Freedom of religion in Ukraine?

[Estro Felino]

When the pope speaks publicly he is not only giving an opinion he is speaking for the Catholic church.
He does not and cannot speak for the orthodox church that is the right and duty of Bartholomew.

The Orthodox Church does not have a pope.

The Patriarch of Constantinople is not a pope.
He is a spiritual guide, and each nation has its own Patriarch.

Primus inter pares may sound like an oxymoron, but it just means he is the first in tradition and history.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

The Orthodox Church does not have a pope.

The Patriarch of Constantinople is not a pope.
He is a spiritual guide, and each nation has its own Patriarch.

Primus inter pares may sound like an oxymoron, but it just means he is the first in tradition and history.

He is the first among equals. And takes presidence in the orthodox church.
Just as the arch bishop of Canterbury is in the Anglican church.

 

[Estro Felino]

He is the first among equals. And takes presidence in the orthodox church.
Just as the arch bishop of Canterbury is in the Anglican church.

No...it's not like the Church of England who has the monarch as the head of the Church.

The Orthodox Church doesn't have a political head.
It's not like the Catholic Church.

The Patriarch of Constantinople is a merely representative leader.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

No...it's not like the Church of England who has the monarch as the head of the Church.

The Orthodox Church doesn't have a political head.
It's not like the Catholic Church.

The Patriarch of Constantinople is a merely representative leader.

The church of England is just one constituent part of the Anglican faith it is organised exactly like the orthodox churches.
The king is supreme governor of the Church of England and appoints bishops on the advice of the prime minister. Not all of whom are members of the church of England or even Christian.

Leadership and governance | The Church of England

How the leadership and governance of the Church of England is structured.

www.churchofengland.org

The various Anglican churches can be devided into two groups, those that are part of the Anglican communion led by the Archbishop of Canterbury and includes the episcopal church of america, and a second group of individual Anglican churches that are not in communion with Canterbury. And are churches that have mostly broken away in the past for some doctrinal reason.

Some broke away and established entirely new churches , like the methodists.
This is not unlike the many Catholic churches that broke away from Rome but still call themselves catholic.

 

[Kathryn]

When the pope speaks publicly he is not only giving an opinion he is speaking for the Catholic church.
He does not and cannot speak for the orthodox church that is the right and duty of Bartholomew.

Nope, he is only speaking for the Catholic Church when he is speaking ex cathedra.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Yes, he supports fteedom of worship.

Seems that he supports freedom of Russian interference in Ukraine.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Nope, he is only speaking for the Catholic Church when he is speaking ex cathedra.

When he gets up and speaks to the world attacking Ukraine. he could hardly do it more authoritatively. That was not a private comment, it was a very public attack.
.

 

[Dimi95]

Not for many Russian Orthodox under a new law.

Kirill is not the point. Thank you Pope Francis for standing up against the Ukrainian government on this issue. Another reason to stop flushing money away in Ukraine, IMHO.

Pope Francis Sides with Moscow in Ukraine’s Clash of the Patriarchs

COMMENTARY: Pope Francis’ recent intervention in the Russia-Ukraine conflict has created a new and surprising dynamic.

www.ncregister.com

It is very painfull to see how they are "buying" the Russian and Ukranian people with cheap tricks and agendas.

That same Vatican gave Ukraine a lot of money 1 year ago..

Their filthy mouths should stay out of Orthodox matter.

I would rather side myself with an Honest Atheist then with someone from Vatican!

 

[Kathryn]

When he gets up and speaks to the world attacking Ukraine. he could hardly do it more authoritatively. That was not a private comment, it was a very public attack.
.

The only people it should matter to are fellow Catholics, who know the difference between an opinion and a pope speaking ex cathedra.

 

[Kathryn]

When he gets up and speaks to the world attacking Ukraine. he could hardly do it more authoritatively. That was not a private comment, it was a very public attack.
.

LOL and he can do it much more authoritatively.

 

[Dimi95]

The only people it should matter to are fellow Catholics, who know the difference between an opinion and a pope speaking ex cathedra.

