Does God welcome everyone into heaven?

[Muffled]

Jesus did not write the story so I have no problem if it isn't true. To me whatever Baha'u'llah, Abdu'l Baha, and the Guardian wrote is true, because I am a Baha'i who is faithful to the Covenant of Baha'u'llah.

I never accused you of not thinking for yourself. You think too much but about the same things over and over again.

I believe that is because you don't have the Holy Spirit to help you discern what is true.

 

[Muffled]

Yes, if the details aren't important, the Baha'i Faith is great... and so are all the other religions. Like you say, Christianity has some nice music. Who cares about the details. I can join them and sing away. Or, I can join the Hare Krishnas and sing and dance. I don't care about the details about what they believe. But, we all know that religious leaders lie and all religions believe different things. Checking out what people believe and why is important. And I don't think that not to worry about the details isn't what the Baha'is mean when they say to personally investigate the truth. So let's see... Detail... Ishmael or Isaac taken to be sacrificed? Who cares. Jesus rose physically from the dead? Not important. Without Jesus, God will send people to hell? Yeah, like that's nothing to concern myself over. Many false prophets will come? So, what's the big deal? Yeah, you're right. Nothing to worry about. Why sweat the little unimportant details.

I have a daughter who loves her sin and won't go near a church but she likes to sing the hymns on occasion.

 

[Trailblazer]

In that case II believe the B men wrote a lot of stuff off the top of their heads and the B writings are worthless. I thank God I have the Holy Spirit to help me discern what is God's true word and what is not.

You can choose to believe whatever you want to believe, that is the gift of free will God gave us all.
I thank God I have recognized Baha'u'llah because that has allowed me to discern what is true.

 

[Trailblazer]

I believe that is because you don't have the Holy Spirit to help you discern what is true.

I believe I have the Holy Spirit guiding me to discern what is true.

 

[Nakosis]

It is up to us as what we would choose for the next life, to be a rock or a human with all the limbs the ability of all senses to embrace all of creation.

The punishment is what we do not take with us in virtue, we will be aware of that neglect in a state only God can change us from. In this life we have a choice.

What a bounty we have been given, no animals, but us humans on this earth, have that given choice.

Regards Tony

Is this later part Baha'i or personal?

I guess I've no certainty about an afterlife but this sounds closer to Hindu belief than Abrahamic.

 

[Trailblazer]

I guess I've no certainty about an afterlife but this sounds closer to Hindu belief than Abrahamic.

Why do you think that?

 

[Nakosis]

Why do you think that?

I thought Baha'i parallels Abrahamic beliefs more. Yet Tony's view seems somewhat Hindu. So just wondering where Baha'i and Abrahamic views about the afterlife differ.

 

[Trailblazer]

I thought Baha'i parallels Abrahamic beliefs more. Yet Tony's view seems somewhat Hindu. So just wondering where Baha'i and Abrahamic views about the afterlife differ.

I think the main difference between Abrahamic religions and Hinduism is that Hindus believe in reincarnation and Abrahamic religions teach that we only live once on this earth. Judaism, Christianity and Islam have different beliefs about the afterlife, some of which differ markedly. Although they all teach that there is a heaven and hell, what that actually consists of is not the same in all the Abrahamic religions, and even within those religions all the believers do not agree on what the afterlife will be like. By contrast, most Baha'is have a similar belief about the afterlife since it is clearly delineated in Baha'i Writings..

I am in the process of writing a long answer to a Muslim who posted on this thread which will describe what Bahais believe about the afterlife, and I will let you know when I post that. Meanwhile, here is a good video that explains heaven and hell from a Baha'i perspective. Please bear in mind it is not an "official" Baha'i video, but I think it covers the essential beliefs very well

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Is this later part Baha'i or personal?

I guess I've no certainty about an afterlife but this sounds closer to Hindu belief than Abrahamic.

It is based on what I have read in Bahai writings and I see is also reflected in what I have read that was attriuted to Krishna.

Heaven and hell are states of being, heaven being closer to God the Sun, Hell being states of remoteness from that source leading to death or darkness.

Our soul is eternal, I see in the Holy Wirings of all Faiths that this life is a chance for a birth into a state of consciousness that transcends limitations.

We are told that death is a transition, not a seperation the next word surrounds us is part of us and death is birth into this next reality.

