First time posting a thread, so go easy on me✌️

[F1fan]

Yeah you are right about to understand the evolution you have to have a certain knowledge before in order to have a better understanding. And this is one of the reason why I have neglected to go to deeper in this topic,
So maybe you can share your thoughts about evolution? Maybe a summary on what you think is probable and what is questionable ?

Remember, evolution is not a matter of opinion. Exprts have done work for over 150 years and their expert conclusions is that evolution is real and an ongoing phenomenon. Species are still evolving, and they have been observed. Look at how bacteria evolve and make antibiotics less effective. Look at how flu virus change every year and new vaccines have to be made to fight them. That is evolution happening in our lives.

There are creationists who lie about evolution, and they are to be avoided. The wise get science right.

 

[McBell]

Sure I get you, that why I want to hear different views from different people

You did not answer the question...

 

[Spice]

No, this wouldn't make sense.

And there is no coincidence here.

None of the people you listed are said to be anything other than homo sapiens.

And do you really think a homo erectus knew he was a homo erectus? Do you really think the men of Abraham and Moses' times had any idea what a homo sapien was? Come on, now.

So all of them would have to put where Noah is. The Nephilim according to the Bible were supposed to be "giants", but neanderthals were only around 1.5m - 1.7m high depending on gender, so that doesn't make sense either.

And "giant" doesn't always mean in physical statue.

Also, why would you change years to mean millions, as far as I know, there is no support for this in the Bible. It is equal to some people claiming that a day in Genesis could mean billions/millions of years because that would kind of fit better with science. But there is nothing in the Bible supporting this either.

Never said there was biblical support. In fact, I said just the opposite, in all caps, plus I specified that it was a fun thought. So if you read my post with such error, I can only imagine what you discern in reading the Bible. Slow down and comprehend. A more appropriate negative response would have been along the line of "oh, creative, but wildly out there!"
Namaste

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Details will change as more data is dicovered. But the details don't mean evolution is in question. The new data only tells us how evolution took different paths through history. Evolution happens all over the world, but since there are different species and different environments (like hot or freezing) there are different species. That's why polar bears are white in the arctic, but brown and black in more moderate climates. Evolution happens, but scientists are still putting together the story of how evolution did its thing through changing climate and changing species.

Experts in science know to keep their religion separate. As we see there are theists who try to make their religion relevant to science and it only gets screwed up. It's corrupt religion and bad science. Get your religion right by getting science right. This is what the wise people do.

There is none. There are creationists who have corrupted their religion by misrepresenting science by creating bogus claims about it. They are frauds, but they have been successful in taking advantage of some believers who are desperate to make their religion seem valid in a way that it can't be. In the end they ruin their religion and don't learn science, so utter failure.

I agree with you that people in general distort evidences and information about different things. That’s why I opened this thread is to educate myself and really learn what exactly is the evidences. So I am a Muslim and the topic evolution comes often in question. We don’t deny evolution ik general for example the idea that animals evolved to their environment . The issue is the idea that humans weren’t always humans.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

You did not answer the question...

Oh sorry, no I don’t know if there is evidence that contradicts the evolution. I am looking now into the evidences that support evidence

 

[ChristineM]

@MayPeaceBeUpOnYou

Here is a good source for learning about evolution.
Understanding Evolution – Your one-stop source for information on evolution

Im afraid it's a lot to read but i think that's the only way.

 

[F1fan]

I agree with you that people in general distort evidences and information about different things. That’s why I opened this thread is to educate myself and really learn what exactly is the evidences. So I am a Muslim and the topic evolution comes often in question. We don’t deny evolution ik general for example the idea that animals evolved to their environment . The issue is the idea that humans weren’t always humans.

Why is it a problem that humans evolved?

Consider this, if a human is so insecure about the evidence that we evolved, how wise are they? Shouldn't religion teach a prson to accept facts and reality, and be at peace with it? Heck, religious folks could say that as humans evolved it is indicative of our emergence as a wise and noble species. To be in denial of facts only suggests that those believers are not yet wise, and are afraid of reality. Where do you prefer being, afraid of facts, or wise?

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Why is it a problem that humans evolved?

