Epiphany Community Church in Fenton Michigan

[keithnurse]

Epiphany Community Church was a UU Christian church which was started in 1996 in Fenton, MI with funding from the Magi Network. It is no longer listed in the UUA congregation list. Does anyone know what happened to it? and also Epiphany Church in Owosso, Oklahoma?

 

[keithnurse]

"The Magi Network" website listed Epiphany Church in Fenton along with Epiphany in Ososso, Oklahoma and Faith Congregation in Pinellas county Florida as emerging Christian churches in the UUA but none of them still exist. The website of the Council fo Christian Churches in the UUA is also not up at this time. www.uuchristian.org is still in operation. I am wondering what, if anything, is the future of Christianity in the UUA?

 

[bicker]

Without regard to specifics, the future of UU Christianity in the UUA is probably the same as the future of any other specific religious perspective in the UUA. We welcome all who freely embrace the seven principles of Unitarian Universalism, without prejudice against any historical religious derivation. Is there some specific reason you would think otherwise?

 

[applewuud]

I'm rushing to comment here, without looking it up...
I recall that the UUA Board of Trustees decided to de-fund several "affinity groups" and change their status, including UU Buddhists, UU Christians, Jews, etc. and some youth groups. The reason was a lack of funds and the question of what justification there was in funding groups with an agenda that differed from that of the UUA. Lots of controversy emerged, I'll look it up if you wish.

 

[uu_sage]

I remember hearing form a couple of my friends who attended Epiphany that some of the reasons Epiphany shut down included Christophobia in the UUA, lack of support from the local district and the UUA, their ministers did not stay long, their fellow UUs in neighboring congregations had an appalling ignorance of Christian Universalist and Christian Unitarian faith. Epiphany closed its doors in 2009. If I were ordained right now I would gladly serve as its minister. I would have prevented the closure of Epiphany by revitalizing the church, inviting the neighboring UU churches and our sisters and brothers in Christ to worship and showing those gathered there's nothing to fear about UU Christians or UU Christian churches. I would fight tooth and nail for Epiphany's right to remain in the UUA and would defend it against unfair characterization.

 

[uu_sage]

Epiphany in Oklahoma is no more but it's current incarnation exists as the Welcome Table, Universalist in Turley. My friend Ron Robinson is the pastor. Their site is The Welcome Table, a free universalist christian missional community: 2011: The Welcome Table Year

 

[applewuud]

....some of the reasons Epiphany shut down included Christophobia in the UUA, lack of support from the local district and the UUA, their ministers did not stay long, their fellow UUs in neighboring congregations had an appalling ignorance of Christian Universalist and Christian Unitarian faith. ....

Why didn't the ministers stay long? There seem to be a lot of UU ministers who consider themselves Christians who'd be glad to serve a church like that.

Although, I have to say, why not just affiliate with the UCC if you want to have a liberal, explicitly Christian community? Part of this issue just has to do with preferences, people self-selecting environments they're comfortable with, instead of stretching their perspectives.

 

[uu_sage]

The reasons varied- some ministers like Peter Boullata and Parisa Parsa left for other parishes. Peter left for First Parish in Weston, MA (another UU Christian Church) and Parisa Parsa left for First Parish in Milton, MA. Others left because they were serving interim ministries or they were retired. There are some UU Christian Churches aligned with other denominations in addition to the UUA including The First Parish Bolton (American Baptist-UCC-Quaker), The All Souls Bethlehem Church (UCC-Disciples), The United Church of Winchester, NH/site of the Universalist Winchester Profession (United Methodist-UCC). There would be a love hate relationship in other denominations with some being more affirming than others. The UCC for instance is autonomous and mostly liberal except for some pockets of evangelicals and Calvinists. I would be willing to serve any liberal Church in any denomination. I would have to seek out parishes that are liberal or liberal leaning, along with an open and affirming stance. In the UUA, I would serve explicitly Christian churches like Universalist National and King's Chapel or Christian friendly ones like All Souls Tulsa or All Souls New York. The UUA cannot continue to harbor Christophobic sentiment. Christian Universalists and Christian Unitarians like me founded the UCA and the AUA and we should not have to leave this denomination in order to worship God and follow Jesus in freedom. The UUA should not shy away from theology or theological language. We cannot let people continue to associate Christianity with the Evangelicals or Fundamentalists. I want to seek out ministerial standing with the UCC and the UUA as a way of saying there are still UU Christians in the body of Christ and in the UUA. I aspire to start some new UU Christian churches in Southern California/West Coast and to revive some declining churches.

