Does Elisha use magic?

[Kristoffer]

In 2.book of kings 4;38-41 we read:

"Death in the Pot
38 Elisha returned to Gilgal and there was a famine in that region. While the company of the prophets was meeting with him, he said to his servant, “Put on the large pot and cook some stew for these prophets.”

39 One of them went out into the fields to gather herbs and found a wild vine and picked as many of its gourds as his garment could hold. When he returned, he cut them up into the pot of stew, though no one knew what they were. 40 The stew was poured out for the men, but as they began to eat it, they cried out, “Man of God, there is death in the pot!” And they could not eat it.

41 Elisha said, “Get some flour.” He put it into the pot and said, “Serve it to the people to eat.” And there was nothing harmful in the pot."

Verse 41 are of importance here, because I wonder how Christians can explain this in other ways than that Elisha was using magic? To me it is as Elisha uses magic, something that isn't allowed in jewish faith.

Can someopne explain to me how this could be understood in other ways than Elisha using some sort of magic?

 

[Rival]

Could not the herbs or whatever have been poison that was somehow neutralised by the flour? I wouldn't say this is necessarily magic.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

In 2.book of kings 4;38-41 we read:

"Death in the Pot
38 Elisha returned to Gilgal and there was a famine in that region. While the company of the prophets was meeting with him, he said to his servant, “Put on the large pot and cook some stew for these prophets.”

39 One of them went out into the fields to gather herbs and found a wild vine and picked as many of its gourds as his garment could hold. When he returned, he cut them up into the pot of stew, though no one knew what they were. 40 The stew was poured out for the men, but as they began to eat it, they cried out, “Man of God, there is death in the pot!” And they could not eat it.

41 Elisha said, “Get some flour.” He put it into the pot and said, “Serve it to the people to eat.” And there was nothing harmful in the pot."

Verse 41 are of importance here, because I wonder how Christians can explain this in other ways than that Elisha was using magic? To me it is as Elisha uses magic, something that isn't allowed in jewish faith.

Can someopne explain to me how this could be understood in other ways than Elisha using some sort of magic?

"how it could be understood ...?" Sure.

First:

bitter apples. Popularly called the "Apple of Sodom." The small yellow melon of the citrllus colcynthus is a strong purgative and has been known to be fatal; identified as such already in LXX; see Feliks, Plant World of the Bible, 202; idem, Nature and Man in the Bible, 67-69; and J.P.Harland. BA 6 (1943), 49-52.

- The Anchor Bible: II Kings; a new translation with introduction and commentary by Mordechai Cogan and Hatim Tadmor

Perhaps, as @Anatolia suggests above, the addition of flour mitigates the danger.

 

[Ingledsva]

In 2.book of kings 4;38-41 we read:

"Death in the Pot
38 Elisha returned to Gilgal and there was a famine in that region. While the company of the prophets was meeting with him, he said to his servant, “Put on the large pot and cook some stew for these prophets.”

39 One of them went out into the fields to gather herbs and found a wild vine and picked as many of its gourds as his garment could hold. When he returned, he cut them up into the pot of stew, though no one knew what they were. 40 The stew was poured out for the men, but as they began to eat it, they cried out, “Man of God, there is death in the pot!” And they could not eat it.

41 Elisha said, “Get some flour.” He put it into the pot and said, “Serve it to the people to eat.” And there was nothing harmful in the pot."

Verse 41 are of importance here, because I wonder how Christians can explain this in other ways than that Elisha was using magic? To me it is as Elisha uses magic, something that isn't allowed in jewish faith.

Can someopne explain to me how this could be understood in other ways than Elisha using some sort of magic?

Actually they use magic throughout the Bible, - and we have surviving examples in Jewish museums.

*

 

[Kristoffer]

If it is not magic: whys that?

If it is magic: whys that?

Would like a discussion about the subject

 

[Ingledsva]

If it is not magic: whys that?

If it is magic: whys that?