Consider this, if a human is so insecure about the evidence that we evolved, how wise are they? Shouldn't religion teach a prson to accept facts and reality, and be at peace with it? Heck, religious folks could say that as humans evolved it is indicative of our emergence as a wise and noble species. To be in denial of facts only suggests that those believers are not yet wise, and are afraid of reality. Where do you prefer being, afraid of facts, or wise?

Well it’s a problem because it contradicts form a Islamic point of view, since we are told in the Quran that we are 2 different creations of god.
Also the idea that we all come from a single cell is something we disagree with, but I assume this theory is not part of the subject evolution .

 

[F1fan]

Well it’s a problem because it contradicts form a Islamic point of view, since we are told in the Quran that we are 2 different creations of god.

Not all Muslims. That is a problem of interpretation for some Muslims, just like with some Christians. They have allowed their religion to distort science, and how wise is that? How were writers in the 7th century supposed to know about biology, and geology, and cosmology, etc.? They wrote about what they knew and believed in the 7th century, and you as a Muslim need to understand that, and be sure you are living as a Muslim in the 21st century, taking advantage of the work of many scientists, including Muslim scientists.

Also the idea that we all come from a single cell is something we disagree with, but I assume this theory is not part of the subject evolution .

This is a problem some religious literalists have, and wise Muslims and Christians living in the 21st century ned to not get dragged down by their problems of interpretation. Believers in the 21st century can have their religious tradition, but still get science right.

If you feel pressure to live in the 7th century perspective, then don't use cars, don't use modern devices, give away your computer, don;t use guns or phones. If you acknowledge that you live in the 21st century and use all modern technology, then you have already accepted that science has moved past the 7th century and you should accept everything the 21st century has to offer, including that humans evolved, and that life began as a pool of chemicals. There's nothing to be afraid of to accept the facts.

 

[The Hammer]

What @The Hammer is referring to is abiogenesis, which is still unknown.

Evolution is only about how life evolves.

Yes, thank you.

 

[Spice]

Well it’s a problem because it contradicts form a Islamic point of view, since we are told in the Quran that we are 2 different creations of god.
Also the idea that we all come from a single cell is something we disagree with, but I assume this theory is not part of the subject evolution .

This is totally a non-scientific analogy, because I don't have much of a scientific mind, but it's an example.
1) you have a chicken's egg. You can a) fertilizer it and make a chicken, or b) scramble it and make an omelet. Both different results began as an egg.
2) you have two plants a) lima bean, and b) sweet peas. You cross breed them and You still have Lima beans and sweet peas, but now you also have butter peas. So should some insect come along and make lima beans go extinct, you still have butter peas, but no way to make them again should they go extinct.

So isn't it fathomable that God had two creations of compatible qualities that blended, at His hand we'll say, that created man, but one of these creations didn't survive outside of Eden? That leaves great apes, and man with no other known half. They're not the same, but they have shared properties.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Not all Muslims. That is a problem of interpretation for some Muslims, just like with some Christians. They have allowed their religion to distort science, and how wise is that? How were writers in the 7th century supposed to know about biology, and geology, and cosmology, etc.? They wrote about what they knew and believed in the 7th century, and you as a Muslim need to understand that, and be sure you are living as a Muslim in the 21st century, taking advantage of the work of many scientists, including Muslim scientists.

People can believe what they desire. Islam is based on the Quran which is not a science book. Also to accept evolution doesn’t put a person out of Islam. As long if it doesn’t contradict the Quran which we believe is the word of god, then there is no issue.

This is a problem some religious literalists have, and wise Muslims and Christians living in the 21st century ned to not get dragged down by their problems of interpretation. Believers in the 21st century can have their religious tradition, but still get science right.

If you feel pressure to live in the 7th century perspective, then don't use cars, don't use modern devices, give away your computer, don;t use guns or phones. If you acknowledge that you live in the 21st century and use all modern technology, then you have already accepted that science has moved past the 7th century and you should accept everything the 21st century has to offer, including that humans evolved, and that life began as a pool of chemicals. There's nothing to be afraid of to accept the facts.

Wel that’s a bit harsh lol. I don’t accept the idea that a pool of chemicals became life then I shouldn’t use a car or modern devices.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

This is totally a non-scientific analogy, because I don't have much of a scientific mind, but it's an example.
1) you have a chicken's egg. You can a) fertilizer it and make a chicken, or b) scramble it and make an omelet. Both different results began as an egg.
2) you have two plants a) lima bean, and b) sweet peas. You cross breed them and You still have Lima beans and sweet peas, but now you also have butter peas. So should some insect come along and make lima beans go extinct, you still have butter peas, but no way to make them again should they go extinct.