 

[rlstiers]

I was a member of Epiphany UU church in Fenton for about seven years. I left toward the tail end of it. The ministers never stayed, and it was very "clique-ey" with one person in particular who refused to give up control so others could take the driver's seat. I like it in that it was liberal, yet followed both the teachings of the Bible (since I was raised mainline Protestant) but incorporated other religions and world views. I WISH another church like that would start up in Fenton, I would join gladly!!!

 

[keithnurse]

Without regard to specifics, the future of UU Christianity in the UUA is probably the same as the future of any other specific religious perspective in the UUA. We welcome all who freely embrace the seven principles of Unitarian Universalism, without prejudice against any historical religious derivation. Is there some specific reason you would think otherwise?

I and most UUs I know would agree with what you are saying or at least promote that as the ideal for us to strive for. But, as UU Sage said, there is a certain amount of "christophobia" in the UUA. I know a very liberal United Methodist minister who has offered to speak at a UU church in my area which is between pastors. She was told that the people there are not open to even the more liberal versions of Chrisitianity. Rev Kathleen Rolenz spoke at my local UU once on "Not Three, the Trinity, UU and Me". It was a very good sermon but afterward I overheard some members saying that what Kathleen was speaking of is not "real" Christianity but that Pat Robertson, etc preach real Christianity. Jesus scholar Robert M Price looked into becoming a UU minister but said is seemed to be a dead end for him. I don't think it is appropriate to tell liberal Christians who agree with us to leave the UUA and "why don't you just join the UCC".

 

[seeker57]

I think the issue of "christophobia" stems from the fact that many UUs are former Christians.

In other words, been there, done that, were brutally beaten and cast out.

There would be a natural inclination to reject this teaching based on those experiences.

We have Christians in our congregation, but we are not a Christian congregation.

We recognize Christian holidays, just as we do Pagan, Sikh, Jewish, etc.

We discuss the teachings of Jesus just as we discuss the teachings of other faiths such as Islam But, I would not attend a church calling itself Christian any more than I would one calling itself Muslim.

I agree with Bicker,

. . . the future of UU Christianity in the UUA is probably the same as the future of any other specific religious perspective in the UUA.

Seeker

 

[uu_sage]

You're right, seeker57, Christophobia does largely stem from those who came from narrow expressions of Christian faith like fundamentalism, Conservative Evangelicalism or orthodox Catholicism. After being exposed to those expressions of the faith they thus lump all Christians including us UU Christians in with the Fallwells and Robertsons of the world and it is not fair. We as Christian Universalists and Christian Unitarians founded this tradition, and many of our churches including Universalist National in Washington DC and King's Chapel are still explicitly Christian.

I think the issue of "christophobia" stems from the fact that many UUs are former Christians. Christophobia also stems from a person's lack of knowledge of Christian Unitarian Universalist faith, liberal Christianity in and outside the UUA, and the theologians associated with our tradition. I would encourage the more Christophobic UUs to visit the UU Christian Fellowship website Unitarian Universalist Christian Fellowship for more information about our unity and diversity in Christ. I would also encourage them if they are near a UU Christian Church to visit us on Sunday mornings to get a glimpse of how we worship God, and follow Jesus in freedom. Christophobia prevents churches from growing, it sparks fights between Christians and non-Christians, theists against humanists, ministers against parishioners and it gets ugly. Since the 61 merger, we as UU Christian laypersons, ministers and churches have made to feel like we are not fully family in the UUA and we often have been forced into silence. Intolerance of any religious tradition is contrary to our Unitarian and Universalist faith, it runs contrary to example of our brother Jesus, and to all who have bore witness to God's ways and light. Many times this Christophobia has driven us into other denominations like the United Church of Christ (UCC) or the Episcopalians. We should not have to leave our denomination in order to worship God and follow Jesus in freedom. By these Christophobic actions some in the UUA are turning away good people like myself who would be perfect candidates for the ministry and also denies churches the freedom to call a Christian minister and for Christian churches to be supported by the UUA and planted by the UUA. The Christophobia and ignorance must. I hope and pray that there will be greater understanding and respect for each other no matter who they are or where they find themselves on the journey of faith. I would appreciate it if Christianity and the teachings of Jesus were given more attention on more Sundays than just Easter and Christmas. I understand that people have been hurt by narrow expressions of the faith and by people who claim to follow Jesus. On behalf on Christians everywhere I apologize for those who would use Christ and God's names and misuse scripture to justify hatred, exclusion, ignorance and injustice. Hate has no place in the body of Christ or in any religious tradition.

