Does The Bible Contain Errors And Contradictions

[Charles Philips]

The Holy Bible has been the worlds best selling book, in every generation since the printing press was invented many centuries ago.

Many Historians have studied the 66 books of the Bible, and compared them to secular contemporaries, to see if they could find any contradiction or errors. Most of those who set out to find faults with the Bible, became devout Christians instead. Because they found no faults of contradictions.

It's no different today, many sceptics set out to debunk the Bible and end up becoming believers instead. The vast majority converted to Christianity after finding that all 66 books are reliable, historical documents.

The 66 books of the Bible were written by 36 unrelated authors from various parts of the world over a period of 2,500 years, yet none of the accounts contradict each other. But the main reason so many became believers is due to the 356 prophecies which were fulfilled in Jesus Christ. The whole Bible is about Jesus Christ. God's Prophets foretold of His coming into the world thousands of years before He came.

There is a list in the link, showing every one of the 356 prophecies and their fulfilment. This is well worth a look, as it provides irrefutable evidence that the Bible is a reliable historical document. No other historical figure ever came close to changing the world forever as Jesus Christ did.

AccordingtotheScriptures.org :: 356 Prophecies Fulfilled in Jesus Christ

 

[Subduction Zone]

So many errors. Let's start with the last one's first. Quote mines are not "prophecies". You do not get to declare that a verse is a prophecy if you have to take it out of context. If you have any questions about some of those being prophecies you should talk to some of our Jewish members.

And you claimed to have been taught critical thinking in school. Why are you not applying it? You have to use the same standards to judge the Bible that you use to judge others. This is from an article on biblical prophecies and its standards would work with the beliefs of other faiths. Al you have to do is to switch out the word "Bible" for whatever holy book you are evalutating:

Criteria for a true prophecy[edit]​

For a statement to be Biblical foreknowledge, it must fit all of the five following criteria:

1. It must be accurate. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it is not accurate, because knowledge (and thus foreknowledge) excludes inaccurate statements. TLDR: It's true.
2. It must be in the Bible. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it is not in the Bible, because Biblical by definition foreknowledge can only come from the Bible itself, rather than modern reinterpretations of the text. TLDR: It's in plain words in the Bible.
3. It must be precise and unambiguous. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if meaningless philosophical musings or multiple possible ideas could fulfill the foreknowledge, because ambiguity prevents one from knowing whether the foreknowledge was intentional rather than accidental. TLDR: Vague "predictions" don't count.
4. It must be improbable. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it reasonably could be the result of a pure guess, because foreknowledge requires a person to actually know something true, while a correct guess doesn't mean that the guesser knows anything. This also excludes contemporary beliefs that happened to be true, but were believed to be true without solid evidence. TLDR: Lucky guesses don't count.
5. It must have been unknown. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it reasonably could be the result of an educated guess based off contemporary knowledge, because foreknowledge requires a person to know a statement when it would have been impossible, outside of supernatural power, for that person to know it. TLDR: Ideas of the time don't count.

Biblical prophecies

There are numerous Biblical prophecies, some vaguely fulfilled, others strangely unfulfilled. Of course, like the Bible, the Quran also contains what its followers maintain are fulfilled prophesies. Christians tend to find these unconvincing or silly — which is coincidentally the attitude which...

rationalwiki.org

 

[Subduction Zone]

And of course there is the ultimate honesty test.

What is the worst failed prophecy in the Bible?

 

[Charles Philips]

So many errors. Let's start with the last one's first. Quote mines are not "prophecies". You do not get to declare that a verse is a prophecy if you have to take it out of context. If you have any questions about some of those being prophecies you should talk to some of our Jewish members.

And you claimed to have been taught critical thinking in school. Why are you not applying it? You have to use the same standards to judge the Bible that you use to judge others. This is from an article on biblical prophecies and its standards would work with the beliefs of other faiths. Al you have to do is to switch out the word "Bible" for whatever holy book you are evalutating:

Criteria for a true prophecy[edit]​

For a statement to be Biblical foreknowledge, it must fit all of the five following criteria:

1. It must be accurate. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it is not accurate, because knowledge (and thus foreknowledge) excludes inaccurate statements. TLDR: It's true.
2. It must be in the Bible. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it is not in the Bible, because Biblical by definition foreknowledge can only come from the Bible itself, rather than modern reinterpretations of the text. TLDR: It's in plain words in the Bible.
3. It must be precise and unambiguous. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if meaningless philosophical musings or multiple possible ideas could fulfill the foreknowledge, because ambiguity prevents one from knowing whether the foreknowledge was intentional rather than accidental. TLDR: Vague "predictions" don't count.
4. It must be improbable. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it reasonably could be the result of a pure guess, because foreknowledge requires a person to actually know something true, while a correct guess doesn't mean that the guesser knows anything. This also excludes contemporary beliefs that happened to be true, but were believed to be true without solid evidence. TLDR: Lucky guesses don't count.
5. It must have been unknown. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it reasonably could be the result of an educated guess based off contemporary knowledge, because foreknowledge requires a person to know a statement when it would have been impossible, outside of supernatural power, for that person to know it. TLDR: Ideas of the time don't count.

