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Exacerbating Sin: Is it just? Is it faithful?
- Thread starter dybmh
- Start date
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
I'm not suggesting that mankind determine anything.
Ezekiel 18:24
24 And when the righteous repents of his righteousness and does wrong and does like all the abominations that the wicked man did, shall he live? All his righteous deeds that he has done shall not be remembered; in his treachery that he has perpetrated and in his sin that he has sinned, in them shall he die.
IOW, if the righteous becomes wicked there is no salvation for him. Notice that faith is completely missing from this. Faith is irrelevent if a person "does what the wicked man does".
I thought I gave you a decent list previously. Shooting up a school for instance. Keeping with Ezekiel 18...
10 If he beget a profligate son, a shedder of blood, and he commits upon his brother any of these [crimes].
11 And he does not do all these [walked in My statutes, and has kept My ordinances], but has even eaten [offerings of a meal] to the mountains and defiled his fellow man's wife;
12 Wronged the poor and the needy, committed robberies, did not return pledges, lifted up his eyes to the idols, committed abomination;
13 Gave out on interest, accepted increase on loans -shall he then live? He shall not live! He has done all these abominations; he shall surely die; his blood falls back on himself!
11 And he does not do all these [walked in My statutes, and has kept My ordinances], but has even eaten [offerings of a meal] to the mountains and defiled his fellow man's wife;
12 Wronged the poor and the needy, committed robberies, did not return pledges, lifted up his eyes to the idols, committed abomination;
13 Gave out on interest, accepted increase on loans -shall he then live? He shall not live! He has done all these abominations; he shall surely die; his blood falls back on himself!
27 And when a wicked man repents of his wickedness that he has done, and does justice and righteousness, he will keep his soul alive.
28 He will see and repent of all his transgressions that he has committed-he shall surely live; he shall not die.
29 And yet the house of Israel say, 'The way of the Lord is not right!' Is it My ways that are not right, O house of Israel? Is it not rather your ways that are not right?
30 Therefore, every man according to his ways I will judge you, O house of Israel, says the Lord God: repent and cause others to repent of all your transgressions, and it will not be a stumbling block of iniquity for you.
31 Cast away from yourselves all your transgressions whereby you have transgressed, and make yourselves a new heart and a new spirit, and why should you die, O house of Israel!
32 For I do not desire the death of him who dies, says the Lord God: so turn away and live!"
I think we can both agree about that?
Well, in Judaism the perscription is repentence and return. Christians focus on salvation. If I understand, from what I've heard, the Christian answer is no, a person cannot be saved twice? The idea is, if a Christian goes and shoots up a school, they were never actually saved in the first place?
Of course, those of the Book understand that Jesus gave perfect understanding and corrected the Levites and priests.
DNB
Christian
well, your Christology is highly commendable, for even I, who is considered a heretic by mainstream Christianity, believes that the doctrine of the trinity, or modalism, is from the devil himself. Absolutely no two ways about it.No .. they are mainstream .. 85% of Muslims are "sunni", and the vast majority believe in the ascension and return of Jesus.
They believe that Jesus is born of the virgin Mary, and is the Messiah.
..but not God, of course.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Not sure what you mean by those of the Book, but certainly Jews don't think Jesus gave perfect understanding of anything. He was just another Jewish voice parsing the law, no different than the other Pharisees. Except for his claims about himself, nothing he said was original.
Obviously that would be my first question. If I love God, could I really go and shoot up a school? We can be a "Christian" in name only even as God said you can be Jewish in name only. They were circumcised in the flesh but their hearts were far from YHWH
Jeremiah 4: Circumcise yourselves to the Lord And remove the foreskins of your hearts, Men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem,
But back to the issue... yes you can loose your salvation (the shalom of God).
Let's look at this differently. A man and a woman come into covenant of marriage. Are they perfect? Obviously not. Is it "perfect works" that keep it intact? nope. It is love that covers a multitude of sins.
When David sinned, it broke fellowship but not relationship.
Our relationship through our new covenant is based on promises that exceed just fulfilling or living our life completely in line with the commandments for we found that the commandments, though holy and right, just accentuated our incapacity to fulfill them. (Thus the multiplicity of offerings to cover them).
For us, we have entered into a marriage covenant with YHWH where He writes the laws on our hearts and the blood continually washes us when we miss it.
Does that mean I can "shoot up a school" as you mentioned? Obviously not for our covenant of love doesn't precipitate that lifestyle. He changes us from the inside out, not by our human effort but by His Holy Spirit that now dwells in us. We meet Him, not in the Holy of Holies made by human hands, but rather we have been joined spiritually with Him so that we encounter His mercy and grace continuously.
