End of Days - Is the Islamic Mahdi the Bible's Anti Christ?

[Lyndon]

I don't think my arguments are Ad Hominem attacks on your character. Please keep it civil and let's honestly discuss our differences on scripture and the differences of our faiths.

And your blatant Ad Hominem attacks on Muslims and their beliefs is Kosher in this argument, I think not. If you had made the same comments about Blacks or Mexicans, your comments would have been deleted a long time aqo, but blatant misrepresentations and vile slander against Muslims and their religion is A OK with you.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

And your blatant Ad Hominem attacks on Muslims

Sully hasn't once mentioned Muslims, nor has he attacked them.

and their beliefs is Kosher in this argument

You can't 'ad hominem' a concept.

I think not. If you had made the same comments about Blacks or Mexicans, your comments would have been deleted a long time aqo, but blatant misrepresentations and vile slander against Muslims and there religion is A OK with you.

And you've still to learn the difference between attacking or criticising beliefs and attacking or criticising the people who adhere to them.

You'd probably think that the statement 'tobacco companies make a fortune out of giving people a dangerous vice to indulge in' would be a personal attack against smokers calling them all selfish people.

 

[Lyndon]

The Mahdi is the future leader of Islam. Its like calling Jesus the devil, how does that reflect on Christians. The anti Christ is a devil, do you think Muslims are so evil they would elect a devil as their leader, the OP seems to think so.

 

[Sully]

The intention was to address aspects of Islam that give me pause. I am hoping believers of Islam can enlighten me...even correct me if my understanding (after reading the Quran and Haddith) is incorrect. I am not attacking Muslims; however, I did read things that give me pause. If you are a faithful Muslim defend your faith.

I have been in other forums and the contributor said Christians are the worst kind of blasphemers. They believed Jesus never said he was God and didn't die on the cross. . I didn't see it as an attack on me rather it was an attack (misconception) on my faith so I defended my faith. I think you should do the same. I believe in Christianity you believe in Islam great... lets start there. Why is Islam correct and Christianity wrong? Let's start a new string...

 

[raph]

There is also an antichrist in islamic theology. Who is he? A good christian guy who will oppose the mahdi?

This is getting wierd if you know that islam is also expecting an anti christ, a guy who wont have any good qualities from any religions view. If the mahdi opposes such a man, the mahdi cant be evil.

The only view point that makes sense to me

1. Islamic end time Jesus = christian end time Jesus.
2. Islamic anti christ = christian anti christ
3. The mahdi is a good man who appears before the return of Jesus (but christians dont know about him, because he got introduced to the world through Muhammad)

 

[Sully]

There is also an antichrist in islamic theology. Who is he? A good christian guy who will oppose the mahdi?

This is getting wierd if you know that islam is also expecting an anti christ, a guy who wont have any good qualities from any religions view. If the mahdi opposes such a man, the mahdi cant be evil.

The only view point that makes sense to me

1. Islamic end time Jesus = christian end time Jesus.
2. Islamic anti christ = christian anti christ
3. The mahdi is a good man who appears before the return of Jesus (but christians dont know about him, because he got introduced to the world through Muhammad)

 

[Sully]

It is interesting Islam (Hadith) has their version on the Anti Christ...the Dajjal. He is a strange figure...but he will defend the Jews; conversely, the Islamic Jesus (Isa) will battle alongside the Mahdi against the Jews. Christ Jesus (Christian) is not anti-Jew. So Jesus will not invade Jerusalem as Islamic traditions (Hadith) state.

I believe Jesus will come back to protect the Jews from the Mahdi. This is when the prophesy of Zechariah 12-14 is particularly compelling:

"And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced .They will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a first born son."

This was written hundreds of years before Christ and Mohammed. I believe it bespeaks of Jesus and ongoing love he has for his people even though he was crucified (pierced by spikes in his hand/wrist and feet). He clearly is not coming back to kill them: rather, he will demonstrate grace. The Jews will realize he was their Messiah and they will mourn for not receiving him. The grace of the Lord through Jesus is cornerstone doctrine.