This life gives us the chance of obtaining spiritual limbs for our spiritual journey to come. This is why Jesus offered we must be born again. Born from flesh pursuits to spiritual understandings.

I see that the west and east can learn from each other, my intent here was not to seperate that possibility, as such I have chosen more silence on RF.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I thought Baha'i parallels Abrahamic beliefs more. Yet Tony's view seems somewhat Hindu. So just wondering where Baha'i and Abrahamic views about the afterlife differ.

I see the only place they differ is in our own state of consciousness, our nature, our nurture and our choices.

Other than that, I see pure white light shines upon us all and can be seen by all. Where it differs, is the prisim of our consciousness, that chooses to separate that light source into many God's.

We have so much to learn, but we choose to negate sources of knowledge over preference to our own.

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

@ Nakosis , below that post I was referring to that explains some Baha’i beliefs about the afterlife.

Hello there hope you are doing well, very interesting question, but also complex, but i am going to try and give you my perspective and sorry if its too much to read

.

Thanks for your comprehensive answers. That is a lot to respond to so I am going to pick out some parts to respond to and explain what I believe and point out some similarities and some differences.

According to the Quran, God will curse those who are disbelievers and die while they are still disbeliever (2:161). They will remain in hell forever, their punishment will not be alleviated, nor will they be reprieved (2:162). On the contrary, those who are faithful to God and do righteous deeds (98:7) will be rewarded the Gardens of Eden. God will be pleased with them, and they will be pleased with Him (98:8).

According to my beliefs, those who are faithful to God and do righteous deeds will be rewarded (see passage below) but my religion does not say anything specific about nonbelievers that I can find as far as them going to hell and remaining in hell forever, as you said. Here is one quote that I found that is considered ‘authoritative Writings’ of the Baha’i Faith:

"This cycle is the cycle of favor and not of justice. Therefore, those whose deeds are clean and pure, even though they are not believers, will not be deprived of the divine mercy; but perfection is in faith and deeds. Undoubtedly, a person, who is not a believer, but whose deeds and morals are good, is far better than one who claims his belief in words but, who, in actions, is a follower of satan. The Blessed Beauty says, 'My humiliation is not in my imprisonment, which, by my life, is an exaltation to me; nay rather, it is in the deeds of my friends, who attribute themselves to us and commit that which causes my heart and pen to weep!'" (Attributed to 'Abdu'l-Bahá, Star of the West, vol. 9, issue 3, p. 29)

Baha’is do not believe that heaven is a geographical location such as a Garden of Eden. We believe that heaven and hell are states of the soul, heaven is nearness to God and hell is distance from God. A Baha’i once asked the Guardian of the Baha’i Faith (Shoghi Effendi) how to get to heaven, and here was his answer...

"To 'get to heaven' as you say is dependent on two things--faith in the Manifestation of God in His Day, in other words in this age in Bahá'u'lláh; and good deeds, in other words living to the best of our ability a noble life and doing unto others as we would be done by. But we must always remember that our existence and everything we have or ever will have is dependent upon the mercy of God and His bounty, and therefore He can accept into His heaven, which is really nearness to Him, even the lowliest if He pleases. We always have the hope of receiving His mercy if we reach out for it."
(From a letter written on behalf of Shoghi Effendi to an individual believer, January 12, 1957)
Lights of Guidance (second part): A Bahá'í Reference File

That letter indicates that even nonbelievers could get to heaven if God had mercy upon them and chose to draw them near to Him.

What will happen to the followers of the previous monotheistic faiths?

Islam recognizes the freedom and other rights of the followers of the previous religions; also, has ordered Muslims to hold them in considerable respect [1]. Moreover, Islam knows those followers eligible for salvation; it all depends on one’s deeds and faith in God. In Surah al-Baqarah it is said that: “Indeed, the faithful, the Jews, the Christians, and the Sabaeans—those of them who have faith in Allah and the Last Day and act righteously—they shall have their reward from their Lord, and they will have no fear, nor will they grieve” (2:62). In other words, according to the Islamic principles, it is disagreeable to punish those who have not received the message of Islam either before its rise or after that, and God will never do that.