Yes, you probably can loose the relationship with God if you practice the above. We agree
In our book, if one continues and hardens our heart, we can reach a place where God says "You are no longer mine". If that would happen, there is no return.
That is what many muslims call Christians.
As far as the Jewish people... many did believe as they multiplied for the first 7 - 10 years before Gentiles were added.
As John said, 1 What was from the beginning, what we have heard, what we have seen with our eyes, what we have looked at and touched with our hands, concerning the Word of Life— 2 and the life was revealed, and we have seen and testify and proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and was revealed to us— 3 what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ. 4 These things we write, so that our joy may be made complete.
Like the write of Hebrews said:
1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom He also made the world. 3 And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,
So, for us and as per my signature, He gave perfect understanding.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
I have to disagree with you on this because, if I have "perfect understanding", that makes me omniscient, and if I told my wife I am omniscient, do you have any idea what I would likely hear next?
You are right and my wording was wrong. He did give the perfect revelation (in as much as people were able to receive) and was the perfect expression of God... but our understanding needs help. My lack of being able to express it correctly dictates that I am not omniscient and I don't have perfect understanding of the revelation.
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Certainly it was divine decree. Faith works on believing the promise. I propose the following
God gives promise >>> Man believes with faith >>> acts follow faith >>> healing manifested.
Faith will have an action but not actions have faith.
Absolutely! And I see that all stories show the Messiah. The hitting of the rock that produces water giving life - a type an shadow of Jesus producing life giving water after being hit on the pole.
No... I'm not sure that represents it correctly. Nowhere does it mention faith and certainly they didn't follow directions. Presumption and foolishness is misdirected faith.
No.. .he wanted to usurp authority--didn't trust God and the authority He set up,.
And thus the reason for two covenants - a new covenant. The letter of the law condemns (though it is good and holy) - God replaced with with a new and better covenant where mercy triumphs over the law and relationship isn't work based, it is love based.
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
OK, I can agree with this.
Let's not forget the details of the story. God commands Moses to speak to the rock, sanctifying God in front of the Jewsh people. Instead Moses strikes the rock, doesn't follow God's instructions, God is not sanctified and Moses is punished. Following God's directions precisely are required.
They had faith that their offering would be accepted. They didn't follow the rules ... ZAP!
He had faith that his offering would be accepted. He didn't follow the rules ... GULP!
Objection your honor!
The letter of the law blesses and condemns. Not just condemns. Again, please refer to Deut 28.So, we have 3 examples where we agree that following the letter of the law is required. Good.
Now you bring up a new covenant where the letter of the law is actively discouraged because it undermines faith in Jesus. At the beginning of your reply faith leads to action. The so-called new, better covenant discouarages action, in spite of every story in Tanach saying otherwise.
OK, I can agree with this.
I'm glad.
I think the issue here is that I am addressing two covenants while, it seems, you are addressing one.
Of course we agree with the storyline. My point was simply that I personally believe that Jesus is in the story.
Mosheh (deliverer/savior) was told to hit the rock and water came out (1st time). For us Jesus is the Rock of our Salvation where rivers of water flow unto everlasting life. Crucified (type of hitting the rock) - once and for all. The second time, as you said, he hits instead of speaking. Jesus wasn't crucified twice.
Under the Covenant of Mosheh, Deut 28 (blessing and cursing) - went into effect. When we weigh the law, it isn't just the good but also to bad. As you said
ZAP! punishment - he did not enter into the promise land.After we believe, we speak. In our covenant, however, Jesus redeemed us from the curse of the Law (Deut 28:15-->) - so grace now triumphed over judgement.
I suppose you could say that though it would be supposition. It doesn't say that. It just reported what they were doing in carrying the Ark of the Covenant on a cart.
Well...
I think you would have to show me that. The narrative that I read is that Korah usurped authority and God simply said it was an open (the group) and shut case.Yes... blessing and cursing.Objection your honor!
So, we have 3 examples where we agree that following the letter of the law is required. Good.
Now you bring up a new covenant where the letter of the law is actively discouraged because it undermines faith in Jesus. At the beginning of your reply faith leads to action. The so-called new, better covenant discouarages action, in spite of every story in Tanach saying otherwise.
It isn't that the law is actively discouraged but rather we approach differently.
Faith also leads unto confession (which is an action too). I'm just saying that God said there would be another covenant. Who are we to say "no" and establish what we think the covenant should be?
