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Germany religion and politics

Me Myself

Me Myself

Back to my username
In a class, my teacher told us that Germany has a percentage of the tax money be given to (I think catholic) church and they use this for social services.

Is this true? what do you know about this and what can you tell me? Anyone that knows anything about this please tell, but incredible thanks and special cookies to any German here that can give me special light on this :D
 
mycorrhiza

mycorrhiza

Well-Known Member
Don't know about Germany, but Sweden used to have a Church tax of about 1% of the income. Now it's a fee instead of a tax, but it's still collected by the government. It only applies to members of the Church of Sweden, though, but most or at least many members are probably non-Christians who either don't know that they're members (you were automatically added if your parents were members) or don't care that they're members.
 
ron4711

ron4711

Member
Magog said:
I'm English. By what mechanism does tax support religion please?
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Honestly I do not know the details, nor do I care, as the details are different for each country. But at the very least, the Queen of England is the head of the church. Royalty used to get an allowance from the government, don't know if they still do. But they do get to use some pretty choice government resources.
 
Secret Chief

Secret Chief

Degrow!
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Terrywoodenpic

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
In many countries Churches would levy a tax (Tithes) on their parishioners. This was especially true of Protestant churches in Europe. Much like the Mormon Church still does.

Some Lutheran churches still do this in Scandinavia. in Finland this is collected by the Government along with local taxes and then handed to the churches. These churches, though declining in numbers, still provide services to the local community.

After the WW2 Germany were still collecting church tax for the Lutherans though I doubt they still do. In Germany many states are either predominately Lutheran or Catholic.
The UK has not done this for generations.
 
Flankerl

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
Me Myself said:
In a class, my teacher told us that Germany has a percentage of the tax money be given to (I think catholic) church and they use this for social services.

Is this true?
Click to expand...

Yup thats true.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_tax#Germany

The following churches and organisations use the option to get the tax through the state.

The member churches of the Evangelical Church in Germany.
The dioceses of the Roman Catholic Church.
The catholic diocese of the Old-Catholic Church of Germany.
The free-religious congregations of germany(Baden, Mainz, Offenbach and Pfalz).
The Unitarian Religious Community of Free Protestants.
And the jewish congregations. Though its called Kultussteuer and not church tax. Kultussteuer could be translated with culture tax...


In Hamburg the following churches collect their taxes by themselve.
The Mennonite community of Hamburg and Altona.
The Evangelical Reformed Church in Hamburg.
And the Danish Seamen's Church in Hamburg.


All other churches and organisations who would be allowed to use the tax choose not to.


Like for example the Orthodox Church, Mormons, JWs or Salvation Army.
 
lunakilo

lunakilo

Well-Known Member
I don't know the specifics for Germany...

As far as I know the practice of letting the state collect church taxes is quite common in many countries.
This is how it is done for the state religion in my own country (Denmark).
That does not mean that everybody pays this tax, people who are not members of the church do not pay the tax.
So the tax is collected by the state, but not alle people living here pay it (I personally don't :) )

But the state church actually gets some of its money directly from the state so that even non-members (me included :( ) end up paying money to the church.
 
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ron4711

ron4711

Member
Flankerl said:
Yup thats true.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_tax#Germany

The following churches and organisations use the option to get the tax through the state.

The member churches of the Evangelical Church in Germany.
The dioceses of the Roman Catholic Church.
The catholic diocese of the Old-Catholic Church of Germany.
The free-religious congregations of germany(Baden, Mainz, Offenbach and Pfalz).
The Unitarian Religious Community of Free Protestants.
And the jewish congregations. Though its called Kultussteuer and not church tax. Kultussteuer could be translated with culture tax...


In Hamburg the following churches collect their taxes by themselve.
The Mennonite community of Hamburg and Altona.
The Evangelical Reformed Church in Hamburg.
And the Danish Seamen's Church in Hamburg.


All other churches and organisations who would be allowed to use the tax choose not to.


Like for example the Orthodox Church, Mormons, JWs or Salvation Army.
Click to expand...

So basically even though Germany does not have a state religion, if you belong to a certain religion you are taxed to support that religion.

It looks like if you are atheist, for example, you can be exempt from paying any religious tax.

If you are Catholic, must you pay this tax and does it have to be at the set percent?
 
Me Myself

Me Myself

Back to my username
lunakilo said:
I don't know the specifics for Germany...