The Baha’i Faith also recognizes the freedom and other rights of the followers of the previous religions and Baha’is to hold them in considerable respect. Moreover, what happens to them in the afterlife will depend upon their deeds and faith in God. That letter above addresses deeds, and the following passages address faith. Faith is associated with recognition of the one true God and Baha’is believe that requires recognition of the Manifestation of God for this day (which is the Messenger of God), as that letter above says, but the passage below says that if we recognize the one true God that will confer the gift of everlasting life, so that indicates that other believers who believe in the one true God will have everlasting life.

“Death proffereth unto every confident believer the cup that is life indeed. It bestoweth joy, and is the bearer of gladness. It conferreth the gift of everlasting life.

As to those that have tasted of the fruit of man’s earthly existence, which is the recognition of the one true God, exalted be His glory, their life hereafter is such as We are unable to describe. The knowledge thereof is with God, alone, the Lord of all worlds.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 345-346

“They that are the followers of the one true God shall, the moment they depart out of this life, experience such joy and gladness as would be impossible to describe…. Well is it with him that hath quaffed the choice and incorruptible wine of faith through the gracious favor and the manifold bounties of Him Who is the Lord of all Faiths…” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 171

According to that letter above, to get the guarantee of heaven, one needs both faith in Baha’u’llah and good deeds, but I do not think that means that only Baha’is will be in heaven because that would not be according to God’s justice and it would not make sense, in light of the fact that Jews, Christians and Muslims also follow the one true God. I believe that there are different grades and stations in heaven, so souls will be at different levels of spiritual development depending upon their faith and conduct. Baha’is also believe that there is a special place called the Crimson Ark that has been prepared by God for those who aid His Cause, which we believe is the Cause of Baha’u’llah.

Are all Muslims allowed to enter heaven?

In Surah Al-i-Imran it is said that anyone who follows a religion other than Islam will be among the losers in the Hereafter (3:85). So, being a Muslim, on its own, is the prerequisite for entering heaven; but it is not enough. The key to the eternal salvation and heaven is doing good deeds. Whoever submits to Islam but does not do any good deeds will not go to heaven.

As you can see from what I said and quoted above, that belief is similar in the Baha’i Faith, only we believe those who recognize Baha’u’llah will be the winners in the afterlife. Nevertheless, good deeds are also vital.

“The essence of faith is fewness of words and abundance of deeds; he whose words exceed his deeds, know verily his death is better than his life.” Tablets of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 156

O Son of Being! Bring thyself to account each day ere thou art summoned to a reckoning; for death, unheralded, shall come upon thee and thou shalt be called to give account for thy deeds. The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah

To have faith in God deep in the heart, one should obey God and his messenger, Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) (49:14), and this should be reflected in one’s conduct [2].

Similarly, for a Baha’i, obedience to Baha’u’llah is very important:

“The beginning of all things is the knowledge of God, and the end of all things is strict observance of whatsoever hath been sent down from the empyrean of the Divine Will that pervadeth all that is in the heavens and all that is on the earth.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 5

How about disbelievers?

Among disbelievers (Kafir), there are those who deny the truth and will never submit to the divine guidance. These will never enter heaven, as mentioned earlier. There are also non-Muslims who have not received the message of Islam, and they are not responsible for not receiving it, but they will surely accept Islam as soon as they know about it. These will not be punished and will not go to hell since the Quran says: “We do not punish (any community) until We have sent (to them) an apostle” (17:15).

I already addressed what I believe about nonbelievers above. It is somewhat of a gray area, but suffice to say that since Baha’is believe that heaven is nearness to God and hell is distance from God, you can do your own math. For whatever reasons, nonbelievers deny the truth about God, but I think that God takes those reasons into consideration. As such, I believe that if a nonbeliever was not really capable of belief in God the All-Knowing God would know that and they might receive His mercy in the afterlife.

According to my beliefs, believers (or maybe even nonbelievers) who have not received the message of Baha’u’llah are not accountable as long as they followed the rules of conduct as laid down by Jesus and always walked in the straight path, so they will not be punished or go to hell.

