God is everywhere; is God in Hell?

[Harel13]

Just out of curiosity....what is the Jewish version of hell....?

If I understood the Christian concept of purgatory, then it's more like that: a place to cleanse the soul from a life of sin. Once cleansed, the soul can move onward to a better place. It's painful, harsh, horrible - but better than nothing.

 

[Jedster]

Well, is he? For those who believe in an omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent God and believe in Hell, especially a literal one, is God there? I don't think it matters if Hell is literal or figurative. It's a place where condemned and punished souls are sent by God. Even if Hell is separation from God, where do the souls go? Is God not there also. Please explain the seeming paradox to me. How can an omnipotent and omnipresent God not be somewhere. To me, that negates God’s omni-everything. So, given that God is everywhere, as we were taught by Sister Mary Discipline of the Sisters of No Mercy, is God in Hell along with the tortured souls he sentenced there? Does he exist there?

From my (poor) memory of reading some Dharmic scriptures and listening to blissful satsangs, it has been advised not to seek heaven, rather to seek satsang(the company of Truth).
( e.g Isn't Hanuman reputed to always be in Satsang?)
Kabir asks people why they think they will be any closer to Truth when they die? Best to look while alive.
If God or gods do really exist, I am sure they are hanging out in satsang, where beliefs & identity are irrelevant.

 

[Good-Ole-Rebel]

I find there is a difference between torment and torture such as being on fire.
After everyone in the grave is ' delivered up' (resurrected out of the grave ) then those who rebel will die that symbolic ' second death '.- Revelation 20:13-14.
Second death stands for : destruction, so the everlasting fire of Matthew 25:41 is the everlasting punishment of Matthew 25:46.That punishment is: destruction - 2nd Thessalonians 1:9
In other words, as Psalms 92:7 says the wicked will be 'destroyed forever'.
The choice given is ' repent ' if we do Not wish to ' perish ' ( be destroyed ) - 2 Peter 3:9

As I said, unless there is an experience of torment, there is no torment.

Death in Scripture is never annihilation. The second death is just what it says,....the second death. Just like with the first death, there was no annihlation of the soul/spirit. No sleep. It went to the waiting place of hell until the resurrection. But at the second death the spirit/soul is separated from the body in the lake of fire where it will forever exist.

(Rev. 20:13-14) is addressing the second resurrection, which is the resurrection of the unbelieving. It is not a resurrection you want to be part of. Yes, all are resurrected at that time, but all are only the unbelieving as the resurrection of the believers has already taken place. That was the first resurrection. (Rev. 20:1-6)

The second resurrection you are talking about is known as the 'Great White Throne' judgement. It is a judgement of works. A judgement of the unbelieving who have rejected God and Christ. Because they reject God and Christ, they will be judged according to their works. And nothing will be left out. No stone unturned. The One who will be the Judge will be Jesus Christ. It is not a judgement to determine if one was good enough. It is a judgement to show that no one is good enough. If one is at this judgement, the die is cast. You don't want to be at this judgement.

Good-Ole-Rebel

 

[Bird123]

I see in some obituaries that some people talk about "eternal rest," as if their dead loved ones will sleep (rest?) forever. What do you think?

The desire to have it made runs strong in people. That is why the story of one life then Heaven forever is so appealing to so many. Sure it would be nice to have it made for a while, but how long would it be before one gets bored? Further, a Heavenly state would hardly be possible until one understands what it takes to create it for oneself.

Contrary to popular belief, Eternity has purpose!!

 

[Bird123]

It is possible to be saved. In order to do so, however, one must be rescued. The rescuer is called in this sense, a savior.

Religion in order to gain followers tries to convince people something is wrong with them. Religion then claims to supply the fix, bringing in a Savior.

The problem is that Religion either does not care or does not Understand what is really going on with God, God's children and this world.

On the road to perfection, bad choices will be made in order to Understand all sides. There is nothing wrong with people. No Savior needed.