When He writes the law of "love God and love your neighbor" - it actually fulfills the basics of the law. At least in our understanding.
Thank you for sharing... you have been very respectful and friendly. We may end up not agreeing on some issues but I have enjoyed the interaction.
Have a blessed and prosperous New Year.
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dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
Thank you Kenny, same to you. and I very much appreciate your assistance dealing with the original question I had.
Messianic Israelite
Active Member
Hi dybmh. Good afternoon. I hope you are well. Just a point of interest, why do use the term 'Jehovah' when referring to the Name of the Almighty and not Yahweh? You do realize that such is an philological impossibility, don't you? His Name is Yahweh. But let's consider what you have written. You said "Setting up the Jewish people for failure would be the opposite of justice, the opposite of faithfulness. God tells the Jewish people the commandments are not too difficult; God's word is very near, and they can do it. Intentionally exacerbating sin makes God a liar, unjust, and unfaithful. How can this be?"
How has Yahweh set up the Jewish people for failure? The Jewish people themselves failed to live up to their agreement of the Covenant. When Yahweh sent His only begotten Son, the Messiah, to the Jewish people, they should've accepted him. But Yahshua was rejected because he was using the Name Yahweh, and his own name means Yahweh (Yah) is salvation (Shua). He said he came in His Father's Name in John 5:43 saying "I have come in my Father’s name, and you do not accept me; but if someone else comes in his own name, you will accept him." To this day, the form Yeshua is used when referring to the Messiah, which was not his name. 'Ye' was used as a substitute for 'Yah' to purposely prevent the Name of Yahweh being pronounced.
How would you feel if your name was purposely removed and changed to something else. And yet, this is what Jews have done and still to this day use words such as HaShem and Adonai. Therefore, they were not easily going to accept Yahshua who bore the Father's Name.
Let's consider the song of the vineyard. Isaiah 5 is where you will find it.
"I will sing for the one I love
a song about his vineyard:
My loved one had a vineyard
on a fertile hillside.
2 He dug it up and cleared it of stones
and planted it with the choicest vines.
He built a watchtower in it
and cut out a winepress as well.
Then he looked for a crop of good grapes,
but it yielded only bad fruit.
3 Now you dwellers in Jerusalem and people of Judah,
judge between me and my vineyard.
4 What more could have been done for my vineyard
than I have done for it?
When I looked for good grapes,
why did it yield only bad?
5 Now I will tell you
what I am going to do to my vineyard:
I will take away its hedge,
and it will be destroyed;
I will break down its wall,
and it will be trampled.
6 I will make it a wasteland,
neither pruned nor cultivated,
and briers and thorns will grow there.
I will command the clouds
not to rain on it.
7 The vineyard of the Yahweh Almighty
is the nation of Israel,
and the people of Judah
are the vines he delighted in.
And he looked for justice, but saw bloodshed;
for righteousness, but heard cries of distress."
Yahweh gave many opportunities for the Jewish people to grow and produce good fruit, He sent prophet after prophet, to bring them back to Yahweh and even sent His only begotten Son to them. But they rejected Him, despite the many miraculous works he did in the land of Israel. Let's read Mark 12:
"12 Yahshua then began to speak to them in parables: “A man planted a vineyard. He put a wall around it, dug a pit for the winepress and built a watchtower. Then he rented the vineyard to some farmers and moved to another place. 2 At harvest time he sent a servant to the tenants to collect from them some of the fruit of the vineyard. 3 But they seized him, beat him and sent him away empty-handed. 4 Then he sent another servant to them; they struck this man on the head and treated him shamefully. 5 He sent still another, and that one they killed. He sent many others; some of them they beat, others they killed. 6 “He had one left to send, a son, whom he loved. He sent him last of all, saying, ‘They will respect my son.’ 7 “But the tenants said to one another, ‘This is the heir. Come, let’s kill him, and the inheritance will be ours.’ 8 So they took him and killed him, and threw him out of the vineyard. 9 “What then will the owner of the vineyard do? He will come and kill those tenants and give the vineyard to others. 10 Haven’t you read this passage of Scripture:
The stone the builders rejected has become the cornerstone;
11 Yahweh has done this,
and it is marvelous in our eyes’?
12 Then the chief priests, the teachers of the law and the elders looked for a way to arrest him because they knew he had spoken the parable against them. But they were afraid of the crowd; so they left him and went away."
