Does Veda prohibit idols/statue worship?

[SomeRandom]

Namaskaram some random ji , .....



Brahman is the absolute reality which pervades all , Vedas reveal that truth , ....



I dont think it is possible to have a universal ''we'' that encapsulates Hinduism as it would appear that some Hindus dont beleive that Hinduism is a scripture based religion ??? ....To some of us Shastra is extremly inportand and nondifferent from the Supreme himself , ....

please do not count me in the ''we'' who'' make our own decisions'' , as far as I am aware we are here for realisation not speculation , in our current state we are incapable of thinking for ourselves due to our extreme ignorance , it is for this reason that we traditionaly rely so heavily upon Shastra , .....

"We" was really shorthand. I assumed you'd know I didn't mean every Hindu.
The Vedas isn't really integral to a lot of "village Hindus" who instead of reading their religion live and breathe it. But I'm sorry if you thought I was including you as a fellow Hindu in my statements. I'm just so used to Hindus just knowing that generalities made about well Hindus do not necessarily include them.

 

[SomeRandom]

Are you? Please
Regards

Nope. But you seem to be acting like one.

 

[paarsurrey]

If one RigVedic poet does not like worship of idols, it does not make it necessary for all Hindus to stop worship idols, just as denial of existence of Gods or their rise after the production of the universe in one hymn does not make it necessary for all Hindus to deny God. While discussing Hinduism, drop your idiotic Islamic insistence on the word of scriptures. That does not apply here. We are not slaves either to Gods or to scriptures unless one chooses to be. People like me do not even accept the existence of God. Each Hindu will decide what he or she will do. Probably after generations of slavery you just do not know what freedom means.

This raises some valid questions, please:

1. How many rishis' joint discourse assertions are binding on other rishis and or on the "Hindus" or Veda believers?
2. What if the "Hindus" or Veda believers deny assertions of some or more or all rishis?
3. If the Gods rose after the production of Universe, that means "Hindu's" or Veda-believer's gods were not eternal. Right? Please
4. At what definite time these "Hindu's" or Veda-believer's gods rose? Did they all rise together or after lapse of periods, one after the other? Please

Reards

 

[ratikala]

Namaskaram Vinayaka ji ,

Brahman is not a He. Brahman is not the same as your God.

Brahman is the supreme and absolute reality , the source of all , thus Brahman pervades all , ...as Brahman is Saguna and Nirguna can posess atribtes thus can be He , ....and as Brahman is the original , uncreated and eternal all Gods manifest from him .

 

[ratikala]

"We" was really shorthand. I assumed you'd know I didn't mean every Hindu.
The Vedas isn't really integral to a lot of "village Hindus" who instead of reading their religion live and breathe it. But I'm sorry if you thought I was including you as a fellow Hindu in my statements. I'm just so used to Hindus just knowing that generalities made about well Hindus do not necessarily include them.

are you assuming that Vedic Hindus do not also live their religion ?

Vedas are something not just to be read but recited and meditated upon inorder to derive their meaning , ...this is half the problem here , ...the Vedas are not reading material they are formulaic we need to be instructed upon their meaning we canot form opinions about these instructions or understand them through the material mind , just as one needs ot be initiated in to the repeteition of mantra by one who has full knowledge of the meaning , we likewise have to be instructed as to to read and reflect upon the Vedas , .....

 

[SomeRandom]

are you assuming that Vedic Hindus do not also live their religion ?

Vedas are something not just to be read but recited and meditated upon inorder to derive their meaning , ...this is half the problem here , ...the Vedas are not reading material they are formulaic we need to be instructed upon their meaning we canot form opinions about these instructions or understand them through the material mind , just as one needs ot be initiated in to the repeteition of mantra by one who has full knowledge of the meaning , we likewise have to be instructed as to to read and reflect upon the Vedas , .....

No not at all. Just said that not all practicing Hindus even know the Vedas but they keep chuffing along all the same on their path. It's just how Hinduism rolls.