"Then as to what thou hast asked me for pious people who died before they heard the Voice of this Manifestation. Listen: Those who have mounted to God before hearing the Voice, if they followed the rules of conduct as laid down by Jesus and always walked in the straight path,they have obtained this Dazzling Light after their rising to the Kingdom of God. I pray God to lift the veil for thee and to corroborate by the spirit of experience, so that all may be evident to thee, by the Holy Spirit of God." ('Abdu'l-Bahá, Tablets of 'Abdu'l-Bahá, p. 478)

 

[CG Didymus]

Scribes wrote the OT but the Bab and Baha'u'llah wrote their own scriptures, so guess which is more accurate?

Have you read Genesis? I imagine probably not. If you did you would see how Isaac fits into the story and Ishmael is a secondary character. But, then again, to you and me, it's just a story and is probably mostly fictional. Like did the Scribes follow Abraham around and take notes and later wrote his biography? Probably not. I think that Genesis was probably compiled from oral traditions. Stories that meant something to the people of Israel. And that is my point... It's part of the Jewish story. Ishmael is not that important. Isaac is. For the Baha'is and Islam, they rewrite the story because they do have a strong connection to Ishmael. But is any of it historical?

 

[CG Didymus]

Imo, you need to SEPARATE from these other people and think for yourself.

You DO have to think for yourself

I never accused you of not thinking for yourself.

I have no interest in other religions and I do not need them for anything at all. I do not need to compare the Baha'i Faith to other religions that 'I believe' have been relegated to history. The Baha'i Faith has everything I will ever need.

It is irrelevant to me. I do not care but you seem to care. IF you did not care you would not keep bringing it up.
How many times do I have to tell you I do not care about the Bible?

Yet you are here on a forum debating religion? And quite often quoting the Bible and giving Baha'i interpretations of the Bible.

I see that you are STILL judging the Baha'i Faith by the Bahais.

Yes, I am. Because if Baha'is can't live up to their own teachings, what good are the teachings. There are way too many "inactive" Baha'is? That's not a good sign. I think it is related to the general beliefs that Baha'is tell people. One world. One people please. All religions are one. A new day has dawned. The Promised One of All Ages has come and so on. Then, they join, get disillusioned by the deeper teachings, the details, and stop participating. And participate in what? Other than the nineteen day Feast what do Baha'is do? A yearly fast, like Islam. Obligatory prayers, like Islam. A pilgrimage, like Islam. Once a person joins, what is expected of them? Do Baha'is have courses on learning the deeper things? Or, are most people left on their own? Is there things for them to do to help promote peace and unity? Or, do most Baha'is sit on the sidelines and let other, more capable, Baha'is do most of the teaching?

I hope it is better than when I was involved with them. Like I said, I went with my friends to Indian Reservations on Baha'i Mass Teaching Projects. Not many Baha'is participated and not many people joined. For those that did join, there was little or no follow up, so most faded away. What are Baha'is doing now? Do they still expect "entry by troops"? 'Cause that's what they expected 50 years ago, but the mass teaching projects fizzled out. Did they try them again? Do Baha'is still go on teaching trips to the Reservations? Baha'is used to tell me that whole villages in other countries became Baha'is. What happened to them? Are they still Baha'i? Are they living by Baha'is laws? There was a lot of fervor back then. Like entry by troops and the lesser peace were going to happen very soon. What happened? What are Baha'i saying now?

 

[Trailblazer]

I think that Genesis was probably compiled from oral traditions. Stories that meant something to the people of Israel. And that is my point... It's part of the Jewish story. Ishmael is not that important. Isaac is. For the Baha'is and Islam, they rewrite the story because they do have a strong connection to Ishmael. But is any of it historical?

If it was compiled from oral tradition how accurate was it? How do you know the scribes got it right? If the 'story' says it was Issac then Jewish people are going to 'believe' that is important.

Baha'is did not rewrite the story to make it about Ishmael, we simply believe that is who it was about according to the Qur'an and the Writings of Baha'u'llah.

The Bahá'ís believe what is in the Bible to be true in substance. This does not mean that every word recorded in that Book is to be taken literally and treated as the authentic saying of a Prophet. A striking example is given in the account of the sacrifice which Abraham was called upon to make. The Guardian of the Faith confirms that the record in the Qur'an and the Writings of Bahá'u'lláh, namely that it was Ishmael, and not Isaac as stated in the Old Testament, whom Abraham was to sacrifice, is to be upheld. In one of His Tablets 'Abdu'l-Bahá refers to this discrepancy, and explains that, from a spiritual point of view, it is irrelevant which son was involved. The essential part of the story is that Abraham was willing to obey God's command to sacrifice His son. Thus, although the account in the Torah is inaccurate in detail, it is true in substance....

