Facebook must be broken up

[ADigitalArtist]

From: Facebook antitrust lawsuit: Dozens of states and the FTC sue company for alleged anticompetitive behavior - CNN

"Dozens of states and the federal government sued Facebook (FB) on Wednesday in twin antitrust lawsuits, alleging that the social media giant has abused its dominance in the digital marketplace and engaged in anticompetitive behavior.

The Federal Trade Commission, in particular, is seeking a permanent injunction in federal court that could, among other things, require the company to divest assets, including Instagram and WhatsApp, effectively breaking up Facebook as we know it. The states are also calling for the company to be broken up, if necessary.
...

"For nearly a decade, Facebook has used its dominance and monopoly power to crush smaller rivals and snuff out competition," [New York Attorney General Letitia] James said at a press conference Wednesday. "By using its vast troves of data and money, Facebook has squashed or hindered what the company perceived to be potential threats." "

If this succeeds it will be a new reminder in our digital age that free markets don't exist when we allow companies to get 'too big to fail.' Hopefully they're also setting their sights on Amazon for similar reasons.

 

[Quintessence]

I'm not particularly concerned with Facepalm, honestly. It's nonessential and could be vaporized tomorrow and it wouldn't matter a lick. But Spamazon? That's an entirely different story. Spamazon should be torn up first.

 

[Revoltingest]

If Facebook failed, it would actually be a good thing.
So I see no need to break them up. However, they
should endure some severe sanction for monopolistic
behavior. Breaking them up could be part of that.

Disclaimer....
For various reasons, I loathe Zuckerberg & Facebook.
So there's some bias here.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

If Facebook failed, it would actually be a good thing.
So I see no need to break them up. However, they
should endure some severe sanction for monopolistic
behavior. Breaking them up could be part of that.

Disclaimer....
For various reasons, I loathe Zuckerberg & Facebook.
So there's some bias here.

That's the problem, they're too big to fail. There's no penalty they can't pay for violations, and they can either afford to hostile takeover or undercut any competition. When you're around facebook, facebook always wins. That's the problem. But monopolistic behavior is more difficult to define for online companies. The laws (as lawmakers are wont to do) haven't been updated in a very long time and were not meant for consideration of these kinds of problems.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

I'm not particularly concerned with Facepalm, honestly. It's nonessential and could be vaporized tomorrow and it wouldn't matter a lick. But Spamazon? That's an entirely different story. Spamazon should be torn up first.

I agree, Amazon is doing more damage on a global scale than Facebook by a long mile.

 

[Revoltingest]

That's the problem, they're too big to fail. There's no penalty they can't pay for violations, and they can either afford to hostile takeover or undercut any competition. When you're around facebook, facebook always wins. That's the problem. But monopolistic behavior is more difficult to define for online companies. The laws (as lawmakers are wont to do) haven't been updated in a very long time and were not meant for consideration of these kinds of problems.

If Facebook failed the consequences would be minimal...perhaps even positive.
It's not like they're a bank, landlord, or antique scrap iron dealer.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

If Facebook failed the consequences would be minimal...perhaps even positive.
It's not like they're a bank, landlord, or antique scrap iron dealer.

Nothing that has hundreds of billions of dollars tied up in it would have minimal consequences if it failed. Just because the market isn't in something you can touch doesn't mean it isn't a vital part of modern industry.

 

[Revoltingest]

Nothing that has hundreds of billions of dollars tied up in it would have minimal consequences if it failed. Just because the market isn't in something you can touch doesn't mean it isn't a vital part of modern industry.

If a bank fails, it affects more than just stockholders...also depositors (greatly).
If Facebook fails, it affects stockholers' portfolio, but no one else adversely (financially).
They don't have many employees relative to company value.
Those posting on the site would simply migrate elsewhere.
And I could watch Zuckerberg suffer.

 

[Secret Chief]

I agree, Amazon is doing more damage on a global scale than Facebook by a long mile.

I'll just put this out there, regarding Amazon. With persisting lockdowns of varying degrees of severity Amazon (and online supermarkets) have basically kept the UK ticking over.

