.

Are you afraid of death if god just left you since he can do anything?
(If you can think about it for a bit?)

Again not really following you here...

I am not afraid of death because death is just like sleeping. There is no conscious part of man that survives death. It is the opposite of life. If God left me it would be because I had broken his commands....since that is highly unlikely, I cannot imagine me leaving God or him leaving me....I love him too much for that.

I'm not one for obedience. That sounds more political than it does spiritual and relationship wise.

Obedience to God is like putting your full trust in him as your Father.....one who will not let you fall but support you through the hardest times. His tough love is good for us because its tests our mettle. It shows God that we genuinely love him, not just for all the good things, but in spite of the bad things.

If you remember the trials of Job, then you will remember who brought those trials on him and the accusations made about the genuineness of his love for his God. Each trial was a test of Job's love and loyalty....he passed with flying colors. But will we?

I'm not seeing the positiveness in your religion. What pulls people to god if it isn't emotions? Obedience? Fear?

LOVE. When you see God's creation and the beauty of it stirs your heart to intense gratitude, and draws you to the one who created it all....the attention to detail...the very perfection of things that never needed to be perfect...like a snowflake for example....or the creatures who share our world but we cannot see with the naked eye.....and then contrast the smallness of those things with the enormity of the Universe and we start to see what an incredible Being the Creator is. I am in awe of him.

This only applies to those who want to believe and take these things up as truth. It doesn't apply to all people.

From my perspective, that is completely false. God is the Creator of those who don't even believe in him. They don't want to know him and they certainly don't want to obey him...but that doesn't mean that they will not account to him for the life he's given them.

People are so quick to take their lives for granted....but the truth is every one of us is a miracle....out of all the eggs and sperm that our parents could have turned into human beings.....we were the ones who actually made it outside of the womb to take that first breath and become a human soul. The odds against us being here are astronomical...yet how many truly appreciate life itself?

What brings people to the god you describe?
Do they have a choice to come to god or just a choice to rebel?

All of us are the product of our parent's gene pool....at birth we are a blank canvas....genetics and environment play a role in who we become, but so do our individual choices. All have the same opportunity to come to God. He searches for us as much as we search for him.

How would you feel without god?

Like I had no purpose in being here. Life would be meaningless and there would be nothing to look forward to.
Watching greedy humans destroy the world would weigh heavily on me. Without God nothing would get fixed and nothing would make sense.

When I was practicing "christiandom" I didn't get the fear aspect of it. It's an individual's relationship with god not politics. So, when you say that, it's accusing thousands of people are following a false path.

Its not me accusing anyone of anything....Jesus said that 'many will seek to get in through that narrow door but will not be able'.....they simply don't want to make the effort.
Jesus also told us why....

Matthew 7:13-14.....
"Go in through the narrow gate, because broad is the gate and spacious is the road leading off into destruction, and many are going in through it; 14 whereas narrow is the gate and cramped the road leading off into life, and few are finding it."

There never was going to be 'many' on the right road because its not the easy path.....those who want the easy way are headed in another direction.

JW does have fear, though. Unless other christian religions sugar coat it, but JW is pretty direct about it.

There's nothing wrong with fear. It's a human emotion.

The only fear we feel is what we would also feel towards a beloved parent.....the fear that we had displeased them or let them down in some way. Being afraid of him is not something God has ever wanted. We are so far away form what he intended for us at the beginning but he must deal with rebellion in his own way.

He gave humankind a wonderful start but they threw it all back in his face. All he wanted was for us to love him and obey him as the caring Father that he was, but after the devil has finished with the human race, he will be left with "few" who truly know him and love him for all that he has done to secure our future....it meant sacrificing a good bit of the here and now, but in the long run, it will be so worth it.

 

[sciatica]

Do you like the Book of Macabees?

 

[Deeje]

Do you like the Book of Macabees?

It helps if you quote the person you want to respond to you.....who are you talking to?

 

[sciatica]

It helps if you quote the person you want to respond to you.....who are you talking to?

myself. you interrupted.