 

[paarsurrey]

are you assuming that Vedic Hindus do not also live their religion ?

Vedas are something not just to be read but recited and meditated upon inorder to derive their meaning , ...this is half the problem here , ...the Vedas are not reading material they are formulaic we need to be instructed upon their meaning we canot form opinions about these instructions or understand them through the material mind , just as one needs ot be initiated in to the repeteition of mantra by one who has full knowledge of the meaning , we likewise have to be instructed as to to read and reflect upon the Vedas , .....

Thanks and regards

 

[ratikala]

Namaskaram ji

No not at all. Just said that not all practicing Hindus even know the Vedas but they keep chuffing along all the same on their path. It's just how Hinduism rolls.

I think the operative word here is practice , .....what are Practicing Hindus Practicing if they are just chuffing along on their own path ?

I think we are all aware that Hinduism encompases many traditions , but what we need to ask is what unites these traditions , if we canot find a unifying principle then Hinduism becomes a cultural , secular or geograpic title only .

True not all Hindus have studied the Vedas but many prayers or mantra in common use have their root in the Vedas so many are more familiar with the Vedic principals than one might initaly think .

 

[Jainarayan]

Namaskaram Vinayaka ji ,




Brahman is the supreme and absolute reality , the source of all , thus Brahman pervades all , ...as Brahman is Saguna and Nirguna can posess atribtes thus can be He , ....and as Brahman is the original , uncreated and eternal all Gods manifest from him .

The originator of this thread, and the many threads like this attempting to invalidate Hinduism and its scriptures, equates Brahman with Allah and Yahweh, who are typically considered male, and patriarchal. Saguna Brahman possess attributes, but not anthropomorphic characteristics, such as speaking to their prophets, as do Allah and Yahweh.

 

[Vinayaka]

Namaskaram Vinayaka ji ,




Brahman is the supreme and absolute reality , the source of all , thus Brahman pervades all , ...as Brahman is Saguna and Nirguna can posess atribtes thus can be He , ....and as Brahman is the original , uncreated and eternal all Gods manifest from him .

But not exclusively He. Brahman can be She, formless, genderless, etc. For the OP, Brahman is only He, and none other.

 

[paarsurrey]

Does Veda prohibit idols/statue worship?


Arya Samaj and Aurobindo movements:
"Dayananda, stated Reverend John Robson, was an iconoclast and willing to join with Christians to destroy all idols in India.[88] According to Robson, Dayanand believed "there was no errors in the Vedas (including the Rigveda), and if anyone showed him an error, he would maintain that it was a corruption added later".*[88]

Dayananda and Aurobindo interpret the Vedic scholars had a monotheistic conception.[89] Aurobindo attempted to interpret hymns to Agni in the Rigveda as mystical.[89] He claimed that the Vedic hymns were a quest after a higher truth, define the perfect right (Rta), conceive life in terms of a struggle between the forces of light and darkness, and assert the ultimate reality of an everconscient existence.[89]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigveda#Rishis
*[88]Salmond, Noel A. (2004). "Dayananda Saraswati". Hindu iconoclasts: Rammohun Roy, Dayananda Sarasvati and Nineteenth-Century Polemics Against Idolatry. Wilfrid Laurier University Press. pp. 114–115. ISBN 0-88920-419-5.
Please
Regards

 

[Jainarayan]

Does Veda prohibit idols/statue worship?


