Fake & Other News

[Revoltingest]

Regarding the propaganda flavor of news......
Journalists Exposed By WikiLeaks Will Now Cover Trump White House

Our own news media look worse for democracy than the
Russians, even if they were guilty of all accusations.

 

[Scuba Pete]

What I hear @Revoltingest and the other wight wingers whine about is that some journalists are Democrat? They haven't shown any real bias in reporting, they just keep whining about it.

When Comrade Trump keeps lying big fat turdy lies: it's news. It's not bias. It's not spin. It's news.

Why do you think Trump is so adamant about Russia being innocent? We have EVERY intelligence agency in the USA, from the FBI to the Brownie Troop in Hoboken convinced that the Russians tried to influence our election and Comrade Trump says we just can't know. He goes on to promise that we'll learn something Wednesday or Thursday and doubles down on that lie with a insight that he knows things we don't. This is from the man who skips security briefings. Even James Woolsey, a former FBI director and one of his top advisors admits that the Russians hacked.

The right have been conned. They've been bending reality for so long that they can't tell when the spin stops and the outright lies surpass them. They claim that Clinton is a huge liar and then they provide practically nothing to support it. Anyone with any integrity can come up with 20 or 30 real lies for every one they try to associate with Clinton. The difference is on the order of several quanta.

The comes in trying to show them how unreasonable they are being. It's no use. You simply can't reason with an unreasonable person. Especially one that is willfully deluded because they think it's the right thing to do. This will not be an easy next four years. It will be hard for them to maintain their fantasy about Trump for so long.

 

[Revoltingest]

What I hear @Revoltingest and the other wight wingers whine about.....

Ahem....tis you socialists crying in your appletinis about getting whopped in the election.
Make excuses galore, but your thieving incompetent barely ambulatory war monger lost.
And to lose to a boor like Trump....tsk, tsk.
You must feel such shame.
Perhaps that's why you lash out so.

 

[Scuba Pete]

You must feel such shame.

Only in that I keep expecting you to become reasonable and you keep disappointing. I give you too much credit, my friend.

 

[habiru]

What I hear @Revoltingest and the other wight wingers whine about is that some journalists are Democrat? They haven't shown any real bias in reporting, they just keep whining about it.

When Comrade Trump keeps lying big fat turdy lies: it's news. It's not bias. It's not spin. It's news.

Why do you think Trump is so adamant about Russia being innocent? We have EVERY intelligence agency in the USA, from the FBI to the Brownie Troop in Hoboken convinced that the Russians tried to influence our election and Comrade Trump says we just can't know. He goes on to promise that we'll learn something Wednesday or Thursday and doubles down on that lie with a insight that he knows things we don't. This is from the man who skips security briefings. Even James Woolsey, a former FBI director and one of his top advisors admits that the Russians hacked.

The right have been conned. They've been bending reality for so long that they can't tell when the spin stops and the outright lies surpass them. They claim that Clinton is a huge liar and then they provide practically nothing to support it. Anyone with any integrity can come up with 20 or 30 real lies for every one they try to associate with Clinton. The difference is on the order of several quanta.

The comes in trying to show them how unreasonable they are being. It's no use. You simply can't reason with an unreasonable person. Especially one that is willfully deluded because they think it's the right thing to do. This will not be an easy next four years. It will be hard for them to maintain their fantasy about Trump for so long.

 

[tytlyf]

^ a continuous living example of how fake news and RW propaganda controls people. The sad thing is that they vote based on that stuff.

 

[Underhill]

Many believe Trump lied.
Many believe Hillary lied.
I'm sure both actually did at times.
Media minions will take sides for one or the other.
This is how politics has always been, & always will be.
Nothing new under the Sun.
But we can consume news with useful skepticism.

See there you go again with the absurd notion that both lied at some point so they are both equally liars.

Hillary got a few details wrong. But was generally pretty accurate.

Trump made his bones lying about Obama. Then proceeded to do the same, along with the rest of the republicans, to Clinton and with every speech exaggerating and outright lying about the condition the country is in. It is not the same.

Useful skepticism means weighing things accurately. You seem incapable of that. Get pulled over going a 120mph in a school zone and you would be quick to point out that the other motorist were all speeding too. After all, they were going 30 in the same 25 zone.

 

[tytlyf]

Trump made his bones lying about Obama. Then proceeded to do the same, along with the rest of the republicans, to Clinton and with every speech exaggerating and outright lying about the condition the country is in. .

RW media and republicans have been lying about the economy for years. Hannity is notorious for fake information. Conservatives are angry that the elderly retirees aren't working.

 

[Revoltingest]

See there you go again with the absurd notion that both lied at some point so they are both equally liars.