Would like a discussion about the subject

It is magic - Elisha is a Sorcerer. Elisha was a student of the Sorcerer Elijah. - Read his story from when he claims to be the replacement for Elijah. He does magic from that point on, parting water, raising the dead, healing, the bears, and he appears to like to use normal ingredients. In one story he uses salt in his concoction added to the water to stop the death from it, and in this one he uses flour/meal mix.

By the way that story of 2 SHE-bears, tearing apart 42 boys may have a connection to Sacred names and the calendar. In the Brauronia Ritual - sacred to Artemis Callisto, the Moon as Bear Goddess, - whom the Bible tells us the whole world worshiped, - 2 girls dressed as bears rushed out to attack the boys at the Midsummer Festival. 42 is the number of days from beginning of the month which is the prep for the Midsummer Marriage and Death Orgy, to Midsummer Day.

42 is also the number of jurymen whom judged Osiris.

Clement of Alexandria tells us there were 42 books of the Hermetic Mysteries.

*

 

[Kristoffer]

It is magic - Elisha is a Sorcerer. Elisha was a student of the Sorcerer Elijah. - Read his story from when he claims to be the replacement for Elijah. He does magic from that point on, parting water, raising the dead, healing, the bears, and he appears to like to use normal ingredients. In one story he uses salt in his concoction added to the water to stop the death from it, and in this one he uses flour/meal mix.

By the way that story of 2 SHE-bears, tearing apart 42 boys may have a connection to Sacred names and the calendar. In the Brauronia Ritual - sacred to Artemis Callisto, the Moon as Bear Goddess, - whom the Bible tells us the whole world worshiped, - 2 girls dressed as bears rushed out to attack the boys at the Midsummer Festival. 42 is the number of days from beginning of the month which is the prep for the Midsummer Marriage and Death Orgy, to Midsummer Day.

42 is also the number of jurymen whom judged Osiris.

Clement of Alexandria tells us there were 42 books of the Hermetic Mysteries.

*

Thank you for answer - just what I was looking after.

Anyone have any other perspectives on the subject?

 

[Pegg]

In 2.book of kings 4;38-41 we read:

"Death in the Pot
38 Elisha returned to Gilgal and there was a famine in that region. While the company of the prophets was meeting with him, he said to his servant, “Put on the large pot and cook some stew for these prophets.”

39 One of them went out into the fields to gather herbs and found a wild vine and picked as many of its gourds as his garment could hold. When he returned, he cut them up into the pot of stew, though no one knew what they were. 40 The stew was poured out for the men, but as they began to eat it, they cried out, “Man of God, there is death in the pot!” And they could not eat it.

41 Elisha said, “Get some flour.” He put it into the pot and said, “Serve it to the people to eat.” And there was nothing harmful in the pot."

Verse 41 are of importance here, because I wonder how Christians can explain this in other ways than that Elisha was using magic? To me it is as Elisha uses magic, something that isn't allowed in jewish faith.

Can someopne explain to me how this could be understood in other ways than Elisha using some sort of magic?

The gourd was a poisonous fruiting plant native to the Mediterranean area (look up colocynth)...the person who picked it did not realise it was a poisonous plant and he put it in the stew. When the men tasted its bitterness they feared they would be poisoned. Elisha saved the stew miraculously by Gods power. When a prophet of God performs a miracle, we dont put it in the classification of being 'magic'

 

[Ingledsva]

The gourd was a poisonous fruiting plant native to the Mediterranean area (look up colocynth)...the person who picked it did not realise it was a poisonous plant and he put it in the stew. When the men tasted its bitterness they feared they would be poisoned. Elisha saved the stew miraculously by Gods power. When a prophet of God performs a miracle, we dont put it in the classification of being 'magic'

None the less it is magic, - the other side uses their Gods name and power too.

*

 

[Pegg]

None the less it is magic, - the other side uses their Gods name and power too.

*

i guess any supernatural power can be viewed as magic. Whether its black magic or not depends on which God/god is behind it.

 

[Politesse]

"Magic" is just someone else's rituals and knowledge. Or miracles. By the anthropological definition, Elijah's trick would obviously apply. But I doubt the man himself would agree.