Dr Adnan Ibrahim on Emotional Atheism

[Sapiens]

Except that the creator gave us signs that he's the one behind it but some listen and some others won't.

More handshakes and decoder rings.

 

[Sapiens]

Kafir apparently means literally "disbeliever". As in, someone who is aware enough of Islamic teachings yet still chooses not to adhere to Islamic beliefs.

So it also (and perhaps necessarily) means "liar" in the religious and ethical sense. That has led to a considerable amount of confusion, since many people focus on one or the other meaning and assume that the other is a misrepresentation of the concept. I have even heard that "kafir" and "kuffar" are significantly different words, one being a pejorative while the other is not (in truth kuffar is simply the plural form of kafir).

To the best of my understanding, Islamic doctrine is utterly unprepared to deal with the eventuality of someone understanding Islam yet deciding that it is not true. An informed disbeliever must be faulty in either character or mental faculties.

"Kafir": someone who lacks knowledge of the secret handshake and does not own a secret decoder ring.

 

[LuisDantas]

"Kafir": someone who lacks knowledge of the secret handshake and does not own a secret decoder ring.

More like someone who has not convinced the faithful that he is not sorely craving for the handshake and ring, if I am not mistaken.

 

[Sapiens]

More like someone who has not convinced the faithful that he is not sorely craving for the handshake and ring, if I am not mistaken.

I bow to your perspicacity.

 

[LuisDantas]

Ahah... enough expectations of bowing and the like already, don't you think?

 

[FearGod]

Like I said, "Truth hurts, eh? You and Hovind have different grips and different decoder rings, but your games are the same."

Think as you wish that doesn't make it true.

 

[FearGod]

So limited as to appear nonexistent to rational folks. Another example of the required secret hand shakes and decoder rings that you and yours require for membership in your cognoscenti.

Then make life with the non-living raw materials.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Kafir apparently means literally "disbeliever". As in, someone who is aware enough of Islamic teachings yet still chooses not to adhere to Islamic beliefs.

So it also (and perhaps necessarily) means "liar" in the religious and ethical sense. That has led to a considerable amount of confusion, since many people focus on one or the other meaning and assume that the other is a misrepresentation of the concept. I have even heard that "kafir" and "kuffar" are significantly different words, one being a pejorative while the other is not (in truth kuffar is simply the plural form of kafir).

To the best of my understanding, Islamic doctrine is utterly unprepared to deal with the eventuality of someone understanding Islam yet deciding that it is not true. An informed disbeliever must be faulty in either character or mental faculties.

That is difficult to think about, so I'm going to file it away for now.

 

[Sapiens]

Think as you wish that doesn't make it true.

Of course you are in denial, I don't know your handshakes and I I don't want your decoder ring.

 

[Sapiens]

Then make life with the non-living raw materials.

It has been done, but what does that have to do with evolution?

 

[FearGod]

It has been done, but what does that have to do with evolution?

Did i mention evolution? we were talking about life and soul.

 

[Sapiens]

Did i mention evolution? we were talking about life and soul.

"Life" has been done, "soul" is just another of your magic decoder ring things.

 

[LuisDantas]

The thing about souls is that their existance is entirely undetectable. One basically has to decide that they exist.

Because without a fair dose of wishful thinking, they do not exist.

 

[FearGod]

"Life" has been done, "soul" is just another of your magic decoder ring things.

Keep yourself alive, is it hard to prevent your DNA from damage?

 

[Godobeyer]

Look - you've argued two different things here:

- the more complex a thing is, the more it needs a creator. But this implies that the less complex a thing is, the less it needs a creator, which you say you disagree with.

- everything needs a creator. If so, then a simple thing needs a creator just as much as a complex thing, so complexity has nothing to do with how much something needs a creator... but you say you disagree with this implication, too.

So which is it?

All created .

Just something is more complex than other.


NOTE I correct a typo error in my previous reply , sorry for that.

Life is complex , I could NOT imagine that you believe in randomness , and natural select had that intelligence .

 

[LuisDantas]

Keep yourself alive, is it hard to prevent your DNA from damage?

DNA suffers damage rather easily, as a matter of fact. Pretty much everyone has a few defective genes.

But DNA also has fairly effective defenses to deal with that damage.

That said... it was quite the odd jump, to talk about DNA all of a sudden. I am by no means certain that you meant to actually ask that.

 

[Tomorrows_Child]

There are a lot more than you seem to think.

Certainly not on this forum but I won't quote any names as that would be invading perosnal posts that they made but my previous thread is around for everyone to see.

And it's the same case for the majority of atheists I have met in real life and many of whom I have read about.

 

[LuisDantas]

I made a thread some months ago on why people became atheists are barely anyone mentioned studying science or being enthralled by facts but mostly mentioned not having any religious understanding or being brought up by a family where religion was never really an issue etc.

So I agree, emotional atheism is the correct term.

They are extremely rare, on this forum and in reality.

However, I was interested in something you said, which I highlighted. If one understands their religion and I mean truly understands and decides to reject it, with that rejection being based on some sound logic and investigation, then I would call them a respectable person, a seeker of truth who has just started his or her journey.

Certainly not on this forum but I won't quote any names as that would be invading perosnal posts that they made but my previous thread is around for everyone to see.

And it's the same case for the majority of atheists I have met in real life and many of whom I have read about.

@Tomorrows_Child

Quite frankly, either you misunderstood them something fierce or you have been exposed to a most unusual sample of atheists.

Edited to add: going by the thread, linked below, I will bet double in the first option. You seem to have gravely misinterpreted your own thread. And I mean gravely. Under most circunstances I would not hesitate to say that you are lying outright about your own thread.

I wish I could say I am surprised. But I am getting used to it by now.

http://www.religiousforums.com/threads/why-are-you-an-atheist.187338/

 

[Sapiens]

Keep yourself alive, is it hard to prevent your DNA from damage?

Impossible. Each of us "suffers" over a million copying errors a day. The question is "is it hard to repair the damage to your DNA?" The answer is "No, it's fairly easy."

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

All created .

Just something is more complex than other.

Okay. So now we've clarified what it is you're claiming, why should we accept your claim? Why should we conclude that everything was created? When you look at, say, a cat, a rock or an electron, what about it tells you that it absolutely could not have arisen naturally?