First green Minister-President in germany on the horizon

[Flankerl]

What an election.


Yesterday there were state elections in Baden-Würrtemberg and Rheinland-Pfalz.
And in both states the greens(Alliance '90/Greens) won big time. Iam not sure if thats good or not... we'll see.


Baden-Württemberg preliminary official results 2011

CDU(conservative/centre): 39%(-5.2%)
SPD(social democracy/centre): 23.1%(-3%)
Alliance '90/Greens(green politics/centre-left): 24.2%(+12%)
FDP(liberalism/centre right): 5.3%(-5.4%)
The Left(socialism/left): 2.8%(-0.3%)
Others: 5.6%(+0.3%)

Since there is the 5% hurdle the left wont be a part of the parliament. And since the Greens will never do a coalition with the CDU the Greens will most probably lead a coalition with the SPD. Also the greens won

And thats the first time in germany. Quite interesting. And since Baden-Würrtemberg is the home of many many nuklear power plants it probably means the death of nuklear energy in germany.



The election in Rheinland-Pfalz wasnt that of a turnover.
Preliminary official results 2011

CDU: 35.2%(+2.5%)
SPD: 35.7%(-9.9%)
Alliance '90/Greens: 15.4%(+10.8%)
FDP: 4.2%(-3.8%)
The Left: 3%(+0.4%)
Others: 6.5%

But the SPD lost big and there will be only 3 parties in the parliament because of the 5% hurdle.



Oh my what a day. oO

 

[Herr Heinrich]

Interesting. I will have to bring this up in my German class on Wednesday. I hope this proves to be a good thing in the near future. Now we just have to get the Green party going (as in make it popular) here in the US. Of course we would have to fix the Electoral College first. *sigh* I despise America.

 

[Flankerl]

If you want to score some extra points you can point out how this affects the Bundesrat.

If the Greens enter a coalition with the SPD in BaWü and if the SPD enters a coalition with the Greens in Rh-Pf then the votes in the Bundesrat will look like this.

The CDU gets 25 votes from the states they govern with the FDP.
The SPD gets 24 votes from the states they govern alone, with the greens or the Left.
The Greens get 6 votes from governing BaWü with the SPD, so perhaps they will be pro SPD but i dont think that they will follow them on everything.
And 14 votes go to neutral states where there is a SPD/CDU or CDU/SPD or CDU/FDP/Greens coalition.

Before the elections the federal government already couldnt do much because they didnt had enough votes but now its nearly impossible.
Which is good because Merkel is a coward.

 

[Herr Heinrich]

If you want to score some extra points you can point out how this affects the Bundesrat.

If the Greens enter a coalition with the SPD in BaWü and if the SPD enters a coalition with the Greens in Rh-Pf then the votes in the Bundesrat will look like this.

The CDU gets 25 votes from the states they govern with the FDP.
The SPD gets 24 votes from the states they govern alone, with the greens or the Left.
The Greens get 6 votes from governing BaWü with the SPD, so perhaps they will be pro SPD but i dont think that they will follow them on everything.
And 14 votes go to neutral states where there is a SPD/CDU or CDU/SPD or CDU/FDP/Greens coalition.

Before the elections the federal government already couldnt do much because they didnt had enough votes but now its nearly impossible.
Which is good because Merkel is a coward.

Germany's system of government is confusing. So basically what you are saying is that Merkel is a lame-duck Kanzlerin?

 

[Flankerl]

Why is it confusing? Most countries have an upper house and a lower house.

The upper house is the Bundesrat while the lower house is the Bundestag.


If Merkel wanted to change the constitution she'd need a 2/3 majority in the Bundesrat. And for most other laws she'd need a simple majority.
But now even that is gone.


Its a control mechanism to prevent another '33, like anything in germany.

 

[sandandfoam]

The Greens were an absolute disaster in government here in Ireland. The party was completely wiped out in this years election.
Do you think the German Green party is likely to be better in government than ours?
Was there a big protest vote in your view given the crisis in the wider EU economy (i.e. Greece, Ireland Spain Portugal and Italy)?

 

[Flankerl]

I dont know. Personally i dont like the party because they usually are populists. Which is of course easy if you are in the opposition.

The reason they won so many votes is because of S21 and because of the earthquake/tsunami and nuklear disaster in japan.
Germans tend to be a bit over sensitive and the first reactions were that they'd have to shut down their own plants or disaster will happen. As mentioned in another thread the commission for nuklear safety will test the plants if they could survive a +9 earthquake. Because you know... germany is an epicentre of earthquake activity.
Wonder how long it will take for them to check if the plants could survive a tsunami.



The vote had nothing to do with the so called EU crisis. People really dont give a damn. If there would have been another bailout some parties might have gotten more votes. But only if germany had to pay. Like in the case of greece were people really werent much interested till some greek politicians pulled the WW2 card.

 

[sandandfoam]

The vote had nothing to do with the so called EU crisis. People really dont give a damn. If there would have been another bailout some parties might have gotten more votes. But only if germany had to pay. Like in the case of greece were people really werent much interested till some greek politicians pulled the WW2 card.

That's interesting because it was reported here that the German electorate was ticked off with Frau Merkel because of the bailouts.

 

[Flankerl]

Well the green electorate is overall not important because those who voted green in Baden-Württemberg are conservatives and liberals who over all dont like Stefan Mappus the MP candidate of the CDU.
He really really really is disliked in his party.


Its quite interesting that they decided to let him run for MP.


And S21 should not be left out. For us normal people who are not from Stuttgart and therefore not ******* crazy it seems like just another project that would actually help transportation in central europe.
But for people in Stuttgart its like.... i dont know they are crazy. They treat some 100 year old railway station like a museum or castle which has much "cultural" meaning.



I say they are crazy.

 

[sandandfoam]

Are you from Baden-Württemberg Flankerl?

 

[Flankerl]

Nope i live in Nordrhein Westfalen.

 

[sandandfoam]

Nope i live in Nordrhein Westfalen.

ah. I know Baden-Württemberg that's why I was wondering - but I don't know around you

 

[Flankerl]

What do you mean?

North Rhine-Westphalia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Herr Heinrich]

Why is it confusing? Most countries have an upper house and a lower house.

The upper house is the Bundesrat while the lower house is the Bundestag.


If Merkel wanted to change the constitution she'd need a 2/3 majority in the Bundesrat. And for most other laws she'd need a simple majority.
But now even that is gone.


Its a control mechanism to prevent another '33, like anything in germany.

I know very little about Germany's legislative branch. I haven't learned about it yet. When you put it in the above terms it does make it seem a little bit simpler.