...The Bahá'ís believe that God's Revelation is under His care and protection and that the essence, or essential elements, of what His Manifestations intended to convey has been recorded and preserved in Their Holy Books. However, as the sayings of the ancient Prophets were written down some time later, we cannot categorically state, as we do in the case of the Writings of Bahá'u'lláh, that the words and phrases attributed to Them are Their exact words
(9 August 1984 to an individual believer)
The Bible: Extracts on the Old and New Testaments​

 

[Trailblazer]

Yet you are here on a forum debating religion? And quite often quoting the Bible and giving Baha'i interpretations of the Bible.

I do not have any interest in debating about religion, I just answer posts that are posted to me.

Yes, I am. Because if Baha'is can't live up to their own teachings, what good are the teachings. There are way too many "inactive" Baha'is? That's not a good sign. I think it is related to the general beliefs that Baha'is tell people. One world. One people please. All religions are one. A new day has dawned. The Promised One of All Ages has come and so on. Then, they join, get disillusioned by the deeper teachings, the details, and stop participating. And participate in what? Other than the nineteen day Feast what do Baha'is do? A yearly fast, like Islam. Obligatory prayers, like Islam. A pilgrimage, like Islam. Once a person joins, what is expected of them? Do Baha'is have courses on learning the deeper things? Or, are most people left on their own? Is there things for them to do to help promote peace and unity? Or, do most Baha'is sit on the sidelines and let other, more capable, Baha'is do most of the teaching?

How do you know they are not living up to their own teachings? As for the inactive Baha'is, nobody knows why they are inactive. Do all Christians attend Church? I agree that it is not good that a few Bahais carry the load, but that is not the fault of the Baha'i Faith, it is a human problem.

Baha'is are constantly "doing things" in my local community. I do not know a lot about their activities but I am constantly getting e-mails about what they are doing, even though they cannot meet in person anymore. I also get the Feast letters with letters from the NSA and the UHJ about what Baha'is are doing nationwide. They are doing a lot of things.

I hope it is better than when I was involved with them. Like I said, I went with my friends to Indian Reservations on Baha'i Mass Teaching Projects. Not many Baha'is participated and not many people joined. For those that did join, there was little or no follow up, so most faded away. What are Baha'is doing now? Do they still expect "entry by troops"? 'Cause that's what they expected 50 years ago, but the mass teaching projects fizzled out. Did they try them again? Do Baha'is still go on teaching trips to the Reservations? Baha'is used to tell me that whole villages in other countries became Baha'is. What happened to them? Are they still Baha'i? Are they living by Baha'is laws? There was a lot of fervor back then. Like entry by troops and the lesser peace were going to happen very soon. What happened? What are Baha'i saying now?

It is not the same as it used to be in the old days. If you want to know what the Bahais are doing now, maybe tere is a way to find out. I would not assume they are doing nothing. It does not seem to me that mass teaching projects are going on anymore, because the focus is now community building. I think there should be more teaching but since I am no involved in the community I do not have a voice.

 

[CG Didymus]

I have a daughter who loves her sin and won't go near a church but she likes to sing the hymns on occasion.

What can you do? But since nobody is perfect and all have sinned, and continue to do some sins, it's hard to get people to take that kind of spiritual/religious people seriously. So I don't know which is worse and which one is better... to not pretend to believe and enjoy the sinning. Or, say you believe do the sins and try and convince yourself you're right with God? Of course, the Christian is supposed to confess their sins and repent, but if they keep doing the same sins over and over, they're not really repenting. So what's the answer?

At least your daughter has the hymns. I would think she'll get tired of some of the sinful things she likes to do. Then, maybe, if all she does is little sins, maybe... she'll come back to church and join all the rest of the religious sinners. Actually, I know it's an empty life without God and living for pleasure. But, it's got to be pretty empty, or more like a guilt filled life living as if a person is a good Christian and continually doing sinful things. What do you think? Do those kinds of Christians just kind of get numb inside, so they don't even feel guilty anymore?

