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Gaddafi captured alive .... then killed

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
I am sure that there was nothing "Authorised" or "Official" in his killing. I think he was simply unlucky to be found by a group of the civilian army, who perhaps had more reason than most to want him dead. Some one took it into their head to shoot him themselves.
Nothing "Planned" "Legal" or " judicial" about it.
It is hard to tell at this stage what the effect of it will be... except, that I expect his remaining family will not dare to stay in the country, with the prospect of a fate like hanging over them.
 

not nom

Well-Known Member
From what I understand, Libya has little experience with democracy and few civic institutions, and it's largely a tribal society.
Historically, when an occupying or autocratic power falls you get a power vacuum followed by civil strife, war or, at least, a reshuffling of society.

I hope these newly restructured N. African states get it together and manage to form free and benign societies, but I wouldn't put any money on it.

well yes, it's not fair to hold them up to such high standards just yet. I think I'm mostly frustrated with "us". I know it isn't entirely comparable, but I had to think of the sudden expiration of bin laden. not that he was killed without trial so much, I simply can't know wether that was avoidable or not.. would I order people to take him down alive, even if that puts those people at risk? I have no idea, and I won't be the armchair judge. but I can judge from my armchair all the other people sitting in their armchairs cheering about the bloodied corpse of a "bad guy". in the case of bin laden, that "we" didn't at least say "meh, a trial would have been preferable", instead of cheering blindly, like killing someone was a great feat. so while these cases aren't comparable, what my peeve with them is exactly the same. I'm not annoyed with lybia, I am annoyed with "the west" and the mindless cheering, once again.

maybe it was a bit too much to bring up eichmann (that's just the most depressing trial I know of, so pointless in a way -- and still, I think it's good it took place), but my point was, the WORSE someone is, the more necessary a trial is, even though the result may be obvious from the start. so what if it gives people a platform to spout their views one last time. people weren't that squeamish about the nazis, that is, they accepted that cost for the greater good of a thorough process. what happened? was that the zenith of our humanity and courage, have we passed it since then? I'd hate to think that's true. and another thing just occured to me, that hitler commited suicide to avoid having to face a trial...! in my mind, just killing "similar people" is doing them a favour, and is no grand success for justice. that's all. there's no use to cry over spilt milk, and it's silly to be patronizing towards lybia and hold them up to "our" standards, but the celebrations have to proceed without me anyway.
 
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Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
A ridiculous end to a ridiculous man.

gaddafi-female-bodyguards.jpg


My favorite picture of this idiot.
 

Tamar

I am Jewish.
Ridiculous?
I don't think that's a good description of anyone being shot dead.

I know nothing about the man - but if he was so universally despised how come it took NATO to get rid of him?


It took NATO to HELP Libyans fighting to get rid of him. He was universally despised and his people lived under a dictatorship that was oppressive.

We can only hope that now NATO will leave and that Libya can rebuild now that his regime is gone.
 

Bismillah

Submit
My question is - if he was universally despised - why was NATO needed?
Because unlike places such as Tunis where the military was largely independent of the regime and sided with the people or Egypt where the military was willing to throw a figurehead under the bus, Ghaddafi was and still is, to some extent, supported by his military ranks and tribal allies.

Might makes right.
 

sadiq

Spain, Morocco, Jerusalem
Europe can only man up against the moderate Tyrants, I like their support(no support) for those protesting in Iran.
 

Alceste

Vagabond
I'm repulsed by displays of jubilation after a violent death, no matter who the victim happens to be. It displays the very worst of human nature while underlining the depressing point that few of us are all that different from Ghaddafi at heart. I had hoped for a criminal trial.
 

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
I'm repulsed by displays of jubilation after a violent death, no matter who the victim happens to be. It displays the very worst of human nature while underlining the depressing point that few of us are all that different from Ghaddafi at heart. I had hoped for a criminal trial.
Me too. I'm concerned that a year, or five, from now that we don't wish that Ghaddafi was still in power.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Let's hope they move to democracy and proper institutions of a civic society.
Democracy won't work for everyone. Actually there have been many dire consequences globally of Western Culture pushing it's views on the rest of the world. And about the most civic societies you will find are tribal hunter-gatherer societies. There lives may seem like misery, but actually they have more free time than us, less war, hardly any personal items, and they tend to be much more egalitarian than we are. So really those "primitive savages" that people think of seem to be much more civil than us "modern" post-industrialized people.

But with so many governments being over thrown as of late, it will be interesting to see what results.
 

Caladan

Agnostic Pantheist
Democracy won't work for everyone. Actually there have been many dire consequences globally of Western Culture pushing it's views on the rest of the world. And about the most civic societies you will find are tribal hunter-gatherer societies. There lives may seem like misery, but actually they have more free time than us, less war, hardly any personal items, and they tend to be much more egalitarian than we are. So really those "primitive savages" that people think of seem to be much more civil than us "modern" post-industrialized people.

But with so many governments being over thrown as of late, it will be interesting to see what results.
I am not sure how this apply to middle eastern countries. also I'm not sure how the people of the middle east would appreciate being lumped up with hunter-gatherers.
the description of egalitarian hunter gatherer society with spare time is not applicable for middle eastern nations. in fact I don't think there is much to compare.
 
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