 

[sooda]

In our view, Christendom is a product of the foretold apostasy. Just as Judaism in Jesus’ day was the only accepted form of the Jewish faith at that time, Jesus soon exposed them as disobedient frauds who misrepresented their God to the people and were no longer acceptable to God as the serial covenant breakers that they proved themselves to be. John the Baptist also summed them up. (Matthew 3:7-10)

Jesus foretold that the “weeds” of fake Christianity would be sown by God’s adversary, resulting in the great apostasy that produced Roman Catholicism and her many daughters. Christendom is not real Christianity...not in its beliefs or its practices. Just like Judaism before it, men in positions of power corrupted what was once pure. Christendom was the only “Christianity” that existed for over 1500 years. It was only at ”the time of the end” that Daniel foretold a ‘cleansing and refining’ of God’s worship. (Daniel 12-9-10)

We are in the time of the end now. The March of world powers featured in Daniel’s prophesy, end with the current world powers. This is the time for God’s kingdom to “come” (Daniel 2:44) and for his will to be “done on earth as it is in heaven.....isn’t this what Jesus taught us to pray for?

The Kingdom of God in not some emotional experience felt in the heart, but a display of God’s power to crush satan’s entire world system out of existence, and replace it with a real government that will bring peace and security to this earth......bring it on!

So in 1870 the JW's decided everyone else had always been wrong. No wonder the oppose higher education.

 

[Deeje]

So in 1870 the JW's decided everyone else had always been wrong. No wonder the oppose higher education.

Coming from someone who is constantly telling everyone else they are wrong that is kind of funny....

 

[Deeje]

myself. you interrupted.

Am I allowed to report you if you start answering yourself then?

 

[sciatica]

Am I allowed to report you if you start answering yourself then?

sounds like you are used to reporting

 

[Deeje]

sounds like you are used to reporting

Nah...people are more likely to report me....I've been here a while....and some people take offense at what I say. They did the same to Jesus, so I figure I'm in good company.

 

[sooda]

Do you like the Book of Macabees?

I doubt they read the Book of Maccabees since they believe Daniel was a prophet.

 

[sooda]

Coming from someone who is constantly telling everyone else they are wrong that is kind of funny....

I didn't say you are wrong.

I said you all forget that Titus was a prince of Rome and son of Emperor Vespasian and Daniel was not a prophet.

 

[Frank Goad]

In 2 Corinthians 5:6-9 it says we can be absent from our bodies.And in verse 9 it says some people are already absent and with the lord.That reminded me of Ecclesiastes 12:7.Sorry if I have posted this in some other forum.Before this one.What I am not getting is 2 Corinthians 5:9 and Ecclesiastes 12:7.

Why no reply?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Life is a gift...death is a curse. We have no inbuilt program for death, but we sure as heck have one to keep living.

It is all God ever offered us...everlasting life or everlasting death.....these are opposites, which if you check out nature...everything has an equal opposite. It speaks of God's perfect balance in all his creation.

Death isn't a curse. We're all part of a circle of life; and, if we can't accept that in this life, we will always be in search for the next. If we're not comfortable with death, we will always be "searching" for eternal life and feel that life won't make sense unless we are engaging in it.

It's not an easy thing to do learning to die without a clause based on once faith and action.

The Bible is our guidebook....because when you study it...I mean really study it, you find a depth of wisdom, and a view of life and death that is not really visible on the surface. The problem I feel, is that most who identify as "Christians" have never really studied the Bible for themselves. They usually have a pastor or minister or priest who is supposed to know it all for them....they just rock up to church and do their weekly duty.....going through the ritual but learning very little....and then they go home feeling good about that......some even turn their church services into something akin to a rock concert....but that is not the kind of Christianity that Jesus taught.
Jesus taught us the way to everlasting life....

Are you the only one who knows the bible better than other people?

I'm aware of every other christians (JW include) negative view of each other's walk in christ. Coming from outside in, I just see people are at different stages of their life when searching and living in god. They miss the point when saying "they are the right one". They all use the bible to prove their point.

I actually don't know who to "listen" to when it comes to believing who has the right interpretation of scripture.