As far as I know the practice of letting the state collect church taxes is quite common in many countries.
This is how it is done for the state religion in my own country (Denmark).
That does not mean that everybody pays this tax, people who are not members of the church do not pay the tax.
So the tax is collected by the state, but not alle people living here pay it (I personally don't :) )

But the state church actually gets some of its money directly from the state so that even non-members (me included :( ) end up paying money to the church.
Click to expand...

Something that stood out of the wiki article provided was that in Denmark, while you can choose not to specifically give that church tax, the government still finances the church of Denmark in part, so you would still be giving some money to the church of Denmark when paying your taxes.

Is wiki wrong on this? Is no one mad about it there? :eek:

Edit: Ups didnt read the last part till now :eek:
 
Quintessence

Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
I have a friend who lived in Germany for several years, so I might ask her. She is also Neopagan, and I recall it being her general observation that she just wouldn't talk about her religion because people were even more clueless about it over there than they are in the United States.
 
Flankerl

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
ron4711 said:
So basically even though Germany does not have a state religion, if you belong to a certain religion you are taxed to support that religion.

It looks like if you are atheist, for example, you can be exempt from paying any religious tax.

If you are Catholic, must you pay this tax and does it have to be at the set percent?
Click to expand...

If you want to marry in a catholic church, want your kids to be baptised or want a catholic funeral you better pay your taxes. Otherwise you probably wont get those.

And yeah its the set percent.
 
Cassiopia

Cassiopia

Sugar and Spice
Me Myself said:
In a class, my teacher told us that Germany has a percentage of the tax money be given to (I think catholic) church and they use this for social services.

Is this true? what do you know about this and what can you tell me? Anyone that knows anything about this please tell, but incredible thanks and special cookies to any German here that can give me special light on this :D
Click to expand...
Yes Germans and Austrians pay some tax to the Catholic Church unless they opt out. I'm not sure about Germany but I know that in Austria if you opt out you are automatically excommunicated from the Church.
The arrangement in Germany was started by Hitler in an agreement with The Vatican.

ron4711 said:
Germany does not have a state religion. But other countries in Europe do, such as England, Greece, Denmark and of course the Vatican. But there are more. Basically taxes go to support these religions, but other religions are allowed to exist.

State religion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Although Britain has a state religion there are no taxes paid to the Church.

ron4711 said:
So basically even though Germany does not have a state religion, if you belong to a certain religion you are taxed to support that religion.

It looks like if you are atheist, for example, you can be exempt from paying any religious tax.

If you are Catholic, must you pay this tax and does it have to be at the set percent?
Click to expand...
As I said, you can opt out if you don't mind being excommunicated.
 
Me Myself

Me Myself

Back to my username
Cassiopia said:
Yes Germans and Austrians pay some tax to the Catholic Church unless they opt out. I'm not sure about Germany but I know that in Austria if you opt out you are automatically excommunicated from the Church.
The arrangement in Germany was started by Hitler in an agreement with The Vatican.


Although Britain has a state religion there are no taxes paid to the Church.


As I said, you can opt out if you don't mind being excommunicated.
Click to expand...

Wow, excommunicated? May I have a source for that? I thought they would simply not make your funeral and such. You cant even get into the church then? which religions are the ones that automatically excommunicate you? The catholic among those?
 
Cassiopia

Cassiopia

Sugar and Spice
Flankerl said:
I beg you pardon?
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Yes. Sorry too busy right now to look up references but just before or during WW2 there was an agreement between Nazi Germany and the Vatican more or less to the effect that they would leave each other alone. Tax payments to the Church were a part of that arrangement.

Me Myself said:
Wow, excommunicated? May I have a source for that? I thought they would simply not make your funeral and such. You cant even get into the church then? which religions are the ones that automatically excommunicate you? The catholic among those?
Click to expand...
It happened to an ex of mine. First they sued him because he forgot to pay his taxes to the Church and said the only way out would be to "officially leave the Catholic Church," and so he left so they excommunicated him.
 
Flankerl

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
Cassiopia said:
Yes. Sorry too busy right now to look up references but just before or during WW2 there was an agreement between Nazi Germany and the Vatican more or less to the effect that they would leave each other alone. Tax payments to the Church were a part of that arrangement.
Click to expand...

Nope the church tax was instituted in 1919. Article 137 paragraph 6 of the Weimar Constitution.
"Religious communities with the status of public corporations are entitled to raise taxes based on fiscal records and in accordance with state regulations."
Before 1919 the various states of the german empire already had their own regulations for the church tax. But 1919 was the first unified church tax for all of germany.
 
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