If Yahshua was accepted at that time, then the Kingdom could have been established then and there. But Yahshua was rejected by the very same people he came to save. Yahweh has been more than faithful, and still the Jews are welcome to repent and accept Yahshua and come in to His true Assembly, Yahweh has not withdrawn the door of opportunity for them. Haven't you considered the story of Joseph, when he was thrown in the pit by his brothers and in effect, killed. Yet, Joseph's children were grafted in and adopted by Jacob (or Israel). Isn't this an indication of Yahshua and His followers? The Joseph tribe received far more blessings than any other tribe.
The Jewish people were not keeping the Laws properly. They had forgotten to show love to their neighbor, which is why Yahshua said in John 13:34 "A new commandment I give unto you, that ye love one another; even as I have loved you, that ye also love one another." Why? Because they had forgotten this commandment. They weren't upholding it. The Jews had elevated the oral law to the same level and in some instances higher than the Word of Yahweh. Now I have respect for the Jews. I stand against anti-Semitism at every chance I get, however, to say that Yahweh simply set up the Jewish people to fail, is wrong. The Jewish people failed Yahweh, so read the song of the vineyard again and consider, whose fault was it really. You've no doubt read the Book of Judges. You get the thought that the Jewish people time and time again fell in to abject sin and idolatry and they had to be punished, and later saved. But Yahweh is certainly not to blame, and even as can be seen down millennia, Yahweh has always substituted the righteous for the unrighteous such as Seth for Cain, such as Isaac for Ishmael and such as Jacob for Esau.
Messianic Israelite
Active Member
Just skim read some of the posts on this thread, and thought I should mention that Yahshua the Messiah did not come to do away with the Law as most Chr-stians today believe. Lawlessness does not produce good fruit, and the idea that one can have faith without works is quite ridiculous (Jacob / James 2:17). Matthew 5:17-20 clearly tells us that Yahshua did not come to do away with the Law. Anyone that claims faith has replaced law is in my opinion doing exactly what Satan the Adversary wants them to do. Lawlessness will never get us in the Kingdom, and as Adam and Eve had to realize, and countless others throughout the history of mankind, breaking Yahweh's Law produces death and punishment (Romans 6:23).
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
Hello Messianic Israelite, Good wishes to you as well.
I chose to use the JW translation because I get the impression that the person who made the original comment about "exacerbating sin" is a JW. I could be wrong, but, I thought using their translation would be an olive branch and common ground to begin a respectful discussion.And you do seem to realize this is irrelevant to the topic.
Yes, and there have been several good answers moderating / qualifying the word "exacerbate".
I agree to here.
And this is where I disagree. But it's off-topic. So no need to go into details.
I dont know. It's very difficult for me to make any conclusions about what the Jewish people were thinking and feeling at that time.
How would you feel if I took the Gospels, flipped them around, and started making claims opposite to how you and others have been understanding it, practicing it, and making it part of your lives for thousands of years? Maybe pulling one verse from here, and one verse from there?
Yup, Isaiah preached during a period of crisis. Clearly this is not the case today. The vine is healthy happy and producing beautiful, delicious, healthy fruit.
But the common Jewish person in ancient times did not have access to these prophets. Today, the Jewish people have the entire canon at their fingertips with a few tippy-taps at a keyboard.
Yes. And for good reasons. Working wonders is a horrible way to judge whom to follow.
Let's read Deuteronomy 13
And yet one Christian told me ( somewhat recently ) that the rejection was required... There's so many ways to undertand the story, don't you think?
Self-fulfilling prophecy - Wikipedia
AGREED! That's relevant, and on-topic. Well done!
A lovely offer, but the Jewish people are duty-bound to decline. You see, once people start idolizing something, it becomes strictly off-limits to Jewish people. So that means, any congregation, any assembly, any church of any kind which invokes a god in the flesh is not permitted. Even if that group does not itself worship the idol, invoking it's name is forbidden. Why, because that's the beginning of idol worship. Is it ok for non-Jews? I think that's a qualified, yes. It really depends on what's going on internally in that specific person. But for a Jewish person, even dipping our pinky toe in that pool of water is not proper.
Grafting is prohibited. Kil'ayim (prohibition) - Wikipedia
No, what's happening there is the natural desire for any disciple of any religous group wanting to emulate their master. In this case the master was Jewish, so the adherent wants to be considered Jewish inspite of the laws which would require them to abandon their master.