 

[CG Didymus]

If it was compiled from oral tradition how accurate was it? How do you know the scribes got it right? If the 'story' says it was Issac then Jewish people are going to 'believe' that is important.

Hmmm? Either the story is exactly right. From Adam and Eve on down. The Tower of Babel, the Flood and all the rest. Or, all people had their Creation myths and stories of how they came to be. The Jewish story has Isaac. Ishmael was only important to show that God could give Abraham and his wife a child of their own even in their old age. That's part of the story. Ishmael and his mother were sent away.

Genesis 16:1 Now Sarai, Abram’s wife, had borne him no children. But she had an Egyptian slave named Hagar;
2 so she said to Abram, “The LORD has kept me from having children. Go, sleep with my slave; perhaps I can build a family through her.” Abram agreed to what Sarai said.

Genesis 18:9 “Where is your wife Sarah?” they asked him. “There, in the tent,” he said.
10 Then one of them said, “I will surely return to you about this time next year, and Sarah your wife will have a son.” Now Sarah was listening at the entrance to the tent, which was behind him.
11 Abraham and Sarah were already very old, and Sarah was past the age of childbearing.

Genesis 21:1 Now the LORD was gracious to Sarah as he had said, and the LORD did for Sarah what he had promised.
2 Sarah became pregnant and bore a son to Abraham in his old age, at the very time God had promised him...
8 The child grew and was weaned, and on the day Isaac was weaned Abraham held a great feast.
9 But Sarah saw that the son whom Hagar the Egyptian had borne to Abraham was mocking,
10 and she said to Abraham, “Get rid of that slave woman and her son, for that woman’s son will never share in the inheritance with my son Isaac.”
11 The matter distressed Abraham greatly because it concerned his son.
12 But God said to him, “Do not be so distressed about the boy and your slave woman. Listen to whatever Sarah tells you, because it is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.

Genesis 22:1 Some time later God tested Abraham. He said to him, “Abraham!” “Here I am,” he replied.
2 Then God said, “Take your son, your only son, whom you love—Isaac—and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on a mountain I will show you”...
9 When they reached the place God had told him about, Abraham built an altar there and arranged the wood on it. He bound his son Isaac and laid him on the altar, on top of the wood.
10 Then he reached out his hand and took the knife to slay his son.
11 But the angel of the LORD called out to him from heaven, “Abraham! Abraham!” “Here I am,” he replied.
12 “Do not lay a hand on the boy,” he said. “Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son.”​

Isaac goes on to become the father of Jacob, whose name is changed to Israel. His sons are the children of Israel.

 

[CG Didymus]

I do not have any interest in debating about religion, I just answer posts that are posted to me.

I know. But this is called "General Religious Debates." Do you like "General Religious Discussions" better? And you say I worry too much about trivial details. And I'm paraphrasing, so don't come back and say that you never said I worry too much about "trivial" details. And don't say you weren't thinking that, because I know how picky you are. And, don't say that I don't know what you're thinking, I know. I don't. Your right. You're always have to be right. Oh God, I can hear you now, "I don't always have to be right." Yeah, yeah, whatever.

 

[Trailblazer]

Hmmm? Either the story is exactly right. From Adam and Eve on down. The Tower of Babel, the Flood and all the rest. Or, all people had their Creation myths and stories of how they came to be. The Jewish story has Isaac. Ishmael was only important to show that God could give Abraham and his wife a child of their own even in their old age. That's part of the story. Ishmael and his mother were sent away.

I do not believe it is an all or nothing, all is true or nothing is true.... I believe the stories have spiritual significance, not that they actually happened, although maybe some of them did happen... Who knows? Only God knows, and the Manifestations of God know because they got their knowledge from God.

 

[Trailblazer]

I know. But this is called "General Religious Debates." Do you like "General Religious Discussions" better? And you say I worry too much about trivial details. And I'm paraphrasing, so don't come back and say that you never said I worry too much about "trivial" details. And don't say you weren't thinking that, because I know how picky you are. And, don't say that I don't know what you're thinking, I know. I don't. Your right. You're always have to be right. Oh God, I can hear you now, "I don't always have to be right." Yeah, yeah, whatever.

Yes, I like discussions better as I do not like to argue over who is right and who is wrong.
I said in my opinion you worry too much about details, but I never called them trivial.