Did I say "equal"?
No.
I wonder if it's possible to compare Democrats & Republicans without the former excusing their own by claiming...
"False equivalency!
False equivalency!
Our side lies slightly less frequently than they!
Therefore we're clearly better, & you cannot compare us!
They lie!
Nothing else matters!"

Neither Dems nor Pubs seem to understand what the word, "lie", means.
Tis not merely stating something disagreed with, or even something factually wrong.
To lie is to intend to deceive.
I don't know who lies more, Donald or Hillary.
How do you know when deception is the goal?
You don't.
Given Donald's unrestrained & chaotic stream of consciousness approach to PR,
& Hilda's more considered & carefully planned approach, I'll wager your left one
that her mis-statements are more often dishonest. But still, neither you nor I know.

Hillary got a few details wrong. But was generally pretty accurate.

Trump made his bones lying about Obama. Then proceeded to do the same, along with the rest of the republicans, to Clinton and with every speech exaggerating and outright lying about the condition the country is in. It is not the same.

Useful skepticism means weighing things accurately. You seem incapable of that. Get pulled over going a 120mph in a school zone and you would be quick to point out that the other motorist were all speeding too. After all, they were going 30 in the same 25 zone.

I hereby revoke your license to analogize.
This defense of Hillary as a relative paragon of virtue is just too desperate.

We were presented with a terrible choice.
And this terrible choice was the result of Hillary's corrupt relationship with the DNC, leftish media
& financial backers. So her dishonesty is ironically more the cause of this travesty we faced.
We could'a had Bernie if you Dems were more aware of all this, & acted upon it responsibly.
Were I the High Sparrow of RF, I'd have you doing the walk of atonement!

 

[Revoltingest]

Conservatives are angry that the elderly retirees aren't working.

I thought most conservatives are non-working elderly retirees?
And what about us non-working elderly libertarian retirees....what are we....chopped liver!?

 

[habiru]

I'm guessing that the real Fake news is going down.

French far right eager for US site Breitbart to hit France

What’s “alt-right” in German? Breitbart News is expanding in Europe

 

[Underhill]

Did I say "equal"?
No.
I wonder if it's possible to compare Democrats & Republicans without Democrats excusing their own by claiming...
"False equivalency!
False equivalency!
Our side lies slightly less frequently than they!
Therefore we're clearly better, & you cannot compare us!
They lie!
Nothing else matters!"

Oh I know, you hate the false equivalency claim because it seems to be a staple in your tool bag. It doesn't make you any more right.

Neither Dems nor Pubs seem to understand what the word, "lie", means.
Tis not merely stating something disagreed with, or even something factually wrong.
To lie is to intend to deceive.
I don't know who lies more, Donald or Hillary.
How do you know when deception is the goal?
You don't.
Given Donald's unrestrained & chaotic stream of consciousness approach to PR,
& Hilda's more considered & carefully planned approach, I'll wager your left one
that her mis-statements are more often dishonest. But still, neither you nor I know.

Oh, so because Trump is stupid his disinformation doesn't count? You want us to believe the guy thought he was telling the truth for the years he was claiming Obama was a muslim born in Kenya... That's patently nuts. Either the guy is an idiot, or a liar. But the whole idiot thing doesn't really hold water does it? I mean it is one thing to speak something you think is true once, then correct it later. It is another to repeat the same lies over and over for months while most of the world is telling you you're quantitatively or demonstrably wrong.

Compare that to Clinton who 'lied' about emails. She did that a few times in press conferances when she claimed there were no classified emails. Turns out, there were a few, out of tens of thousands. How likely is it that she legitimately thought there were none and stopped making that statement upon learning the truth? A hell of a lot more likely than Trump honestly believing Obama was born in Kenya for years, even after Obama produced a birth certificate and numerous witnesses came forward.

It is not hard to tell the difference. But you have to be willing to see it.

I hereby revoke your license to analogize.
This defense of Hillary as a relative paragon of virtue is just too desperate.

Who made that claim? A paragon of virtue can't run for mayor of Podunk, Iowa.

We were presented with a terrible choice.
And this terrible choice was the result of Hillary's corrupt relationship with the DNC, leftish media
& financial backers. So her dishonesty is ironically more the cause of this travesty we faced.
We could'a had Bernie if you Dems were more aware of all this, & acted upon it responsibly.

And we could'a had one of the other 73 people running on the republican ticket if you Pubs had pulled your heads out of your bums.

 

[Revoltingest]

Oh I know, you hate the false equivalency claim because it seems to be a staple in your tool bag. It doesn't make you any more right.

In a nutshell.....
You're claiming certainty about a highly subjective issue.
To call "false equivalency" when I challenge this is the false false equivalency fallacy.
I'm not claiming that I'm right.
Only that you're not even wrong.

Oh, so because Trump is stupid his disinformation doesn't count?

"Count" is not the operative word here.
"Disinformation" is only your opinion that he is intentionally deceiving people.
You claim to know this, but you've no window into his soul.
And you cut Hillary slack which you don't extend to him...a double standard.