Religion tells people there is something wrong with them from birth. It is evil to try to convince people there is something wrong with them. Example: There was this lady. She was loving, kind and generous to everyone she met. She would give you the shirt off her back so to speak. Religion had this lady convinced she was going to Hell. It took several hours of talking before she realized the truth. Religion does hurt some people.

I suggest people quit looking for someone to save them. Instead, meet the problems in life head on, solve them. It is the only way to move forward.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

Ok. Before I sign off, contrasting religions are not, cannot be from God.

Let's forget all the religions. Let's look at what God does with knowledge in all fields. God does not give knowledge. With this in mind, God does not give any knowledge to religions or the people of the world. Instead God places knowledge all around us. Knowledge must be Discovered. Wisdom is acquired through the struggles to attain knowledge.

God will never serve knowledge up like religion serves up those beliefs. God wants His children to Know rather than merely believe. God wants His children to Discover it all for themselves. That is where the Wisdom is acquired.

Isn't it evil to try to convince people to stop the journey to true knowledge at mere beliefs?? Isn't that what religion is doing?

Religion is mankind's attempt to understand God.
I have found no religion that really understands God at all. Religion reflects more of mankind than anything else. After all, mankind is the creator of religions.

Religion is merely a catalyst that brings so many of the world's problems to the surface so they can be dealt with. After all, when one thinks they have God's blessing, they can justify anything.

All the secrets of the universe stare us all in the face. How long did mankind watch birds fly before they figured out how? God places knowledge all around us waiting for us to Discover it.

In this time-based causal universe, God's actions can be seen. These actions can not be altered by mankind. True knowledge about God and everything else surrounds us all.

The first thing God pointed out to me is that mankind carries such a narrow view. Perhaps, that is all that keeps so many from Discovering the Real Truth. I work on mine every day.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[YoursTrue]

Let's forget all the religions. Let's look at what God does with knowledge in all fields. God does not give knowledge. With this in mind, God does not give any knowledge to religions or the people of the world. Instead God places knowledge all around us. Knowledge must be Discovered. Wisdom is acquired through the struggles to attain knowledge.

God will never serve knowledge up like religion serves up those beliefs. God wants His children to Know rather than merely believe. God wants His children to Discover it all for themselves. That is where the Wisdom is acquired.

Isn't it evil to try to convince people to stop the journey to true knowledge at mere beliefs?? Isn't that what religion is doing?

Religion is mankind's attempt to understand God.
I have found no religion that really understands God at all. Religion reflects more of mankind than anything else. After all, mankind is the creator of religions.

Religion is merely a catalyst that brings so many of the world's problems to the surface so they can be dealt with. After all, when one thinks they have God's blessing, they can justify anything.

All the secrets of the universe stare us all in the face. How long did mankind watch birds fly before they figured out how? God places knowledge all around us waiting for us to Discover it.

In this time-based causal universe, God's actions can be seen. These actions can not be altered by mankind. True knowledge about God and everything else surrounds us all.

The first thing God pointed out to me is that mankind carries such a narrow view. Perhaps, that is all that keeps so many from Discovering the Real Truth. I work on mine every day.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

May I ask you how would you know what God may or may not approve of what man discovers? Especially knowledge that man may utilize and how he utilizes it. For instance, one may have knowledge of deadly substances, but utilizing them might not be such a good idea. You bring up an interesting point, because according to the Bible, God stipulated at the very beginning what was knowledge of good and evil. It is such an interesting point that it is the basis of knowing God, meaning we cannot "know" God to the best of our limited ability, unless we understand what His judgments are and if He has the right to determine right from wrong. And what happened to the human race as coming from Adam and Eve.

 

[YoursTrue]

Religion in order to gain followers tries to convince people something is wrong with them. Religion then claims to supply the fix, bringing in a Savior.

The problem is that Religion either does not care or does not Understand what is really going on with God, God's children and this world.

On the road to perfection, bad choices will be made in order to Understand all sides. There is nothing wrong with people. No Savior needed.

