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Gay

Marisa

Marisa

Well-Known Member
gsa said:
I am sure that people who believe in Thor can point to his actions. We know that Muslims heap praise on Allah for miracles. Here is an article describing personal visions of Norse gods. Billy Graham says that Yahweh can appear to people in visions and dreams today. I see no reason to accept the claims of Christians on this point while denying the claims of Heathens. Little more than a double standard and special pleading.
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Was it Hume who said something about accepting miracles as proof for one faith and dismissing them as impossible for another?
 
viole

viole

Ontological Naturalist
Premium Member
izzy4games12 said:
If he is life then he can take away life. Everything has happened and always will happen for a reason, and the death of a baby is perhaps to teach a kind of lesson or perhaps to save that child from something that they might've had to endure had their life were not taken. We don't know since we're just people. We aren't life, we just live it.
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Some, if not many, miscarriages go unnoticed. So, why does He do that? To teach a lesson ... to whom?

Or maybe is to save that child from something bad had his life not be taken? But that seems absurd. Why make that life to start with, then? Could He not see it coming before fertilizing that egg, being omniscient and all?

And, if it is true, as it seems, that only half of all fertilized eggs develop in a baby, that would turn God into the unchallenged universal champion of abortions. And Heaven would be vastly populated by tiny little spiritual blastocysts who never experienced evil (and cannot therefore enjoy the goodness of Heaven, if evil is necessary to enjoy good).

Ciao

- viole
 
viole

viole

Ontological Naturalist
Premium Member
Marisa said:
Was it Hume who said something about accepting miracles as proof for one faith and dismissing them as impossible for another?
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Yes, any dismissal of miracles (experiences, happiness) reported by believers in a different God, falsifies the same claims when attributed to one's God.

Ciao

- viole
 
viole

viole

Ontological Naturalist
Premium Member
izzy4games12 said:
I'm not hurt or anything, I just feel like I'm playing ping pong with a wall while on here. The problem is you're asking a mere human. You're asking Izzy to answer your questions about God when the reality is God can't be fully understood, just loved and accepted. If God could be comprehended, then theology wouldn't be in existence and most likely the world wouldn't be so distraught over truth and false. In a similar light, if people didn't care so much about disproving Gods existence, there'd be a lot less headache worldwide. The answers to your questions will only put your mind at ease or turmoil but if you want a heartfelt answer, I couldn't give you one, but God can.
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"If God could be comprehended then theology would not exist." That entails that theology is a waste of time, for how could anybody try to comprehend something that cannot be comprehended?

Incidentally, that would also leave open the possibility that God is evil. How do we know, if we cannot comprehend Him? See how nicely that would solve the problem of evil.

On second thought, that would open the problem of good :(

Ciao

- viole
 
I

izzy4games12

Member
viole said:
"If God could be comprehended then theology would not exist." That entails that theology is a waste of time, for how could anybody try to comprehend something that cannot be comprehended?

Incidentally, that would also leave open the possibility that God is evil. How do we know, if we cannot comprehend Him? See how nicely that would solve the problem of evil.

On second thought, that would open the problem of good :(

Ciao

- viole
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Right
 
I

izzy4games12

Member
viole said:
Some, if not many, miscarriages go unnoticed. So, why does He do that? To teach a lesson ... to whom?

Or maybe is to save that child from something bad had his life not be taken? But that seems absurd. Why make that life to start with, then? Could He not see it coming before fertilizing that egg, being omniscient and all?

And, if it is true, as it seems, that only half of all fertilized eggs develop in a baby, that would turn God into the unchallenged universal champion of abortions. And Heaven would be vastly populated by tiny little spiritual blastocysts who never experienced evil (and cannot therefore enjoy the goodness of Heaven, if evil is necessary to enjoy good).

Ciao

- viole
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Lol
 
Shadow Wolf

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
izzy4games12 said:
Lol
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I'm going to guess that you yourself have a very weak faith if you can only laugh and respond with "right" and not want to continue with a debate you stepped into. Can you not defend your faith, or are you afraid these "hard questions" are going to challenge your faith and make you see and realize things that make you uncomfortable?
 