You want us to believe the guy thought he was telling the truth for the years he was claiming Obama was a muslim born in Kenya... That's patently nuts. Either the guy is an idiot, or a liar. But the whole idiot thing doesn't really hold water does it? I mean it is one thing to speak something you think is true once, then correct it later. It is another to repeat the same lies over and over for months while most of the world is telling you you're quantitatively or demonstrably wrong.

Compare that to Clinton who 'lied' about emails. She did that a few times in press conferances when she claimed there were no classified emails. Turns out, there were a few, out of tens of thousands. How likely is it that she legitimately thought there were none and stopped making that statement upon learning the truth? A hell of a lot more likely than Trump honestly believing Obama was born in Kenya for years, even after Obama produced a birth certificate and numerous witnesses came forward.

It is not hard to tell the difference. But you have to be willing to see it.



Who made that claim? A paragon of virtue can't run for mayor of Podunk, Iowa.

And we could'a had one of the other 73 people running on the republican ticket if you Pubs had pulled your heads out of your bums.

You mistakenly believe (or mischievously claim) I'm a Republican.
No.....I've been a card carrying Libertarian since the 70s, although I will occasionally vote
for a Dem or Pub, eg, for McGovern to prevent Nixon, Trump to prevent Hillary.
It's uncomfortable pragmatism, ie, picking the lesser of 2 evils.

Try to see the political spectrum as planar rather than linear.
Then you'll see Libertarian as an extreme which is neither Dem nor Pub.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

There have always been people who couldn't tell that The National Enquirer wasn't a serious attempt at journalism. It just seems the percentage of people who can't identify tabloid news when they look at it, is higher than it used to be.

To be fair, people have access to more information than ever, but this isn't really something most people can reasonably or responsibly handle, so I don't blame them for getting overwhelmed and confused.

 

[Underhill]

In a nutshell.....
You're claiming certainty about a highly subjective issue.
To call "false equivalency" when I challenge this is the false false equivalency fallacy.
I'm not claiming that I'm right.
Only that you're not even wrong.

"Count" is not the operative word here.
"Disinformation" is only your opinion that he is intentionally deceiving people.
You claim to know this, but you've no window into his soul.
And you cut Hillary slack which you don't extend to him...a double standard.

No, I don't cut her more slack. I'm saying she spoke a few times on a subject. The facts came out, she stopped saying it.

Trump lied for years, both back when he was crying about Obama and on the campaign trail. And his lies were reported repeatedly. At some point it becomes impossible to claim ignorance of the falsity of your claims.

Could he have thought they were true when he first said them? Sure. But 3 months later? a year? I doubt it. If he did then that speaks to other, more worrying, issues.

You mistakenly believe (or mischievously claim) I'm a Republican.
No.....I've been a card carrying Libertarian since the 70s, although I will occasionally vote
for a Dem or Pub, eg, for McGovern to prevent Nixon, Trump to prevent Hillary.

Try to see the political spectrum as planar rather than linear.
Then you'll see Libertarian as an extreme which is neither Dem nor Pub.

I know you are a libertarian, as you should know I am not a democrat. I was simply playing the blame game with you.

 

[Revoltingest]

No, I don't cut her more slack. I'm saying she spoke a few times on a subject. The facts came out, she stopped saying it.

Trump lied for years, both back when he was crying about Obama and on the campaign trail. And his lies were reported repeatedly. At some point it becomes impossible to claim ignorance of the falsity of your claims.

Could he have thought they were true when he first said them? Sure. But 3 months later? a year? I doubt it. If he did then that speaks to other, more worrying, issues.



I know you are a libertarian, as you should know I am not a democrat. I was simply playing the blame game with you.

OK...I understand.
I've nothing to add except that dishonesty wasn't a factor in my vote.
Some think she's worse...others think he's worse. To me it's all meh.
It boiled down to what I thought the candidates would likely do in office.
Hillary was the greater danger regarding war & big government.

 

[Underhill]

OK...I understand.
I've nothing to add except that dishonesty wasn't a factor in my vote.
Some think she's worse...others think he's worse. To me it's all meh.
It boiled down to what I thought the candidates would likely do in office.
Hillary was the greater danger regarding war & big government.

I suspect you are wrong on both counts. We shall see.

 

[Revoltingest]

I suspect you are wrong on both counts. We shall see.

To only "suspect" is progress.
I'm not sure of the outcome either.

 

[Revoltingest]

Here's a hard one to classify.....
Sean Hannity, Juan Williams reject gun story as 'sensationalized'; CNN defends report
Is it erroneous or propaganda (intentional misrepresentation)?

 

[Revoltingest]

I suspect you are wrong on both counts. We shall see.

I suspect I'm wrong too.
But I also suspect I'm right.