Arya Samaj and Aurobindo movements:
"Dayananda, stated Reverend John Robson, was an iconoclast and willing to join with Christians to destroy all idols in India.[88] According to Robson, Dayanand believed "there was no errors in the Vedas (including the Rigveda), and if anyone showed him an error, he would maintain that it was a corruption added later".*[88]

Dayananda and Aurobindo interpret the Vedic scholars had a monotheistic conception.[89] Aurobindo attempted to interpret hymns to Agni in the Rigveda as mystical.[89] He claimed that the Vedic hymns were a quest after a higher truth, define the perfect right (Rta), conceive life in terms of a struggle between the forces of light and darkness, and assert the ultimate reality of an everconscient existence.[89]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigveda#Rishis
*[88]Salmond, Noel A. (2004). "Dayananda Saraswati". Hindu iconoclasts: Rammohun Roy, Dayananda Sarasvati and Nineteenth-Century Polemics Against Idolatry. Wilfrid Laurier University Press. pp. 114–115. ISBN 0-88920-419-5.
Please
Regards

Do you have a commentary or opinion in your own words? This is just a copy paste.

 

[ratikala]

Namaskaram Vinayaka Ji

But not exclusively He. Brahman can be She, formless, genderless, etc. For the OP, Brahman is only He, and none other.

Not ''can be'' .....Symultaniously is ! .....as Brahman the all pervasive principle posesses all qualities , ....
I think perhaps Parrasurry ji understands that the Brahman the highest Universal Principle , Ultimate Reality , from which all stems ....this understanding is far in advance of bickering over he or she , this is totaly missing the point as being the universal reality he and she are but aspects of the same Supreme , ......you forget that my beloved RadhaMadhava are symultaniously one .

 

[SomeRandom]

Namaskaram ji



I think the operative word here is practice , .....what are Practicing Hindus Practicing if they are just chuffing along on their own path ?

I think we are all aware that Hinduism encompases many traditions , but what we need to ask is what unites these traditions , if we canot find a unifying principle then Hinduism becomes a cultural , secular or geograpic title only .

True not all Hindus have studied the Vedas but many prayers or mantra in common use have their root in the Vedas so many are more familiar with the Vedic principals than one might initaly think .

Ahh Ritikala-Ji. Do not think I am trying to downplay the Vedas. I am merely saying that it's not absolutely required for the implementation of our faiths.

They are practicing their dharma to their family usually. Many traditions come from the family. Many Hindus just follow what the family practices.
Must we call into question the sincerity of every Hindu who does not read the Vedas? Why? It is recommended but not required. Many in my family don't even know what the Vedas are, but they are devout all the same.
They follow the 4 goals as best they can. Are they not real Hindus because they have not read a book?

Prayers might come from the Vedas but you know as well as I do that there are mantras that have mixed in from other sources.
We have universalist songs in my family, one that I swear comes from an old Bollywood movie about the Lord and Sathiya Sai Bhajans.
And if as you say they are aware of Vedic principles by default then why should anyone worry if they have not read the Vedas? It is indeed part of our practice whether we know it or not and thus there is no need to fret if one has not read it. We still seem to manage to get along just fine.

 

[ratikala]

Namaskaram Jainarayan Ji

The originator of this thread, and the many threads like this attempting to invalidate Hinduism and its scriptures,

the originator of this thread has a name Parrasurry ji , ...he to like you has paramatma residing in the heart , all beings have paramatma , ......I do not understand the animosity , I have been reading this and some recent threads , why is it that I dont see the the ''attempts to invalidate Hinduismand its scriptures'' that you and others complain of ???

what is actualy hapening is that the subject and origin of the Vedas are being discussed we can do two things discuss and potentaily learn , ....or bury head in the sand beliving we can be taught or learn nothing ....?

Hindus with Faith will not be shaken but will relish the oppertunity to discuss and potentialy enlighten even them selves by re reading and contemplating , .....

equates Brahman with Allah and Yahweh, who are typically considered male, and patriarchal. Saguna Brahman possess attributes, but not anthropomorphic characteristics, such as speaking to their prophets, as do Allah and Yahweh.

it is beleived that the Vedas them selves are revealed scripture received by the Vedic Rishis , .....what is a Prophet ? ..an inspired teacher , a revealer of Gods will , ....what are the vedic Rishis ? ....inspired preists who composed the Vedas revealing Gods Will , instructions and Knowledge , .......