Biblical prophecies

There are numerous Biblical prophecies, some vaguely fulfilled, others strangely unfulfilled. Of course, like the Bible, the Quran also contains what its followers maintain are fulfilled prophesies. Christians tend to find these unconvincing or silly — which is coincidentally the attitude which...

rationalwiki.org

You haven't debunked a single prophecy of the 356 listed. Your source, Rationalwiki doesn't help your cause as the standards by which it proposes to confirm bible prophecy are irrational. They were never formulated to test the prophecies, but rather to muddy the water and cause confusion.

 

[oldbadger]

...................

Many Historians have studied the 66 books of the Bible, and compared them to secular contemporaries, to see if they could find any contradiction or errors. Most of those who set out to find faults with the Bible, became devout Christians instead. Because they found no faults of contradictions.

Hello Charles . There may be some historians who tell about their conversion thru their studies, but I'm thinking of the theological scholars like Geza Vermes, previously a Christian priest who left the faith after writing his book 'the changing faces of Jesus,' .
There are others.
I think that the gospel of Mark is most likely to have told the real story, although even that got seriously fiddled with later on.
Jesus was a man, who became enobled to Lord and then to Diety with following gospels.
A complete fabrication of church dogma and Pauline spiel. Apart from the last meal, execution and backtolife he never wrote a sentence about anything that Jesus said or did.

 

[Twilight Hue]

The Holy Bible has been the worlds best selling book, in every generation since the printing press was invented many centuries ago.

Many Historians have studied the 66 books of the Bible, and compared them to secular contemporaries, to see if they could find any contradiction or errors. Most of those who set out to find faults with the Bible, became devout Christians instead. Because they found no faults of contradictions.

It's no different today, many sceptics set out to debunk the Bible and end up becoming believers instead. The vast majority converted to Christianity after finding that all 66 books are reliable, historical documents.

The 66 books of the Bible were written by 36 unrelated authors from various parts of the world over a period of 2,500 years, yet none of the accounts contradict each other. But the main reason so many became believers is due to the 356 prophecies which were fulfilled in Jesus Christ. The whole Bible is about Jesus Christ. God's Prophets foretold of His coming into the world thousands of years before He came.

There is a list in the link, showing every one of the 356 prophecies and their fulfilment. This is well worth a look, as it provides irrefutable evidence that the Bible is a reliable historical document. No other historical figure ever came close to changing the world forever as Jesus Christ did.

AccordingtotheScriptures.org :: 356 Prophecies Fulfilled in Jesus Christ

It's not really the world's best selling book simply because most religious buy those things in mass bulk and distribute it out like the Gideons and missionaries.

Its not like people are eagerly running to the bookstores to buy a Bible , so you might want to reassess your claim.

 

[Soandso]

The Holy Bible has been the worlds best selling book, in every generation since the printing press was invented many centuries ago.

Argumentum ad populum

Many Historians have studied the 66 books of the Bible, and compared them to secular contemporaries, to see if they could find any contradiction or errors. Most of those who set out to find faults with the Bible, became devout Christians instead. Because they found no faults of contradictions.

And many folks become atheists due to the faults and contradictions they do find

It's no different today, many sceptics set out to debunk the Bible and end up becoming believers instead. The vast majority converted to Christianity after finding that all 66 books are reliable, historical documents.

Same as the previous paragraph. More empty boasting that ignores the fact that the opposite happens as well. Meh

The 66 books of the Bible were written by 36 unrelated authors from various parts of the world over a period of 2,500 years, yet none of the accounts contradict each other. But the main reason so many became believers is due to the 356 prophecies which were fulfilled in Jesus Christ. The whole Bible is about Jesus Christ. God's Prophets foretold of His coming into the world thousands of years before He came.

Wait, thousands of years before he came? As far as I'm aware, the first mention of the Messiah involved Moses. Moses didn't live that long ago. Are you talking about some other prophets? Which ones, exactly?