Mercy and love are totally related....God's justice is perfect as is his love. All his qualities are in perfect balance. Please don't equate indulgence with love. Love means that God will act with the best interests of his creation at heart. I believe that those who wish to impose their will on others, (to their detriment) or even on God, (as if he should be ignored) will come to disappointment.

What's indulgence in context of what you're saying?

How does justice (eternal death) love?

Did Adam and Eve needed to sin for god to have justice over people who don't believe in him?

God's love for those who will do the right thing by each other, the planet, and God himself, is demonstrated when he eliminates from existence those who have no intention of ever following his commands. The disobedient ones spoil it for everyone else. They create bones of contention that need not exist.p

I'm not sure how this is rightful justice.

It sounds like god (I'll say instead) wants people to come to him out of fear.

Can you imagine a military troupe where everyone ignored their commanding officer and instead chose to do their own thing...? Following orders is the first rule of any successful army. Utter chaos would result if that was not the case. Jehovah is a God of order....we are his troupes.

The idea is not everyone is in the military and other people have their own commanding officer. Assuming everyone has one commanding officer is a huge insult and many people won't follow people they do not know and respect.

The idea is to build trust among your peers and higher officers so when one is in a war they can trust each other that they will have each other's back. People in the military shift positions based on their experiences and so forth; so, it's not a fixed. Everything shifts.

The abrahamic god is very different than the moral nature of (American) military structure and mod of respect. I put more respect in our military than I do with god if going by the bible.

Nothing of an external nature can separate us from God.....things of an internal nature is something else again.

I don't see anything wrong with external. We should learn to live spiritually with all parts of life not just spirit-ual.

Our treacherous heart can lead us away from God imagining that we know better than he does or that we must run ahead of him and make known our own thoughts and ideas.....He has never used anyone but his appointed servants to disseminate his wishes to the rest of his household. For Israel, it was Moses and Joshua....for the first century Christians, it was Jesus and his apostles.....in these last days, it is Jesus' "faithful and discreet slave" who are used to feed his fellow slaves their "food at the proper time". (Matthew 24:45) "Who really is" that slave? That is for us to determine, though God is guiding the process. (John 6:44; 65)

Do/did you have a treacherous heart?

You lost me on that one....I can't really follow your train of thought there...

I would agree that it makes more sense god and people are not separate since god is life/breathe that is the spirit that brings people alive, type of thing. Once you get to the rebel, death, and all of that, it kind of invalidates the first statement.

Oh. Sorry. It makes sense that we are not separate from the life within us (we can't live without air). Once we rebel against living (commit suicide for example),

Rats ... I'll be back. I wish this think had a save draft.

The spirit of life is God's to give and to take away as he sees fit.
Our spirit is either keeping us alive (animating our physical body)....or once it is extinguished, leads to our death. It doesn't go anywhere. It begins in our lungs at birth and it dies with us once our last breath is gone.


Again not really following you here...

I am not afraid of death because death is just like sleeping. There is no conscious part of man that survives death. It is the opposite of life. If God left me it would be because I had broken his commands....since that is highly unlikely, I cannot imagine me leaving God or him leaving me....I love him too much for that.



Obedience to God is like putting your full trust in him as your Father.....one who will not let you fall but support you through the hardest times. His tough love is good for us because its tests our mettle. It shows God that we genuinely love him, not just for all the good things, but in spite of the bad things.

If you remember the trials of Job, then you will remember who brought those trials on him and the accusations made about the genuineness of his love for his God. Each trial was a test of Job's love and loyalty....he passed with flying colors. But will we?



LOVE. When you see God's creation and the beauty of it stirs your heart to intense gratitude, and draws you to the one who created it all....the attention to detail...the very perfection of things that never needed to be perfect...like a snowflake for example....or the creatures who share our world but we cannot see with the naked eye.....and then contrast the smallness of those things with the enormity of the Universe and we start to see what an incredible Being the Creator is. I am in awe of him.



From my perspective, that is completely false. God is the Creator of those who don't even believe in him. They don't want to know him and they certainly don't want to obey him...but that doesn't mean that they will not account to him for the life he's given them.