What does the name Joseph mean? Go all the back to his naming, and the *additional*
blessing seems to be divine will.Agreed that the laws were not, past tense, being followed by all the Jews simultaneaously. Had they forgotten that one specific very important rule, I don't know. Maybe some had. Elevating the oral law above the written law, I think that's false. Here's a challenge, it's off topic, but I'm genuinely curious. Show me oral law which contradicts written law? Usually Christians are not knowledgeable enough about Jewish law to support their claims about it. Will you be the exception to this?
Thank you, sincerely.
Agreed.
Agreed.
Looking at the entire Tanach, it seems as if salvation is one of several ways forward.
No immediate objections to this part. Thank you for your thoughts.
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dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
In general, non-Jews are not bound to the law. Be free!
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
There is no law that prevents a Jew from believing that somebody is the promised Messiah, is there?
It is a moot point, whether Jesus claimed to be G-d, as I'm sure you are aware.
Historians continue to debate the precise moment when early Christianity established itself as a new religion, apart and distinct from Judaism. It is difficult to trace the process by which the two separated or to know exactly when this began. Jewish Christians continued to worship in synagogues together with contemporary Jews for centuries.
Jewish Christian - Wikipedia
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
The law is complicated. Most non-Jews don't appreciate nor acknowledge the law in total. That said, the problem that I'm focusing on is that the messiah in question has become the object of worship by a huge chunk of people and the majority of Christians. If you pay close attention to the words I used, I said, "any group which invokes ... " That is a clear violation of written law, Exodus 23:13.
I don't see that he ever claimed that during the story; but the story shows he did allow people to worship him. Matthew 14:33, Matthew 28:17, Luke 24:52.It is a moot point, whether Jesus claimed to be G-d, as I'm sure you are aware.
Well, we don't really know what was happening in those synagogues. Also, it's not that the Jewish people at that time are the greatest role models if we accept the gospel narrative. And lastly, people don't get prohibitted for attended Jewish services because they hold idolatrous beliefs.
Messianic Israelite
Active Member
Hello Messianic Israelite, Good wishes to you as well.
And you do seem to realize this is irrelevant to the topic.
Yes, and there have been several good answers moderating / qualifying the word "exacerbate".
I agree to here.
And this is where I disagree. But it's off-topic. So no need to go into details.
I dont know. It's very difficult for me to make any conclusions about what the Jewish people were thinking and feeling at that time.
How would you feel if I took the Gospels, flipped them around, and started making claims opposite to how you and others have been understanding it, practicing it, and making it part of your lives for thousands of years? Maybe pulling one verse from here, and one verse from there?
Yup, Isaiah preached during a period of crisis. Clearly this is not the case today. The vine is healthy happy and producing beautiful, delicious, healthy fruit.
But the common Jewish person in ancient times did not have access to these prophets. Today, the Jewish people have the entire canon at their fingertips with a few tippy-taps at a keyboard.
Yes. And for good reasons. Working wonders is a horrible way to judge whom to follow.
Let's read Deuteronomy 13
And yet one Christian told me ( somewhat recently ) that the rejection was required... There's so many ways to undertand the story, don't you think?
Self-fulfilling prophecy - Wikipedia
AGREED! That's relevant, and on-topic. Well done!
A lovely offer, but the Jewish people are duty-bound to decline. You see, once people start idolizing something, it becomes strictly off-limits to Jewish people. So that means, any congregation, any assembly, any church of any kind which invokes a god in the flesh is not permitted. Even if that group does not itself worship the idol, invoking it's name is forbidden. Why, because that's the beginning of idol worship. Is it ok for non-Jews? I think that's a qualified, yes. It really depends on what's going on internally in that specific person. But for a Jewish person, even dipping our pinky toe in that pool of water is not proper.
Grafting is prohibited. Kil'ayim (prohibition) - Wikipedia
No, what's happening there is the natural desire for any disciple of any religous group wanting to emulate their master. In this case the master was Jewish, so the adherent wants to be considered Jewish inspite of the laws which would require them to abandon their master.
What does the name Joseph mean? Go all the back to his naming, and the *additional*
Agreed that the laws were not, past tense, being followed by all the Jews simultaneaously. Had they forgotten that one specific very important rule, I don't know. Maybe some had. Elevating the oral law above the written law, I think that's false. Here's a challenge, it's off topic, but I'm genuinely curious. Show me oral law which contradicts written law? Usually Christians are not knowledgeable enough about Jewish law to support their claims about it. Will you be the exception to this?
Thank you, sincerely.
Agreed.
Agreed.
Looking at the entire Tanach, it seems as if salvation is one of several ways forward.
No immediate objections to this part. Thank you for your thoughts.