So isn't it fathomable that God had two creations of compatible qualities that blended, at His hand we'll say, that created man, but one of these creations didn't survive outside of Eden? That leaves great apes, and man with no other known half. They're not the same, but they have shared properties.

I am aware animals and humans have similarities, no issues with that. From our point of vieuw is that because it’s how the creator created it.

 

[Quintessence]

Yeah you are right about to understand the evolution you have to have a certain knowledge before in order to have a better understanding. And this is one of the reason why I have neglected to go to deeper in this topic,
So maybe you can share your thoughts about evolution? Maybe a summary on what you think is probable and what is questionable ?

There's only ever so much time to study things, so I understand the need to prioritize. Especially in the sciences, where there is so much depth and breadth that specialization is all but required. I really struggled with that, actually, when I was looking into graduate school and chose a program of study because I tend to be more of a holistic thinker who resists wanting to (over)specialize. But as I went through my graduate studies I kinda realized the need for it as I saw how deep the pond really goes, so to speak. With that in mind, while I have a deeper knowledge of biological evolution than most I'm definitely not a specialist in that area - an evolutionary biologist could give a better appraisal of current frontiers and trends in the field. That said there are a couple topics that pertain more to what I know (conservation biology) that relate to evolution that are active and ongoing research questions:

• Sixth Mass Extinction. There have been five previous mass extinction events in Earth's history and the broad consensus is humans have initiated a sixth mass extinction event. Addressing and studying that - its impact on present and future biodiversity - is of interest.
• Climate Change. Compounding the sixth mass extinction are dramatic shifts in ecosystems worldwide driven by climate change. These are major drivers of biological evolution and will shape the future of biodiversity on Earth.

Conservation biology is an interesting field in the sciences because it toes the line between impartial study of the world around us and making normative statements that influence policymaking and goals. Both of the above questions have implications for human culture and behavior - what do we do to stop causing a sixth mass extinction? Do we help save and restore species threatened with extinction? These are not scientific questions, but questions of philosophy, religion, and government.

In any case, I always find it important to keep in mind that there are many ways of knowing humans can apply to the world around them. A lot of the "controversy" about biological evolution comes from an ironically unscientific insistence that the scientific way of knowing is the only valid way of knowing. A dive into the philosophy of science and philosophy of knowledge more broadly is sort of beyond the scope of this thread I think, but it is enough to understand that humans have many ways of understanding the world around them and making meaning from what they observe. Biological evolution doesn't have to exclude other ways of knowing and telling the story. It sure doesn't for me.

 

[Aupmanyav]

.. the theory tells us that the ancestors of the humans were animals correct?

They still are.

Okay so the single cell theory is not part of evolution?

We started with being that. Even now, our beginning is with a single cell.

 

[ChristineM]

I am aware animals and humans have similarities, no issues with that. From our point of vieuw is that because it’s how the creator created it.

Humans are animals

 

[Aupmanyav]

I am aware animals and humans have similarities, no issues with that. From our point of view is that because it’s how the creator created it.

For you, Qur'an has all answers. Do you doubt Allah's word? Then why are you asking about evolution? Find it out from Qur'an.

'Wa laqad khalaqnal insaana min salsaalim min hama im masnoon'
And We did certainly create man out of clay from an altered black mud.
Surah Al Hijr - Translation and Transliteration (Al Quran al karim 15.26)

That is it.

 

[metis]

I am a Muslim and I like to hear your thought about evolution. Here are some questions

When Darwin made his theory about evolution, what exactly did he claim and which claim is made by others based on his.

Is it logical to accept the idea of natural selection and deny the idea that a kind changed to another kind?

A long time I have neglected investigating this topic since it’s not really my thing.
Recommending of a documentary or a lecture about this topic is welcome. I don’t like to read books about this topics since the difficulty words being used.

Welcome!

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Humans are animals

lol sure. Rephrase. We are a different kind of animals like for example with a dog

 

[metis]

If one was truly looking for evidence to confirm or refute scientific theories, why would they primarily use a religious source?