Some of the weird things about the Islamic Dajjal is he is said to have one missing eye (although some Islamic traditions say he is missing his right eye and others say he is missing his left eye). He will have many Jewish followers and many women followers. Not all of the aspects of the Dajjal match the second coming of Jesus.

The characteristics of the Islamic Jesus(for clarity lets use the Islamic name Isa to prevent confusion) does not match the Christian Jesus Christ. He will implement Sheria Law and will be the breaker of crosses. He will force every Christian to convert to Islam or face death. Most of all Isa will work with the Mahdi to vanquish Israel and kill many Jews. This sounds more like The Anti Christ and False Prophet from a Biblical perception.

 

[Lyndon]

more rubbish.......

 

[Sully]

Why respond if you are not willing to elaborate why you think something is rubbish...it seems pointless

 

[Lyndon]

I responded already, Jesus is coming to bring Peace between Muslims and Christians, not to start a world war and destroy the earth, that's just rubbish.

 

[Sully]

What will Isa do about Israel? What will Isa do about Christians that do not believe he is Jesus? Certainly, many Christians will believe Isa is Jesus and will convert to Islam; however, many will not....what then?

 

[Lyndon]

Isa is the arabic pronounciation of Yeshua, Jesus doesn't exist in the Bible only Yeshua

 

[Pastek]

What will Isa do about Israel? What will Isa do about Christians that do not believe he is Jesus? Certainly, many Christians will believe Isa is Jesus and will convert to Islam; however, many will not....what then?

This is not how you should understand this. In your head it's this one vs this one or they will be "beheaded".

No, it's about the antichrist (The deciever in arabic "dajjal) who will lead many people astray.

Those people are not only jews but christians, muslims etc because the power of the antichrist will make them believe in him.

So i don't know what will be his plan, but there will be those who follow him and those who will wait for Jesus.

ONLY Jesus can fight the antichrist. He will not kill people because people will understand he is the real Messiah.
Jesus is coming for peace not for war.

Jesus will do nothing against christians as many will wait for him and follow him just as many muslims.

 

[Lyndon]

Thank you Pastek, its a delusion to think that the Muslim Jesus and the Christian Jesus are two different people, craziness.

 

[Pastek]

Thank you Pastek, its a delusion to think that the Muslim Jesus and the Christian Jesus are two different people, craziness.

I don't undestand why some people talk about the "Issa of the Quran" when there's not this kind of problem with other prophets.
I never hear of the "Moussa of the Quran" or any other fugure but when it's Jesus it's problematic for some people.
I guess it's a way to say that our religion is false.

 

[arthra]

Well I do think it's good to do some research into Traditions about the Mahdi so we can have a better perspective on the subject ... I'll post some Hadiths from sources here:

Harun Yahya asked:


In his hadiths the Prophet (saas) told us that the Mahdi will be opposed to terror and violence, and that the anarchic environment and all acts of terror will come to an end in his day.

The hadiths state that in the time of the Mahdi all weapons will fall silent and wars will come to an end:

War will lay down its burden (arms and the like). (Sunan Ibn Majah, 10/334; Imam Sharani)

No Blood Will Be Shed in the Time of the Mahdi

Again according to the hadiths,

the Mahdi will bring justice to the whole world, but not one single drop of blood will be shed. The Mahdi will be opposed to terror and violence. War and conflict will come to an end. Yet the Mahdi will follow a very peaceful path as he does all this. This attribute of the Mahdi is set out as follows in the hadith:

In the same way that bees gather round the queen, so people will gather round the Mahdi. He will fill the world, once filled with oppression, with justice instead. Such will be his justice that the sleeping man will not be awakened and no blood will be shed. The world will return to the Age of Happiness.