 

[Jainarayan]

In case anyone missed the memo recapping the monthly Hindu staff meeting (btw, the coconut balls served this month were scrumptious, kudos to Kuldeep for bringing them), Hinduism today is largely puranic (I'm not familiar with the Agamas). Not entirely puranic but I'll wager the average Hindu will know where the story of Ganesha's "birth" comes from compared to where the Mahamrtyunjaya Mantra hails from. This doesn't invalidate, supercede or toss aside the Vedas, it just adds another layer of richness.

 

[Satyamavejayanti]

If yes, then, why worship them?
Thread open to everybody a Veda believer or not believer, of religion or no-religion, please
Regards

Namaste,

Veda Mantra Samhita does not Prohibit Murthi Puja, there is nowhere in any of the Samhita Mantras of the ChturVeda that say to worship the divine or to do puja to Devta/Devi with Murthi/or Prathima is prohibited, neither is it anywhere stated that this mode of worship is a sinful.

 

[ratikala]

Namaskaram ji

Ahh Ritikala-Ji. Do not think I am trying to downplay the Vedas. I am merely saying that it's not absolutely required for the implementation of our faiths.

Jai Jai , ...Dont worry I wasnt thinking along those lines , .....

but let us review faith , ...what are our faiths ???

They are practicing their dharma to their family usually. Many traditions come from the family. Many Hindus just follow what the family practices.
Must we call into question the sincerity of every Hindu who does not read the Vedas? Why? It is recommended but not required. Many in my family don't even know what the Vedas are, but they are devout all the same.
They follow the 4 goals as best they can. Are they not real Hindus because they have not read a book?

and where does this Dharma come from ?........person dosent nececarily have to know line and verse but it is good to know what foundation Hinduism is built upon

Prayers might come from the Vedas but you know as well as I do that there are mantras that have mixed in from other sources.
We have universalist songs in my family, one that I swear comes from an old Bollywood movie about the Lord and Sathiya Sai Bhajans.
And if as you say they are aware of Vedic principles by default then why should anyone worry if they have not read the Vedas? It is indeed part of our practice whether we know it or not and thus there is no need to fret if one has not read it. We still seem to manage to get along just fine.

surely we can all benifit from being a little less materialistic in Prayer and in Sadhana , no of course one dosent have to , one can keep on praying for family health and wellbeing , I am not saying one must fret or feel bad if one dosent read the Vedas , what I am trying to say is that it is helpfull to understand the Basis of Hinduism , doing by default is the lowest stage , then after having performed samskars out of duty to family and tradititon then comes the ripening of actions and curiosity to learn , .....

 

[Jainarayan]

the originator of this thread has a name Parrasurry ji

I refrain from that so as not to get a rule 1; staff is not above the law.

As to the main, and probably really the only, reason for our objections is the misinformation and downright falsehoods about Hinduism that can be found in these threads. Remember that this is not a closed or secluded Algonquin Round Table: non-Hindu lurkers are potentially being misinformed. Additionally, it's less animosity than frustration with seeing the same misinformation in multiple threads or multiple times in the same thread, usually a copy/paste.

 

[SomeRandom]

Jai Jai , ...Dont worry I wasnt thinking along those lines , .....

but let us review faith , ...what are our faiths ???

Review our faith? Lol dear Ritikala-ji do we have enough time?

and where does this Dharma come from ?........person dosent nececarily have to know line and verse but it is good to know what foundation Hinduism is built upon

Exactly. We don't merely read our scripture, we live and breathe it, even if we don't always read it.

surely we can all benifit from being a little less materialistic in Prayer and in Sadhana , no of course one dosent have to , one can keep on praying for family health and wellbeing , I am not saying one must fret or feel bad if one dosent read the Vedas , what I am trying to say is that it is helpfull to understand the Basis of Hinduism , doing by default is the lowest stage , then after having performed samskars out of duty to family and tradititon then comes the ripening of actions and curiosity to learn ,

Perhaps. But everyone is different. Some people are just better at the practical side than they are at the "theory" side.