Religion tells people there is something wrong with them from birth. It is evil to try to convince people there is something wrong with them. Example: There was this lady. She was loving, kind and generous to everyone she met. She would give you the shirt off her back so to speak. Religion had this lady convinced she was going to Hell. It took several hours of talking before she realized the truth. Religion does hurt some people.

I suggest people quit looking for someone to save them. Instead, meet the problems in life head on, solve them. It is the only way to move forward.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

People can recognize there is something wrong, with themselves and others. For instance, if a person doesn't feel well, he figures something is wrong with him. And he might go to a doctor to see what is wrong, as well as a cure. So if a person doesn't understand something, he may go to someone who knows more (in this example, a doctor) and may help him to understand.

 

[pearl]

When Aquinas asked the question, 'is God in hell' he answered in the affirmative followed with the question 'what is God doing in hell' to which he answered 'loving the damned'.

 

[RabbiO]

paarsurrey said: ↑
I have been talking with many Jews, they are comfortable with G-d's name of Allah.
Judaism people....

And you've ignored my post, #104, because - choose all that are applicable - a) You know that Jews find your terminology inappropriate and you want to annoy Jews because, for all your protestations to the contrary, you hold Judaism in low regard; b) Because you also inappropriately refer to Hindus as Hinduism people and Buddhists as Buddhism people, you don't want to only change the term you use for Jewish people; c) You want people to stop referring to people of your religion as Muslims because you want people to use the term Islam people.

Right? Please.

 

[paarsurrey]

And you've ignored my post, #104, because - choose all that are applicable - a) You know that Jews find your terminology inappropriate and you want to annoy Jews because, for all your protestations to the contrary, you hold Judaism in low regard; b) Because you also inappropriately refer to Hindus as Hinduism people and Buddhists as Buddhism people, you don't want to only change the term you use for Jewish people; c) You want people to stop referring to people of your religion as Muslims because you want people to use the term Islam people.

Right? Please.

#113
Right? Please.
Regards

 

[Bird123]

May I ask you how would you know what God may or may not approve of what man discovers? Especially knowledge that man may utilize and how he utilizes it. For instance, one may have knowledge of deadly substances, but utilizing them might not be such a good idea. You bring up an interesting point, because according to the Bible, God stipulated at the very beginning what was knowledge of good and evil. It is such an interesting point that it is the basis of knowing God, meaning we cannot "know" God to the best of our limited ability, unless we understand what His judgments are and if He has the right to determine right from wrong. And what happened to the human race as coming from Adam and Eve.

You do not understand. Adam and Eve is just a Story written by mankind.

God isn't about approval. God is Unconditional Love. This world isn't about God. It's about us.

In God's system each will Discover for themselves which are the best choices. There is no need to define good or evil. When one acquires true intelligence, intelligence will make the very best choices. God does not need to define right from wrong. Each will do that for themselves.

There is Real Genius behind God's system. The dynamics are amazing. You can never understand it until you overcome mankind's petty ideas of ruling and controlling. Mankind values so many petty things like Blaming, Judging,Hating,Punishing or Payback,Intimidating, Coercing and more. Can one really reach a Higher Level living these petty things??

The first thing God pointed out to me is that mankind carries such a narrow view. With that in mind, one must widen the view and Reach. Following and accepting will not get one there.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

People can recognize there is something wrong, with themselves and others. For instance, if a person doesn't feel well, he figures something is wrong with him. And he might go to a doctor to see what is wrong, as well as a cure. So if a person doesn't understand something, he may go to someone who knows more (in this example, a doctor) and may help him to understand.

Yes, on the other hand one must choose to do so. So often adversity points the direction to Discovery. It can create a need for action, just like you mention.

Every journey creates learning and advancement. Intelligence will make the best choices when one finally understands all sides.

WE are truly Living our Lessons!!

 

[URAVIP2ME]

We are Spiritual beings in our true natures. Our physical bodies exist only for the lessons we are learning. When all the lessons are learned, we certainly won't want to be trapped within a physical body. There are too many limits it creates.
Everybody seems to want to be saved. Don't count on it. We are living our lessons. No one is going to do it for us. One must learn what it takes. One must Discover that the only answer is Unconditional Love.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!