There is a list in the link, showing every one of the 356 prophecies and their fulfilment. This is well worth a look, as it provides irrefutable evidence that the Bible is a reliable historical document. No other historical figure ever came close to changing the world forever as Jesus Christ did.

The problem with prophecies is that we look at them from the perspective of hindsight where we can shoehorn whatever explanation we want to make them "fulfilled" in any way we like. Looking at the way people in the past thought their prophecies were "fulfilled," then looking at modern understanding and seeing how they differ doesn't make prophecy seem like a very reliable proof. If they were mistaken but thought they were right then, who's to say we aren't mistaken and wrong with our interpretations now? That's not very convincing for me

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Many Historians have studied the 66 books of the Bible, and ...

Oy vey.

FWIW: preachy OPs tend to be tired reruns firmly grounded in willful ignorance and impervious to reason.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Many Historians have studied the 66 books of the Bible, and compared them to secular contemporaries, to see if they could find any contradiction or errors. Most of those who set out to find faults with the Bible, became devout Christians instead. Because they found no faults of contradictions.

Who found Jesus's tomb empty and what did they see when they got there? A single answer, please.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You haven't debunked a single prophecy of the 356 listed. Your source, Rationalwiki doesn't help your cause as the standards by which it proposes to confirm bible prophecy are irrational. They were never formulated to test the prophecies, but rather to muddy the water and cause confusion.

I have not even tried yet. I have to see if it is even worth my time. Also the burden of proof is actually on you. If you want to play a silly Gish Gallop Game then refuting one would refute them all.

If you want to use prophecy you have to at the very least agree to certain standards, if not it is just worthless hand waving.

But getting back to the other endless errors in the Bible besides all of Genesis and Exodus, those are already givens to any person that can reason rationally what year do you think that Jesus was born in?

 

[Twilight Hue]

The Holy Bible has been the worlds best selling book, in every generation since the printing press was invented many centuries ago.

Many Historians have studied the 66 books of the Bible, and compared them to secular contemporaries, to see if they could find any contradiction or errors. Most of those who set out to find faults with the Bible, became devout Christians instead. Because they found no faults of contradictions.

It's no different today, many sceptics set out to debunk the Bible and end up becoming believers instead. The vast majority converted to Christianity after finding that all 66 books are reliable, historical documents.

The 66 books of the Bible were written by 36 unrelated authors from various parts of the world over a period of 2,500 years, yet none of the accounts contradict each other. But the main reason so many became believers is due to the 356 prophecies which were fulfilled in Jesus Christ. The whole Bible is about Jesus Christ. God's Prophets foretold of His coming into the world thousands of years before He came.

There is a list in the link, showing every one of the 356 prophecies and their fulfilment. This is well worth a look, as it provides irrefutable evidence that the Bible is a reliable historical document. No other historical figure ever came close to changing the world forever as Jesus Christ did.

AccordingtotheScriptures.org :: 356 Prophecies Fulfilled in Jesus Christ

There's no way to date each book of the Bible but we do know when the Bible appeared and I would say the Catholic Church pretty much wrote the entire New Testament with it's Jewish counterpart attached to the New Testament.

 

[wellwisher]

Christianity had a rough two century beginning, after Jesus left. It was subject to constant genocide; spectator sports. The faithful had to move and go underground or be rounded up. It took two centuries, until the dust had settled enough for some Christians to come out of the closet. The books of the New Testament were compiled, in the second century, often with similar stories with slight differences. This is due to honest reporting of credible witnesses and oral traditions, from different angles. If this had been a scam, it would have been smarter to make sure the lawyers cannot pick it apart by forcing the stories to be consistent, without any areas for dispute. An honest data presentation will show the good and bad data, and not just the good data; perfection in weakness.

The only book that was original and pre-written, would have been the book of Revelations. The style and subject matter of Revelation is very different from the rest. John also called Mark, was the only Apostle not murdered. He was sent into exile to Patmos Island, where he wrote Revelations, while in his 80's. This book was first, but was placed last. My guess is the compilers of the New Testament, must have seen the Revelations, as still in the future, since although the darkness of the prophesy may have occurred; genocide, the reign of righteousness; was still in the future. My guess is the original book was collected and saved after John died, and preserved in the underground. It may still be hiding somewhere.

It would take another two centuries; 4th century, until Christianity would become the official religion of Rome. The Christian soldiers had created a reputation as the best soldiers in the Roman Empire, loyal and fearless in battle. This increase in social status; official religion, altered the original Christianity to become more in line with the secular needs of the Imperial Roman Empire; render onto God and render onto Caesar. This resulted in compromises and paradoxes such as more inclusion of Pagan festivals, in exchange for wider audiences; Holy Roman Empire and preaching to all the nations.

