Does Islam agree with Psychiatry and Psychology on schizophrenia?

[columbus]

I don't "believe" a lightbulb will turn on when I flip a switch and close the electrical circuit.

Really?

I do. I believe that if I flip a switch completing the circuit the lightbulb will turn on.
The fact that I have lots of evidence on the subject doesn't change the fact that I believe the bulb will light up.
Tom

 

[Link]

I think that schizophrenia is a real illness caused by an imbalance of chemicals in the brain, that can be treated with medication

But I also believe in demon possession

I believe the two are often confused but that 99% of the time it is schizophrenia

Although I have been diagnosed with schizophrenia I believe I am haunted by a demon

Over the past few days my condition has rapidly improved through the power of prayer

But I also recognise that it is vital for me to continue to take my meds

Psychology and Psychiatry are both tools of the devils, to make the journey in the unseen to God hard and difficult. No one is even prepared to fight the devils anymore, so when overwhelmed by them, it's a life time struggle at the mental health system for life.

The lost way of fighting with the sword and arrows of God, shielding oneself by light, and veiling/hiding oneself by light, is lost in this age yet in that lies the key to all blessings.

No one prepares anyone for the evil eye, so when attacked, people take refuge and asylum in psychiatry and psychology, when those two make the illness severely worse in many respect, and only helping in some respects.

 

[icehorse]

They have same data, how to interpret Data is subjective and stems from beliefs.

It seems to me that your core values are different than mine and some of the posters in this thread:

I value:
- reliable, reproducible evidence
- logical and critical thinking
- data (which is - by definition - objective and immutable)
- the joy of discovery

These are values that people who believe in science hold.

From reading your posts, you appear to value:
- scripture
- faith without evidence

You appear not to value logic and critical thinking when they conflict with scripture.

==

In my experience, that puts us at an impasse. Those of us who value logic cannot use logic in our discussions with you.

 

[ChristineM]

I'm saying they are opposites in how they approach and perceive the illness. Which one is true, is for people to discern.

Which one is true is for medical science, psychology and psychiatry to discern, no 1500 year old book ever helped a schizophrenic to cope with life and become a functional member of society. Therapy's and medication based on psychiatric knowledge does.

 

[sun rise]

And the reason most people need to stay on medications, is due to the flaws in psychology in providing coping methods.

That ignores the medical and brain physiology that is the basis of some mental illness.

Psychology and Psychiatry are both tools of the devils

You just entered my list of science deniers by attempting to associate the scientific method with "tools of the devils".

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Really?

I do. I believe that if I flip a switch completing the circuit the lightbulb will turn on.
The fact that I have lots of evidence on the subject doesn't change the fact that I believe the bulb will light up.
Tom

As I said, belief is that the application holds up (wires, connections, etc). There ia no belief required where you know something will factually happen.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Psychology and Psychiatry are both tools of the devils,

Then I am glad to pick up his tools and practice a craft of healing, rather than resorting to centuries of tried and failed superstitions.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Psychology and Psychiatry are both tools of the devils, to make the journey in the unseen to God hard and difficult. No one is even prepared to fight the devils anymore, so when overwhelmed by them, it's a life time struggle at the mental health system for life.

The lost way of fighting with the sword and arrows of God, shielding oneself by light, and veiling/hiding oneself by light, is lost in this age yet in that lies the key to all blessings.

No one prepares anyone for the evil eye, so when attacked, people take refuge and asylum in psychiatry and psychology, when those two make the illness severely worse in many respect, and only helping in some respects.

Fortunately there are plenty about who have benefited from either psychology and/or psychiatry, know the value of such and live in a completely different realm than the one you inhabit. Medication may not be the answer to many health issues - I know since I was addicted to such many years ago - but they do tend to make life tolerable for the many who need them. Not that I believe there are not better solutions but it usually takes time to find such. Your approach is my way or the highway, and just being the usually dogmatic thinking based on your personal religious beliefs - and not evidence-based.

 

[Windwalker]

They have same data, how to interpret Data is subjective and stems from beliefs.

And awareness and tools. For instance, someone 3000 years ago looking at the moon and the stars are going to interpret the data available to them, as opposed to someone in modern times interpreting the data available to them.

The modern person has way more data, and far greater tools with which to see and collect that data. So what they have to say about it, will have way more knowledge and information that is it based upon. Whearse that primitive soul, at best has a very limited data available to them. They are automatically at a disadvantage.

Hence, trying to say someone in 600 AD knew more than what we do today about matters of science, is well.... purely a matter of faith alone. Trying to interpret their writings within a modern context, is mostly always just a matter of interpretive slights of hand in order to make them "fit" the modern context. That's typical a rather forced and unnatural interpretation, that no one in previous years managed to come up with before modern knowledge illuminated their understanding.