I

izzy4games12

Member
Shadow Wolf said:
I'm going to guess that you yourself have a very weak faith if you can only laugh and respond with "right" and not want to continue with a debate you stepped into. Can you not defend your faith, or are you afraid these "hard questions" are going to challenge your faith and make you see and realize things that make you uncomfortable?
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Lol
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
The problem is that Americans think of themselves as "us" and "them" instead of as "WE the people." The issues are usually eclipsed by "You people..."

Perhaps if we all decided to live together for the common good, rather than poking our noses into other peoples' bedrooms and trying to control everyone else, 'Murrica's collective sphincter wouldn't be so tight, and this would be a happy and productive place to live, and we'd have more respect in the world community.
 
FunctionalAtheist

FunctionalAtheist

Hammer of Reason
EyeofOdin said:
As a gay man, I don't argue with homophobes (who are usually conservative or of abrahamic worldview, let's be real) for various reasons.

Firstly, I can't control what others think. Frankly what others think is none of my business and out of my control. Trying to change people, even if they're being blatantly ignorant, is only going to end up with me losing energy and time.

Secondly, in a zealot's debate, to be blunt, that's not MY god. Those aren't MY rules. Jews can refuse pork as long as they don't look to force everyone else to give up bacon. You can follow your own rules in The US, but the only ones we all must follow are the American laws which are meant to have no ill will nor preference to anything associated with God, spirit or religion.

If in your culture, you believe a man is dishonorable for marrying a man, whatever. I'm not of that worldview though. Your sky god, honestly, doesn't mean anything to me, like how my gods mean little to you. Just like how I can't control others' ignorance, they can't control my love.

I don't waste my time with people converting me because neither of us has control over the other.
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Sorry I haven't read a single post in this thread except you OP. I am straight, I do not understand homosexuality. I will even admit that I'm a bit of a homophobe. But for at least 10 years I have advocated full rights for LBGT because we are all human, and there is no reason that "I" need to understand others before their rights are acknowledged. It is a bit weird I admit...I have gay friends that think I am a gay-rights activist, but in fact I couldn't care less about gay rights. I'm very, VERY, outspoken about hatred!!!
 
J

JoStories

Well-Known Member
sojourner said:
The problem is that Americans think of themselves as "us" and "them" instead of as "WE the people." The issues are usually eclipsed by "You people..."

Perhaps if we all decided to live together for the common good, rather than poking our noses into other peoples' bedrooms and trying to control everyone else, 'Murrica's collective sphincter wouldn't be so tight, and this would be a happy and productive place to live, and we'd have more respect in the world community.
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I would love to be able to agree with you Sojourner but unfortunately, I cannot. I don't see this country ever getting back any of the respect we might have once had. Presidents like the twin shrubs (Bush) and others have destroyed any hope of that. Add to that the people like Phelps and so on, and we have lost any respect ever. It has never really been 'we the people'. It has been Us V Them for at least a century, more likely more than that. For example, we presently have a governor who so abuses his power in office that he has been sued and there is talk of impeachment. Add to this the unlikely possibility that Trump is leading the pundit pack and we are seriously out of all and any respect we might have once had.
 
firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
Revoltingest said:
I expect eventual improvement on all of these fronts.
Perhaps in a century, fornicators, gays & heathens will only get the lash.
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This is personally my view. Not theological.

1. No one has a right to say no to anyones love or marriage. No one has a right to choose who you cannot marry or love. Be it a man or a woman. You can choose who you want, man or woman, you being man or woman.
2. What is the definition of fornicators? Is it married infidelity or unmarried sexual relationships? Unless legally bound, no one has a right to punish a person for having any kind of relationship.
3. There is no compulsion in religion.

Your post really struck me. Everytime I read it I see a dirty hypocritical world, and I cant see an end to the hypocrisy

Cheers.
 
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