To me, as a scientist and engineer, the usefulness of a new device is not in how it looks, but in its utility and in its long term results. There is a long history of Christianity's lead role. The impact of this faith, on the human mind and soul has stood the test of time, as a world leading force. The Holy Roman Empire would last from 4th to 14th Century AD; 1000 year reign of peace. After that, the amalgam of God and Caesar, would begin to divide, causing purer forms of Faith and Atheism to appear; co-joined twins being separated.

The Atheist religion is a mirror religion, that exists within the flaws of Christianity. If Christianity says x then Atheism says -x. Christianity says Jesus was real, so in the Atheist mirror, Jesus has to be fictional; -x. My guess is Atheism has been around since the time of Rome, even before the Holy Roman Empire. After the Holy Roman Empire formed, and Christianity was protected and featured, Atheists were smart enough not to make waves, but go along, to get along. They formed their own underground, sabotaging from the inside, through power and politics, so they can better see themselves in the mirror. Priest molesting boys was not taught by Jesus. This is in the mirror.

Christianity was about acceptance of the human family. This openness will give advantages to those who need to be get accepted to share the standard of living, so they can push an agenda for just their own clannish group. The atrocities of the Church, came from the mirror; opposite of what Jesus preached. The Christians are all blamed, but it was the anti-christian atheists, with all the darkness in their mirror, needed for the atrocities; Spanish Inquisition. Hitler was a Christian who was slanted to the Roman Side mirror. None of what he did was taught by Jesus, but rather appears more in the mirror of opposites. It had a Roman flavor; Social Darwinism and 1000 year reign of terror.

It is useful to understand the Christian mirror world and its impact on the past and present.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

The Holy Roman Empire would last from 4th to 14th Century AD; 1000 year reign of peace.

Umm... the Holy Roman Empire lasted from 800 to 1806. And its reign wasn't exactly peaceful.

List of wars involving the Holy Roman Empire - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[JustGeorge]

**Moved To Religious Debates**​

 

[Trailblazer]

The 66 books of the Bible were written by 36 unrelated authors from various parts of the world over a period of 2,500 years, yet none of the accounts contradict each other.

The Bible is fraught with contradictions, which is to be expected from a book that was written by that many different over the course of long periods of time.

Moreover, there is no reason to think that the Bible was divinely inspired. That is only a faith-based belief which is backed by no evidence.

But the main reason so many became believers is due to the 356 prophecies which were fulfilled in Jesus Christ. The whole Bible is about Jesus Christ. God's Prophets foretold of His coming into the world thousands of years before He came.

God's Prophets foretold of the coming of Jesus Christ but the whole Bible is not ABOUT Jesus Christ. The Old Testament is about Abraham and Moses and many other Prophets.

Some of the OT prophecies were fulfilled by Jesus, but NONE of the messianic age prophecies were fulfilled by Jesus, and they never will be fulfilled by Jesus since Jesus is never coming back to this world.

Jesus never promised to return to earth, not once in the New Testament. Jesus said His work was finished here and He was no more in the world. That means that the return of Christ and the end times messiah has to be another Person.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more.

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

 

[Trailblazer]

Criteria for a true prophecy[edit]​

For a statement to be Biblical foreknowledge, it must fit all of the five following criteria:

1. It must be accurate. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it is not accurate, because knowledge (and thus foreknowledge) excludes inaccurate statements. TLDR: It's true.
2. It must be in the Bible. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it is not in the Bible, because Biblical by definition foreknowledge can only come from the Bible itself, rather than modern reinterpretations of the text. TLDR: It's in plain words in the Bible.
3. It must be precise and unambiguous. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if meaningless philosophical musings or multiple possible ideas could fulfill the foreknowledge, because ambiguity prevents one from knowing whether the foreknowledge was intentional rather than accidental. TLDR: Vague "predictions" don't count.
4. It must be improbable. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it reasonably could be the result of a pure guess, because foreknowledge requires a person to actually know something true, while a correct guess doesn't mean that the guesser knows anything. This also excludes contemporary beliefs that happened to be true, but were believed to be true without solid evidence. TLDR: Lucky guesses don't count.
5. It must have been unknown. A statement cannot be Biblical foreknowledge if it reasonably could be the result of an educated guess based off contemporary knowledge, because foreknowledge requires a person to know a statement when it would have been impossible, outside of supernatural power, for that person to know it. TLDR: Ideas of the time don't count.

You omitted the most important criterion..