In other words, the understanding did not come from the Quran. It came from modern science, in modern times.

 

[Link]

Then I am glad to pick up his tools and practice a craft of healing, rather than resorting to centuries of tried and failed superstitions.

You lead astray is all you do. Trick yourself you're helping you might, but, you will carry burden of those who you prevent from the journey to God and from living a life depending on God and the unseen connecting guides in the journey.

Psychology is based on circular reasoning and circular assumptions and they interpreted data all in a warped way.

 

[Link]

And awareness and tools. For instance, someone 3000 years ago looking at the moon and the stars are going to interpret the data available to them, as opposed to someone in modern times interpreting the data available to them.

The modern person has way more data, and far greater tools with which to see and collect that data. So what they have to say about it, will have way more knowledge and information that is it based upon. Whearse that primitive soul, at best has a very limited data available to them. They are automatically at a disadvantage.

Hence, trying to say someone in 600 AD knew more than what we do today about matters of science, is well.... purely a matter of faith alone. Trying to interpret their writings within a modern context, is mostly always just a matter of interpretive slights of hand in order to make them "fit" the modern context. That's typical a rather forced and unnatural interpretation, that no one in previous years managed to come up with before modern knowledge illuminated their understanding.

In other words, the understanding did not come from the Quran. It came from modern science, in modern times.

I'm saying there is no agreement between psychology and psychiatry on one hand and Islam on the other on schizophrenia, they have polar opposite views.

 

[Link]

That ignores the medical and brain physiology that is the basis of some mental illness.

The brain can reformed and formed again, and again, and again, of course, demonic possession and attacks from devils and sorcerers, takes a real physical effect on the brain but that is because of the interconnection between the brain and spiritual world.

Again, blocking most dopamine receptors is not the solution.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

You lead astray is all you do. Trick yourself you're helping you might, but, you will carry burden of those who you prevent from the journey to God and from living a life depending on God and the unseen connecting guides in the journey.

Who did I lead astrat and prevent from journeying to god? The over 99% of my clients who have been Christian? (They didnt get that from me, I remain neutral towards religion whem acting in a professional manner).

 

[kiwimac]

I'm going to say it doesn't. As some of you know my style, sometimes I write an OP in detail, and sometimes I wait for responses before showing evidence from my viewpoint.

Before I bring proof from Quran and hadiths that there is no agreement between Islam and the medical stance today, I will let people weigh in their thoughts.

We do not, if we have any sense, look to explain science from texts that were never intended to be scientific. The Torah, the Bible, Qur'an, Bhagavad-Gita etc all precede modern scientific knowledge. We should not, ISTM, look there for scientific insights.

 

[kiwimac]

And the reason most people need to stay on medications, is due to the flaws in psychology in providing coping methods.

Frankly, I disagree. People stay on medications because that is the healthiest thing for them to do. People with chronic depression are most likely never going to get "better" although there has been some promising research using psilocybin with long-term, chronic, depression.

 

[kiwimac]

Psychology and Psychiatry are both tools of the devils, to make the journey in the unseen to God hard and difficult. No one is even prepared to fight the devils anymore, so when overwhelmed by them, it's a life time struggle at the mental health system for life.

The lost way of fighting with the sword and arrows of God, shielding oneself by light, and veiling/hiding oneself by light, is lost in this age yet in that lies the key to all blessings.

No one prepares anyone for the evil eye, so when attacked, people take refuge and asylum in psychiatry and psychology, when those two make the illness severely worse in many respect, and only helping in some respects.

No, sorry, this is simply nonsense. Depression, Schizophrenia, Bipolar disorder are not caused by demons / devils.

 

[EddyB123]

Religion doesn't need to accept mere side effects. Labeling others is a way to make others feel unconnected to their higher self. If it wasn't called "mental" illness those with it would be cured. But the side effects would remain though less burdening.

 

[kiwimac]

Religion doesn't need to accept mere side effects. Labeling others is a way to make others feel unconnected to their higher self. If it wasn't called "mental" illness those with it would be cured. But the side effects would remain though less burdening.

No, that is also rubbish. Mental illness does not exist because it is labelled as such.

 

[Link]

Who did I lead astrat and prevent from journeying to god?

All those who you told to distrust their 6th sense to the extent they take meds to stop their brain from experiencing higher experiences that require more brain power.

 

[Link]

Religion doesn't need to accept mere side effects. Labeling others is a way to make others feel unconnected to their higher self. If it wasn't called "mental" illness those with it would be cured. But the side effects would remain though less burdening.

It's not just the label, the 6th sense sees things as they are, with certainty at the core, and they are punished for developing this 6th sense. Instead of helping them hone their 6th sense, they are punished for believing in what they saw.