Hi dybmh. Good afternoon. You said: "How would you feel if I took the Gospels, flipped them around, and started making claims opposite to how you and others have been understanding it, practicing it, and making it part of your lives for thousands of years? Maybe pulling one verse from here, and one verse from there?" Oh I understand. Chr-stianity has flipped the New Testament to say that Yahweh abolished the Law with Yahshua's death, which isn't true. Something my faith is witnessing every day. But we haven't taken the Hebrew Scriptures and twisted it to our liking. Yahshua the Messiah fulfilled the prophesies in the Hebrew Scriptures regarding him. I fail to see how Jews cannot perceive this. Like you said, 'the Jewish people have the entire canon at their fingertips with a few tippy-taps at a keyboard', they are able to research these things for themselves. They have no excuse.
You also said: "A lovely offer, but the Jewish people are duty-bound to decline. You see, once people start idolizing something, it becomes strictly off-limits to Jewish people. So that means, any congregation, any assembly, any church of any kind which invokes a god in the flesh is not permitted. Even if that group does not itself worship the idol, invoking it's name is forbidden. Why, because that's the beginning of idol worship. Is it ok for non-Jews? I think that's a qualified, yes. It really depends on what's going on internally in that specific person. But for a Jewish person, even dipping our pinky toe in that pool of water is not proper." In my faith we do not believe Yahshua was Yahweh in the flesh. If Yahshua was Yahweh, who was at the controls of the universe for the 33 years that Yahshua was alive? Yahshua was Yahweh's *representative*, a perfect example of how Yahweh would have acted and spoke if He were on this earth. Ever read Genesis 19:24? "Then Yahweh rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from Yahweh out of heaven". Here you'll find mention of two Yahweh's. A Yahweh in heaven and a Yahweh on earth. Yahshua pre-existed with the Father and dealt with the Jewish people. He was one of the angels that dealt with Abraham and others and he bore the same Name as the Father. You can read John 8:58. It harmonizes. Yahshua is Yahweh's Son, but Yahshua always directed the Father as being greater than he (John 14:28).
Regarding the oral law and contradictions between that and the Word of Yahweh, it took me 5 seconds to find this article 69ca89_86e78408591d46aa9843afc36d5c0ce9.pdf (wixstatic.com). But I haven't read through all of it.
You ask me to read Deuteronomy 13 but Deuteronomy 13 says:
"13 If there arise in the midst of thee a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and he give thee a sign or a wonder, 2 and the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other elohim, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them; 3 thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or unto that dreamer of dreams: for Yahweh your Elohim proveth you, to know whether ye love Yahweh your Elohim with all your heart and with all your soul. "
Yahshua was pointing people to worship Yahweh, to keep the commandments saying, to love Yahweh your Elohim with all your heart and loving your neighbour were two of the greatest commandments in Mark 12:28-34. It's the Jews that were denying Yahweh. They were and still do to this day deny His Name, and have many traditions which are not based on scripture. What did Yahshua say to Satan in Matthew 4:10 "Yahshua said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship Yahweh your Elohim, and serve him only.’”
You said: "Yup, Isaiah preached during a period of crisis. Clearly this is not the case today. The vine is healthy happy and producing beautiful, delicious, healthy fruit." They are some deep-rooted problems with Judaism and you could say Judaism is more divided than ever.
That is your opinion. It's actually an opinion that has no merit. Isaiah 56:2 says "Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that holdeth it fast; that keepeth the sabbath from profaning it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil." How can we keep our hand from doing any evil? By keeping the Covenant. Further, the New Covenant which Chr-stians claim to believe they are connected to, says:
"31 Behold, the days come, saith Yahweh, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: 32 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was a husband unto them, saith Yahweh. 33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith Yahweh: I will put my *law* in their inward parts, and in their *heart* will I write it; and I will be their Elohim, and they shall be my people. 34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know Yahweh; for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith Yahweh: for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin will I remember no more."
You said 'be free'. This suggests you don't believe the Laws of Yahweh to be a law of liberty, which is a shame. We are free when we keep Yahweh's Law. It's sin that entangles us, and makes us bound with a heavy yoke (Psalm 107:9-11). Galatians 5:1 says "For freedom did the Messiah set us free: stand fast therefore, and be not entangled again in a yoke of bondage [sin]." What does Peter say? "15 For so is the will of Yahweh, that by well-doing ye should put to silence the ignorance of foolish men: 16 as *free*, and not using your freedom for a cloak of *wickedness*, but as bondservants of Yahweh."
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