6. It must have been fulfilled by the Prophet.
In other words, what it says in the prophecy must have actually happened on the ground.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You omitted the most important criterion..

6. It must have been fulfilled by the Prophet.
In other words, what it says in the prophecy must have actually happened on the ground.

I am not so sure of that. How does that even apply if the prophet makes a prediction whose date is after his death?

 

[Trailblazer]

I am not so sure of that. How does that even apply if the prophet makes a prediction whose date is after his death?

I can see how what I said could have been confusing.

Whatever predictions that were made by the Prophets of the OT would not have been fulfilled by the OT Prophets because those predictions do not pertain to the OT Prophets.
The predictions made by the OT Prophets pertain to a Prophet who would come in the future.

So I meant that those predictions must have been fulfilled by the Prophet who came in the future.
In other words, what it says in the prophecy must have actually happened on the ground when the prophecy was fulfilled.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I can see how what I said could have been confusing.

Whatever predictions that were made by the Prophets of the OT would not have been fulfilled by the OT Prophets because those predictions do not pertain to the OT Prophets.
The predictions made by the OT Prophets pertain to a Prophet who would come in the future.

So I meant that those predictions must have been fulfilled by the Prophet who came in the future.
In other words, what it says in the prophecy must have actually happened on the ground when the prophecy was fulfilled.

You are not being consistent in your use of the word "Prophet". Plus prophecies do not have to be about a "Prophet" they can be about an event.

Perhaps you should reconsider your terminology.

 

[Trailblazer]

You are not being consistent in your use of the word "Prophet". Perhaps you should reconsider your terminology.

First, according to Baha'i beliefs, there are two kinds of Prophets, independent Prophets and Prophets who are followers and promoters of the independent Prophets.

Question.—How many kinds of Prophets are there?

Answer.—Universally, the Prophets are of two kinds. One are the independent Prophets Who are followed; the other kind are not independent and are themselves followers.

The independent Prophets are the lawgivers and the founders of a new cycle. Through Their appearance the world puts on a new garment, the foundations of religion are established, and a new book is revealed. Without an intermediary They receive bounty from the Reality of the Divinity, and Their illumination is an essential illumination. They are like the sun which is luminous in itself: the light is its essential necessity; it does not receive light from any other star. These Dawning-places of the morn of Unity are the sources of bounty and the mirrors of the Essence of Reality.

The other Prophets are followers and promoters, for they are branches and not independent; they receive the bounty of the independent Prophets, and they profit by the light of the Guidance of the universal Prophets. They are like the moon, which is not luminous and radiant in itself, but receives its light from the sun.

The Manifestations of universal Prophethood Who appeared independently are, for example, Abraham, Moses, Christ, Muhammad, the Báb and Bahá’u’lláh. But the others who are followers and promoters are like Solomon, David, Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel. For the independent Prophets are founders; They establish a new religion and make new creatures of men; They change the general morals, promote new customs and rules, renew the cycle and the Law. Their appearance is like the season of spring, which arrays all earthly beings in a new garment, and gives them a new life.

With regard to the second sort of Prophets who are followers, these also promote the Law of God, make known the Religion of God, and proclaim His word. Of themselves they have no power and might, except what they receive from the independent Prophets.

43: THE TWO CLASSES OF PROPHETS, Some Answered Questions, pp. 164-165

The Prophets of the OT who prophesied the coming of future independent Prophets were followers and promoters, which explains why they predicted the coming of the independent Prophets and wrote prophecies about them, so that people in the future would recognize them when they appeared.

Baha'is normally refer to the independent Prophets as as Manifestations of God, or Messengers of God.

Plus prophecies do not have to be about a "Prophet" they can be about an event.

You are correct. Prophecies do not have to be 'about' a Prophet. They might be about the Prophet but they can be about an event.
The prophecies I am referring to are about the 'person' who return of Christ who I believe was the same person as the end times messiah who was prophesied in the OT, and they are also about 'events' that would transpire during his lifetime and after he died.

It really does not matter what happened thousands of years ago or if the event prophecies that refer to the past were fulfilled or not, since the past is gone and is not relevant to the times we are now living in.

Some of the end times prophecies refer to events that were fulfilled by the coming of the person who would be the return of Christ/end times messiah, things that that person would do during his lifetime and other event prophecies would happen after he died,, during the messianic age, which will last no less than 1000 years from his coming.

Please note that when I say 'end times' I am referring to the end of an age, not to the end of the world. End times is the end of the Age of Prophecy, which marks the beginning of the new age, which is called the Age of Fulfillment, the age which I believe we are now living in.