Exterminating god

[Prestor John]

What is good about the Biblical god? Even Hitler who was badness, wasn't as wicked, imo. Having had my childhood spoilt by having the idea of god being forced upon me, I have a right to have my say.

God forced Himself on you?

 

[Scott C.]

Is it really at all disrespectful to make disparaging or comedic comments about a thing that no one can provide inter-subjectifively verifiable evidence for? As in, you can't provide evidence that compels any given other person to believe - like we can do for gravity, or 2+2=4, or the detrimental effects of consistent alcohol abuse to the liver, or any number of things that God is supposedly even more fundamental than.

It would be like complaining that it is disrespectful of someone to joke around that we are in The Matrix. Actually... it's even worse than that. It's much more like complaining that it is disrespectful for someone to joke around that we AREN'T in The Matrix, while simultaneously insisting that we are - without evidence. Now, you want to talk about stupid... ?

The joke was a reference to the fact that members of my church where a religious garment which is sarcastically made fun of by some as "magic underwear". The inference was that perhaps God also wears the magic underwear and therefore can't be destroyed. The comment was made to Katzpur who belongs to the same church as I. I don't usually have thin skin, but the magic underwear thing seems to trigger me.

 

[Kenny]

So then how do we even know that this isn't referring to people who believe that god doesn't exist as the "pure?" I mean, look at it... there is no mention of God... "unbelieving" could be in reference to those who deny the claim that God doesn't exist. Aren't people who deny that "God doesn't exist" unbelievers of that claim? Very interesting, isn't it? Perhaps you are the one whose mind and conscience are defiled? Given the rest of the context of The Bible, this would seem a little awkward - but no more awkward than a thousand other places that this same sort of passage left to interpretation is put forward in the book.

Since it is, as you admit, "all in how one reads it," then what would you say if I decided to read it the way that I proposed above? Could you deny me this? If so, how?

As I said.. it is all on how you read it.

Maybe you should read up on it? It seems pretty clear to me.

 

[viole]

This post gets the award for both stupid and disrespectful.

Fair point, although it was a sort of teasing, because I know the LSD church is sensitive about that

But I can assure you that I have the same respect for all religious beliefs, no matter how weird.

Ciao

- viole

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

The joke was a reference to the fact that members of my church where a religious garment which is sarcastically made fun of by some as "magic underwear". The inference was that perhaps God also wears the magic underwear and therefore can't be destroyed. The comment was made to Katzpur who belongs to the same church as I. I don't usually have thin skin, but the magic underwear thing seems to trigger me.

I see. And what are these garments purported to do for one? If they have no special effect, then are they not just undergarments? Perhaps I am confused...

 

[Milton Platt]

If god exists and is as wicked as indicated in the Bible, humans should be looking at ways of exterminating it. Any ideas as to how it could be done?

Um...I think this is in the wrong forum?

 

[Milton Platt]

By stopping giving any damns if you're an atheist who wants to exterminate what you see as a fictional character, and go do something useful with your life instead of wasting your time ranting about a made up being?

Yeah, I think this doesn't belong here. It's okay to questions notions of a god (but this seems a silly one) however, there are perhaps better forums on this board to do this.

 

[Prestor John]

Fair point, although it was a sort of teasing, because I know the LSD church is sensitive about that

But I can assure you that I have the same respect for all religious beliefs, no matter how weird.

Ciao

- viole

It's the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

That's the name of our church, violin.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

As I said.. it is all on how you read it.

Maybe you should read up on it? It seems pretty clear to me.

Then it is clear to me also. You need to be cleansed, says I. I must read up on how one goes about such a cleansing. I will look for reference to "unbelievers" or "non-believers" that do not explicitly mention what it is that one is not believing in, and use any references surrounding those as to how those people are to be treated or convinced that their unbelief is just plain wrong. All the while, I, of course, will assume that I am making the correct interpretation of the texts, and everyone else is nuts. I've seen this done many, many multiple times. So many times, in fact, that I have come to believe that this is the proper use of the text. Do you agree?

 

[viole]

It's the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

That's the name of our church, violin.

I guess, but many use the acronym. Even here. Especially because it is a very long name.

Ciao

- viole

 

[InChrist]

If god exists and is as wicked as indicated in the Bible, humans should be looking at ways of exterminating it. Any ideas as to how it could be done?

I think you are suffering from the condition of spiritual blindness or delusion which the scriptures describe as resulting in, "calling good evil and evil good". I guess if you honestly want to try to exterminate the Creator of heaven and earth, you could try seeking the devil for ideas as he has been attempting the same thing for ages and ages. Although, his success rate isn't promising.

 

[Prestor John]

I guess, but many use the acronym. Even here. Especially because it is a very long name.

Ciao

- viole

You didn't even use the acronym.

You said, "Fair point, although it was a sort of teasing, because I know the LSD church is sensitive about that"

LSD =/= LSD

The most important portion of the name of our church is the name "Jesus Christ" not "Latter-day Saint"

We are the Church of JESUS CHRIST of Latter-day Saints.