 

[seeker57]

Hey UU Sage,

I understand your position and agree that hatred and exclusion should not play any role in any UU congregation.

I think the problem arises in the very thing of which you spoke - having to leave a denomination to be able to worship.

Many of us have had to do just that. Whatever the reason, leaving the denomination in which you were raised is traumatic and damaging.

This is even more relevant when the reason you have been ostracized leads to your excommunication from an entire religion.

In our congregation, we don't denigrate Christians, but creating a Christian worship service would cause a revolt.

Many in the congregation are Pagan. We also have a number of Sikhs. Others are deist, a few are theist, there are some Buddhists and a smattering of atheists or agnostics.

I know this because I am on the worship committee. We don't have a minister, we are lay led.

We did a survey so we could tailor our programs to be inclusive of our members spiritual paths.

We have a few new people, and I think one or two of them may be Christian. Because of this, we may need to update our program schedule a bit and make sure their beliefs are addressed as well.

But that still won't make us a Christian congregation. We will still be UU.

While I respect the Judeo-Christian roots of both the unitarian and universalist movements, I also believe our faith has evolved and grown and now is much broader and, if you would, syncretic.

However, after saying that, I would like to experience a Christian Unitarian Universalist service.

After all, I can't say something isn't my cup if tea if I have never tried it. The problem is, it is a 2,000-mile journey to either of the churches you mentioned.

Perhaps, on one of my journeys, I will be able to do this.

Seeker

 

[uu_sage]

In addition to the explicitly Christian UU churches, there are UU Christian worship groups or fellowship groups meeting in theologically mixed UU churches. The UU Christian worship groups nearest you are-
Live Oak UU Church in Cedar Park, TX-
Sunday Prayer with Communion at 2:30 pm, 3rd Sundays

Horizon UU Church in Carrolton, TX
1st Sundays at 9 am meets in fellowship to discuss the UU Christian path and scripture.
3rd Sundays at 9 am UU Christian Worship service

Northwoods Unitarian Universalist Church in Woodlands, TX
Meets second Sundays at 5:30 at the church for potluck and fellowship

 

[bicker]

I and most UUs I know would agree with what you are saying or at least promote that as the ideal for us to strive for. But, as UU Sage said, there is a certain amount of "christophobia" in the UUA.

There is some antipathy for any perspective that places a single Word above all others. Other than that, I've seen no indication of what you speak of. The leader of the Chalice Circle I attend presents herself as a Christian, and there's no issue with that.

I know a very liberal United Methodist minister who has offered to speak at a UU church in my area which is between pastors.

Our UU church has swapped ministers, for a Sunday, with a liberal Christian church in our area.

She was told that the people there are not open to even the more liberal versions of Chrisitianity.

Friends of mine - UUs - moved to a new area and went to services at the closest UU church. After the service, they were welcomed, but informed that folks like them aren't welcome in that church - they are lesbians, and that wasn't a Welcoming Congregation. One of the unique aspects of UU is that individual churches can indeed opt-out of even fundamental principles of the faith. Does that make them less UU? I won't comment on that, but what cannot be refuted is that there are congregations, which reasonable people would understand to be UU congregations, that operate under principles that are not necessarily the same as the principles of UU itself. And that's okay. However, that doesn't make the principles of those congregations the principles of UU.