 

[Revoltingest]

I'm not particularly concerned with Facepalm, honestly. It's nonessential and could be vaporized tomorrow and it wouldn't matter a lick. But Spamazon? That's an entirely different story. Spamazon should be torn up first.

Breaking up Amazon is interesting.
How do you imagine it happening?

 

[ADigitalArtist]

If a bank fails, it affects more than just stockholders...also depositors (greatly).
If Facebook fails, it affects stockholers' portfolio, but no one else adversely (financially).
They don't have many employees relative to company value.
Those posting on the site would simply migrate elsewhere.
And I could watch Zuckerberg suffer.

If facebook failed, it would effect the millions of companies which deal with them in buying and selling advertiser data, and a bunch of businesses related to the business of social media (a trillion dollar enterprise). Like the entire framework of online business centers around social media advertising.

Which is why they're breaking it up, not closing it down.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

I'll just put this out there, regarding Amazon. With persisting lockdowns of varying degrees of severity Amazon (and online supermarkets) have basically kept the UK ticking over.

I know. I'm sure Bezos started [insert crude reference to self-pleasuring] when he realized that there was no international competition to threaten him on monopolizing a global catastrophe.
I'm fortunate enough that I can actively ignore Amazon and do curbside pickup of pretty much anything I need, groceries, medication, et all.

 

[Revoltingest]

If facebook failed, it would effect the millions of companies which deal with them in buying and selling advertiser data, and a bunch of businesses related to the business of social media (a trillion dollar enterprise). Like the entire framework of online business centers around social media advertising.

Which is why they're breaking it up, not closing it down.

Advertising services are highly fungible.
Contrast this with failure of something like an auto company.
Production lines in the supply chain are dedicated & not easily
switched to other suppliers or customers.

I agree that Facebook collapsing would be financially harmful
to many. But just not enuf compared to other industries &
companies. They're not too big to fail....just too big because
of anti-competitive practices.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Advertising services are highly fungible.
Contrast this with failure of something like an auto company.
Production lines in the supply chain are dedicated & not easily
switched to other suppliers or customers.

I agree that Facebook collapsing would be financially harmful
to many. But just not enuf compared to other industries &
companies. They're not too big to fail....just too big because
of anti-competitive practices.

I disagree on the amount of fungibility you think is in advertising services, but I'm not talking 'too big to fail' as a monicker for why government would do a bail out. I'm talking literally too big to fail. As in the anti-competitive qualities exist because they can use their monetary monopoly to bypass any threats.

 

[Secret Chief]

I know. I'm sure Bezos started [insert crude reference to self-pleasuring] when he realized that there was no international competition to threaten him on monopolizing a global catastrophe.
I'm fortunate enough that I can actively ignore Amazon and do curbside pickup of pretty much anything I need, groceries, medication, et all.

You are indeed.
The bricks and mortar high street was already dying because of online shopping, covid lockdowns have only hastened that demise.
I am also aware of the issues around Amazon employees, but of course they are not unique to Amazon (eg drivers keeping plastic bottles in their vans so they can go to the loo).

 

[Revoltingest]

I disagree on the amount of fungibility you think is in advertising services, but I'm not talking 'too big to fail' as a monicker for why government would do a bail out. I'm talking literally too big to fail. As in the anti-competitive qualities exist because they can use their monetary monopoly to bypass any threats.

Understood.

 

[Brickjectivity]

...There's no penalty they can't pay for violations,...

That gives me an idea. That could actually be written into statute as a legal standard which separates companies which are so large that they can afford violations from companies which would be destroyed by violation fines. That might offer legal remedies for regulating business with less bias and for determining which are too large to be legal. Maybe. I'd want to run it be Economists and Lawyers, first.

 

[Revoltingest]

That gives me an idea. That could actually be written into statute as a legal standard which separates companies which are so large that they can afford violations from companies which would be destroyed by violation fines. That might offer legal remedies for regulating business with less bias and for determining which are too large to be legal. Maybe. I'd want to run it be Economists and Lawyers, first.

But do you have any good ideas?
<snicker>

 

[Brickjectivity]

But do you have any good ideas?
<snicker>

...and I'd probably want to run it by some titans of business, first...

 

[Twilight Hue]

Cash cows don't fail.