People are so quick to take their lives for granted....but the truth is every one of us is a miracle....out of all the eggs and sperm that our parents could have turned into human beings.....we were the ones who actually made it outside of the womb to take that first breath and become a human soul. The odds against us being here are astronomical...yet how many truly appreciate life itself?



All of us are the product of our parent's gene pool....at birth we are a blank canvas....genetics and environment play a role in who we become, but so do our individual choices. All have the same opportunity to come to God. He searches for us as much as we search for him.


Like I had no purpose in being here. Life would be meaningless and there would be nothing to look forward to.
Watching greedy humans destroy the world would weigh heavily on me. Without God nothing would get fixed and nothing would make sense.



Its not me accusing anyone of anything....Jesus said that 'many will seek to get in through that narrow door but will not be able'.....they simply don't want to make the effort.
Jesus also told us why....

Matthew 7:13-14.....
"Go in through the narrow gate, because broad is the gate and spacious is the road leading off into destruction, and many are going in through it; 14 whereas narrow is the gate and cramped the road leading off into life, and few are finding it."

There never was going to be 'many' on the right road because its not the easy path.....those who want the easy way are headed in another direction.



The only fear we feel is what we would also feel towards a beloved parent.....the fear that we had displeased them or let them down in some way. Being afraid of him is not something God has ever wanted. We are so far away form what he intended for us at the beginning but he must deal with rebellion in his own way.

He gave humankind a wonderful start but they threw it all back in his face. All he wanted was for us to love him and obey him as the caring Father that he was, but after the devil has finished with the human race, he will be left with "few" who truly know him and love him for all that he has done to secure our future....it meant sacrificing a good bit of the here and now, but in the long run, it will be so worth it.

[/quote]

 

[Deeje]

Why no reply?

We have already answered this question Frank.

 

[Frank Goad]

We have already answered this question Frank.

Ok sorry.

 

[Frank Goad]

In 2 Corinthians 5:6-9 it says we can be absent from our bodies.And in verse 9 it says some people are already absent and with the lord.That reminded me of Ecclesiastes 12:7.Sorry if I have posted this in some other forum.Before this one.What I am not getting is 2 Corinthians 5:9 and Ecclesiastes 12:7.

Deejee.What is really getting to me is verse 9 of 2 Corinthians 5:6-9.And Ecclesiastes 12:7.Verse 9 makes no sense.Can you post the link to my other post that already explained verse 9? So I don't waste everyone's time?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Life is a gift...death is a curse. We have no inbuilt program for death, but we sure as heck have one to keep living.



It is all God ever offered us...everlasting life or everlasting death.....these are opposites, which if you check out nature...everything has an equal opposite. It speaks of God's perfect balance in all his creation.

The Bible is our guidebook....because when you study it...I mean really study it, you find a depth of wisdom, and a view of life and death that is not really visible on the surface. The problem I feel, is that most who identify as "Christians" have never really studied the Bible for themselves. They usually have a pastor or minister or priest who is supposed to know it all for them....they just rock up to church and do their weekly duty.....going through the ritual but learning very little....and then they go home feeling good about that......some even turn their church services into something akin to a rock concert....but that is not the kind of Christianity that Jesus taught.
Jesus taught us the way to everlasting life....

John 17:3....
"This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ."
The only way to get to know God and his son is to spend time with them.....learning about their thoughts on things and putting into practice the things they teach. All of it is for our benefit.



Mercy and love are totally related....God's justice is perfect as is his love. All his qualities are in perfect balance. Please don't equate indulgence with love. Love means that God will act with the best interests of his creation at heart. I believe that those who wish to impose their will on others, (to their detriment) or even on God, (as if he should be ignored) will come to disappointment.



God's love for those who will do the right thing by each other, the planet, and God himself, is demonstrated when he eliminates from existence those who have no intention of ever following his commands. The disobedient ones spoil it for everyone else. They create bones of contention that need not exist.

Can you imagine a military troupe where everyone ignored their commanding officer and instead chose to do their own thing...? Following orders is the first rule of any successful army. Utter chaos would result if that was not the case. Jehovah is a God of order....we are his troupes.