We are all Catholics , you are just Roman..

And we too learn Latin in school

 

[Kathryn]

We are all Catholics , you are just Roman..

And we too learn Latin in school

Then you should know the difference between a personal opinion of the Pope and when he speaks ex cathedra.

 

[Dimi95]

Then you should know the difference between a personal opinion of the Pope and when he speaks ex cathedra.

Yes, but the dillema here is what does The Pope have to do with Orthodox matter in the first place?
Since he speaks about worship , that is matter of faith and it is ex cathedra.

 

[Kathryn]

Yes, but the dillema here is what does The Pope have to do with Orthodox matter in the first place?
Since he speaks about worship , that is matter of faith and it is ex cathedra.

It is not ex cathedra. Are you Roman Catholic?

 

[Regiomontanus]

Since I had not seen this news on the new Ukrainian law in any other outlet, I thought I would share it (in the religious news area). I have no desire to debate it or defend the Pope from his detractors.

Cheers

 

[anna.]

Yes, but the dillema here is what does The Pope have to do with Orthodox matter in the first place?
Since he speaks about worship , that is matter of faith and it is ex cathedra.

The pope hasn't spoken ex cathedra since 1950.

 

[Dimi95]

It is not ex cathedra. Are you Roman Catholic?

Matter of faith or morals is always ex cathedra.

It doesn't have to be 'official statement' to say that he is speaking ex cathedra.

"Thinking about the laws recently adopted in Ukraine, I fear for the freedom of those who pray, because those who truly pray always pray for all. A person does not commit evil because of praying.If someone commits evil against his people, he will be guilty for it, but he cannot have committed evil because he prayed. So let those who want to pray be allowed to pray in what they consider their church. Please, let no Christian church be abolished directly or indirectly. Churches are not to be touched!"

But it may be that we have different understanding of things.

For example , in Orthodox when one speaks about faith , he speaks in the name of the Cross.

"For we live by faith, not by sight."

I understand what you mean with opinion , but it is irrelevant since in his answer he speaks about matter of worship.

If by ex cathedra you mean only doctrine , then fine i accept it.
But there is another issue within that , and this is not the place to debate it.

 

[Dimi95]

The pope hasn't spoken ex cathedra since 1950.

I understand , but that was not the point i wanted to make.

 

[Kathryn]

Matter of faith(includes worship) or morals is always ex cathedra.

It doesn't have to be 'official statement' to say that he is speaking ex cathedra.

"Thinking about the laws recently adopted in Ukraine, I fear for the freedom of those who pray, because those who truly pray always pray for all. A person does not commit evil because of praying.If someone commits evil against his people, he will be guilty for it, but he cannot have committed evil because he prayed. So let those who want to pray be allowed to pray in what they consider their church. Please, let no Christian church be abolished directly or indirectly. Churches are not to be touched!"

But it may be that we have different understanding of things.

For example , in Orthodox when one speaks about faith , he speaks in the name of the Cross.

"For we live by faith, not by sight."

I understand what you mean with opinion , but it is irrelevant since in his answer he speaks about matter of worship.

Here are the conditions that must be met before a statement can be considered Ex Cathedra:

1. the bishops though dispersed remain in union with the pope and one another;
2. they teach authentically on a matter of faith or morals, i.e., they teach as bishops;
3. they agree on a judgment;
4. they teach that judgment as to be definitively held (“definitive tenendam”). Popes Have Taught Infallibly on Matters of Faith — But What About Matters of Morals?

You're not Roman Catholic for the record.

 

[Dimi95]

Here are the conditions that must be met before a statement can be considered Ex Cathedra:

1. the bishops though dispersed remain in union with the pope and one another;
2. they teach authentically on a matter of faith or morals, i.e., they teach as bishops;
3. they agree on a judgment;
4. they teach that judgment as to be definitively held (“definitive tenendam”). Popes Have Taught Infallibly on Matters of Faith — But What About Matters of Morals?

You're not Roman Catholic for the record.

You don't understand what my point is.

But fine , he is not officially speaking ex cathedra.