(al-Qawl al-Mukhtasar, pp. 29 and 48)

 

[Sully]

My understanding of Islamic Eschatology is the Mahdi's arrival is the first of the major signs of the the End of Days.The Mahdi's ascendancy is preceded by an army from the East carrying black flags (the black flag of jiihad). I don't know which hadith's show this benign treatment of the Jews and Christians. Most writings I have read have indicated Islam will spread voluntarily but primarily by the edge of a sword.

Sheikh Kalbani says that black flags coming from the area of Iran will signify the appearance of the Mahdi.
Abdur Rahman Kiani in "The Last Apocalypse" describes the many battles of the Mahdi bringing unbeliever to Islam; similarly, Harun Yahya writes the Mahdi will invade all the places (non Islamic) from East to West.

Islamic tradition indicates the Mahdi will join the army of Islamic warriors carrying black flags. The Mahdi will lead this army to Israel and re-conquer it for Islam. The Muslims will slaughter Jews until very few remain. Islamic traditions describe the Prophet said the last days will not come until the Muslims will fight the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind rocks and trees and the rocks and trees will say Muslim there is a Jew behind me come and kill him.

Islamic authors Mohammed Arif and Mohammad Amin Izzat write the Mahdi will be victorious and eradicate those pigs and dogs and the idols of this time so there will once more be a Caliphate based on the prophets as the Hadith states.Jerusalem (Baitumuqaddis) will be the location of the rightly guided Caliphate and the center of Islamic rule which will be headed by al-Mahdi that will abolish the leadership of the Jews.

While I appreciate the contributors here indicating we non-believers will convert to Islam by being drawn to it peacefully by the Mahdi (Queen Bee analogy) most Islamic traditions show most of the world coming to Islam after many battles of jiihad.

 

[Sully]

I find it interesting that many Islamic scholars cite those verses in the Bible (those verses that they do not believe have been corrupted by Jews and Christians). It seems to be a way to pick and chose scripture to support ones opinion. Ironically, often times they utilize scriptures that are describing the the Biblical Anti Christ. For example, Ka'ab al-Ahbar believe the rider on the white horse described in the Book of Revelation is the Mahdi. This opinion is confirmed by Islamic authors Mohammed Arif and Mohammad Amin Izzat. In their book Al Mahdi and the End of Time they quote Ka'ab al-Ahbar, " I find the Mahdi recorded in the books of the Prophets, the Book of Revelation says,"... and I saw and beheld a white horse he that sat on him went forth conquering and to conquer. Arif and Izzat go on to say it is clear that the man on white horse is the Mahdi. The rider on the white horse is the Anti-Christ.

Just a comment on the senseless violence in Orlando. While I believe homosexuality is a sin along with the sexual promiscuity that is rampant in our culture.. we must try to save our bothers and sisters in sin. Remember when Jesus defended the woman caught in Adultery...after he shamed her accusers he told her to go and sin no more. Islam seems to offer too many verses that validate violence. John- Chapter 16 verses 1-4, Jesus says..."In fact a time is coming that anyone who kills you will think he is offering a service to God. They will do this because they have not known the Father or me. I have told you this so you remember and remember that I warned you.

Shortly after 911 the US experienced a huge increase in people converting to Islam! It made me question why someone would convert to a religion in which people hailed the name of their God as they killed thousands. It seems to be a religion that was spawned in darkness. I find the accounts of Mohammed equally disturbing. When he saw Gabriel it was an unsettling experience; Mohammed considered suicide after the sightings; conversely, in the Bible whenever a prophet sees an angel they are reassured by the angel who usually would say "do not be afraid." I fear the sons and daughters of Ismael are being deceived by a religion created by Satan. The pervasive antisemitism found in the teachings of Islam is another clue to its origin. The Jews are the apple of Gods eye so antisemitism is seemingly demonically inspired...how else can one explain the continued persecution of a group of people that account for less than 1/10 of one percent of the world's population. I believe our Muslim brothers and sisters need to come into the light and love of Jesus Christ.

 

[Kelvin Davidson]

Every religion has its religious zealots which do horrible things in the name of God.

this is why we need someone made of valid miracles to guide those people to purity. the miracles would help people realize God is involved.