Nothing of an external nature can separate us from God.....things of an internal nature is something else again.
Our treacherous heart can lead us away from God imagining that we know better than he does or that we must run ahead of him and make known our own thoughts and ideas.....He has never used anyone but his appointed servants to disseminate his wishes to the rest of his household. For Israel, it was Moses and Joshua....for the first century Christians, it was Jesus and his apostles.....in these last days, it is Jesus' "faithful and discreet slave" who are used to feed his fellow slaves their "food at the proper time". (Matthew 24:45) "Who really is" that slave? That is for us to determine, though God is guiding the process. (John 6:44; 65)



You lost me on that one....I can't really follow your train of thought there...



The spirit of life is God's to give and to take away as he sees fit.
Our spirit is either keeping us alive (animating our physical body)....or once it is extinguished, leads to our death. It doesn't go anywhere. It begins in our lungs at birth and it dies with us once our last breath is gone.


Again not really following you here...

I am not afraid of death because death is just like sleeping. There is no conscious part of man that survives death. It is the opposite of life. If God left me it would be because I had broken his commands....since that is highly unlikely, I cannot imagine me leaving God or him leaving me....I love him too much for that.



Obedience to God is like putting your full trust in him as your Father.....one who will not let you fall but support you through the hardest times. His tough love is good for us because its tests our mettle. It shows God that we genuinely love him, not just for all the good things, but in spite of the bad things.

If you remember the trials of Job, then you will remember who brought those trials on him and the accusations made about the genuineness of his love for his God. Each trial was a test of Job's love and loyalty....he passed with flying colors. But will we?



LOVE. When you see God's creation and the beauty of it stirs your heart to intense gratitude, and draws you to the one who created it all....the attention to detail...the very perfection of things that never needed to be perfect...like a snowflake for example....or the creatures who share our world but we cannot see with the naked eye.....and then contrast the smallness of those things with the enormity of the Universe and we start to see what an incredible Being the Creator is. I am in awe of him.



From my perspective, that is completely false. God is the Creator of those who don't even believe in him. They don't want to know him and they certainly don't want to obey him...but that doesn't mean that they will not account to him for the life he's given them.

People are so quick to take their lives for granted....but the truth is every one of us is a miracle....out of all the eggs and sperm that our parents could have turned into human beings.....we were the ones who actually made it outside of the womb to take that first breath and become a human soul. The odds against us being here are astronomical...yet how many truly appreciate life itself?



All of us are the product of our parent's gene pool....at birth we are a blank canvas....genetics and environment play a role in who we become, but so do our individual choices. All have the same opportunity to come to God. He searches for us as much as we search for him.


Like I had no purpose in being here. Life would be meaningless and there would be nothing to look forward to.
Watching greedy humans destroy the world would weigh heavily on me. Without God nothing would get fixed and nothing would make sense.



Its not me accusing anyone of anything....Jesus said that 'many will seek to get in through that narrow door but will not be able'.....they simply don't want to make the effort.
Jesus also told us why....

Matthew 7:13-14.....
"Go in through the narrow gate, because broad is the gate and spacious is the road leading off into destruction, and many are going in through it; 14 whereas narrow is the gate and cramped the road leading off into life, and few are finding it."

There never was going to be 'many' on the right road because its not the easy path.....those who want the easy way are headed in another direction.



The only fear we feel is what we would also feel towards a beloved parent.....the fear that we had displeased them or let them down in some way. Being afraid of him is not something God has ever wanted. We are so far away form what he intended for us at the beginning but he must deal with rebellion in his own way.

He gave humankind a wonderful start but they threw it all back in his face. All he wanted was for us to love him and obey him as the caring Father that he was, but after the devil has finished with the human race, he will be left with "few" who truly know him and love him for all that he has done to secure our future....it meant sacrificing a good bit of the here and now, but in the long run, it will be so worth it.

Can I ask two straight forward questions.

Is JW correct out of All Christians (people with relationship with Christ Only; All denominations aside)?

How do I ask this. If god gave you a sword to kill someone who disobeyed him, would you do it?