 

[Moz]

I am of the opinion (however worthless to anyone else) that they got it dead wrong. God is an unnecessary concept. For all intents and purposes this "God" is not there - or if it is, does not want to be knowable so as to appear as if it isn't. Therefore it does not matter. To my mind, the "extermination of god", as you put it, has absolutely no consequences.

If you truly believe that people would go about the business of "doing whatever they want" to the tune of killing one another, raping, pillaging, destroying everything in a fit of wicked debauchery if/when they found out that there was no God, then you are discounting all of us who hold to a higher moral standard of our own (nurture/nature/culture/introspective/etc.) crafting who do not, and would not do those things. If you would only listen, we might teach you, so that you too could be a good person. As it stands, you admit that you are not, and that, like you believe others would, you would take up the torch and set the world alight if you found out God did not exist. Well guess what, friend? I'll be there on that day, alongside others like me, to stop you.

Hi.

Dostoevsky and Nietzsche were both writing on the dangers they foresaw in the Atheistic ideologies that were emerging amongst the european intellectual schools. Both men thought that the loss of the underlying responsibility to something transcendent would lead mankind to grope around for new idols to follow. The 200 000 000 people killed by totalitarian regimes in the 20th century show that they were not wrong.
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If you truly believe that people would go about the business of "doing whatever they want" to the tune of killing one another, raping, pillaging, destroying everything in a fit of wicked debauchery if/when they found out that there was no God,

The Marxist and Maoist philosophies that denied the authority of a God ended up making rational decisions that killed millions. It is interesting that Alexander Solzhenitsyn in his gulag archipelago pointed out that it was the religious prisoners of the soviet system that really stood out as having something that did not crumble when pressured to go against their conscience. The Nazi example is the same. It was the religious people who went to the camps because they refused to go along with the "new learning" that the intellectuals had come up with.
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Looking at the world today i suppose that China would be the example, in religious matters, of how the no God policy thing would go. All that happens in these situations is the STATE steps into the role of religion and the nation into the role of God. It is fascinating to watch the confucian system of filial responsibility being subsumed beneath the rationalist Chinese policies.
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higher moral standard of our own (nurture/nature/culture/introspective/etc.) crafting who do not, and would not do those things. (nurture/nature/culture/introspective/etc.) crafting who do not, and would not do those things.

Hmmmm ... this seems a grandiose claim that has little backing when looking at the moral standards that prevail today in the secular world. So you think that without religion mankind will magically find a true moral path that will preclude warfare bigotry and bring about a more equitable world. Really.

Please give me the example of a single thinker, or a school of intellectual thought that has been able to articulate a higher moral standard of our own. You could try Marx and Engles but the results of their morality killed millions so maybe not.
Dawkins? Harris? Hitchens? They are close..... until you get them to talk about the "meme as a unit of cultural transmission" then they waffle. The "meme" when you dig into it turns out to be the Archetypal stories that were encoded in our religious traditions.

The Wests answer seems to be that you can do whatever you want as long as "you do no harm" but then they can't agree on what harm is. It seems like either the left or the right will have to get rid of the others ideology for the west to stop eating itself. That might lead to some death though.
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The Biblical declaration that man is made in the image of God is the most transformative concept that has ever arisen amongst mankind. The other creation stories, including evolution, attribute mankind as a base creature with no intrinsic value. There is NO moral system that can be developed if there is no acceptance of the difference between men and beasts.
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If you were to TEACH me how to be a "good person" on what standards of behaviour would my goodness be moulded?
Nature?
The Animal world which you think we are a part of?
Should the evolutionary principle be the base on which we choose?
The example of the animal world is for the successful or dominant to pro-create across as many mates as possible for the betterment of the species. That might not go down well with the ones who miss out.
Is adultery immoral in your world of personal responsibility for your morals. Marriage is a religious construct right? The idea that man and woman are meant to be together is "social engineering" by our ancestors to control us ... right. There is NO real reason for moral action in relationships other than standards impossed by the past.

What is the moral impediment to infanticide or senicide?
If life is not "sacred" then what is the prohibition against taking life? Fear of the State?
Why would i not steal? The cultural we live in teaches us that if you can game the system then you are untouchable.
If all you have is the dominant power structures or popular ideologies to judge your morals off then there is no solidity and as Nietzsche said.... we will not know, up, down, forwards or backwards.
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Peace

 

[Darkforbid]

There will be no Extermination here!

 

[Rival]

There will be no Extermination here! View attachment 33230

Go Ace!

 

[Darkforbid]

Go Ace!

This is my wallet

 

[Rival]

This is my walletView attachment 33231

This is me,

 

[Scott C.]

Fair point, although it was a sort of teasing, because I know the LSD church is sensitive about that

But I can assure you that I have the same respect for all religious beliefs, no matter how weird.

Ciao

- viole

Ok, I'm fine with a little teasing and you probably thought you were safe with Katzpur when I butted in. Now I feel guitly for being too harsh... that's a Mormon characteristic.

 

[Darkforbid]

This is me,

Love the dungarees

 

[Rival]

Love the dungareesView attachment 33233

Classic cybermen are the best. I love The Moonbase and Invasion. But then I love all cybermen stories.