In Scripture, I find Adam could have remained in his physical body as long as he did Not break God's Law.
To me the lesson learned is: ' break God's Law ' (sin) and you die '.
Die out of existence unless having the future resurrection hope as mentioned at Acts of the Apostles 24:15.

According to Revelation 7:9 there will be a great crowd of people who will be ' saved/delivered/rescued ' through the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14.

There is ' conditional ' love because the wicked will be ' destroyed forever ' according to Psalm 92:7.- 2 Peter 3:9.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I see in some obituaries that some people talk about "eternal rest," as if their dead loved ones will sleep (rest?) forever. What do you think?

Would be ' forever ' rest if Not for the resurrection hope of Acts of the Apostles 24:15.
Resurrection Hope as in meaning the awakening on Resurrection Day which is Jesus' coming Millennium-Long Day of governing over Earth in righteousness for a thousand years.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

The desire to have it made runs strong in people. That is why the story of one life then Heaven forever is so appealing to so many. Sure it would be nice to have it made for a while, but how long would it be before one gets bored? Further, a Heavenly state would hardly be possible until one understands what it takes to create it for oneself.
Contrary to popular belief, Eternity has purpose!!

Good point that 'Eternity has purpose'.
I find God purposed for Earth to be filled with people. (Not over filled or over populated - Genesis 1:28)
Those called to Heaven have two (2) jobs (work) to do according to Revelation 5:9-10.
They are to be both kings and priests under Christ.
They are to serve mankind living on Earth as governing kings taking care of governmental responsibilities.
They are to serve mankind living on Earth by taking care of spiritual duties towards people living on Earth.
Towards the humble meek people who will inherit the Earth as Jesus promised - Matthew 5:5; Psalms 37:9-11.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

When Aquinas asked the question, 'is God in hell' he answered in the affirmative followed with the question 'what is God doing in hell' to which he answered 'loving the damned'.

When the un-faithful Jews began mixing with pagan or Greek mythology that put God in religious-myth hell.
Not in any 'biblical hell ' because the dead know nothing - Ecclesiastes 9:5.
So, while dead Jesus was in ' hell ' (biblical grave) Jesus knew nothing - Acts of the Apostles 2:27.
Know nothing but ' sleep ' - John 11:11-14; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18.
God so loved the world that God provided the Resurrection Hope through Jesus' faithful death.
The Resurrection Hope of awakening the dead out of death's sleep on Resurrection Day.
Resurrection Day meaning Jesus' coming Millennium-Long Day of governing over Earth for a thousand years.
This is why Acts of the Apostles 24:15 uses the ' future tense ' that 'there is going to be' a resurrection.....

 

[URAVIP2ME]

If I understood the Christian concept of purgatory, then it's more like that: a place to cleanse the soul from a life of sin. Once cleansed, the soul can move onward to a better place. It's painful, harsh, horrible - but better than nothing.

Since there is 'No Christian purgatory' then there is No purgatory at all.
Purgatory is a false-religious teaching just being taught as being Scripture.
The dead know nothing - Ecclesiastes 9:5
Nothing but ' sleep ' (R.I.P.)
' Sleep in death ' is what both Jesus and the old Hebrew Scriptures teach:
- John 11:11-14; Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18.
Even the word 'cemetery' means: sleeping place.

 

[RabbiO]

#113
Right? Please.
Regards

That has nothing to do with my posts regarding your problematic posts.

 

[Harel13]

Since there is 'No Christian purgatory' then there is No purgatory at all.
Purgatory is a false-religious teaching just being taught as being Scripture.
The dead know nothing - Ecclesiastes 9:5
Nothing but ' sleep ' (R.I.P.)
' Sleep in death ' is what both Jesus and the old Hebrew Scriptures teach:
- John 11:11-14; Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18.
Even the word 'cemetery' means: sleeping place.

I'm not going to argue with you on Christian in-fighting. Let's just say that Jews weren't the ones who invented the word "purgatory". We're okay with our word "Gehinnom". That says something about some denominations of Christianity.