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God vs Satan

Dirty Penguin

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
Trey of Diamonds said:
So you're saying there is no free will, everyone's actions are predetermined by God, or is it just Satan's that are predetermined?
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First I think gods, angels, deamons and satan are made up....... But assuming you believe a god exist and he is the creator of space and time then yes....everything is predetermined. God, who exist outside of space and time, created it knowing full well what would happen all along. He knew that before he created "Satan"...Satan would do exactly what he did as well as knowing what his creation would do when he created man. No need of punishment and damnation if God created it all this way......Again, this assuming you believe in a god....I don't
 
Heneni

Heneni

Miss Independent
Kcnorwood said:
The other side of that is God knew what Satan was going to do & let him anyhow.
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Not exactly. God created his beings and he gave them free will. He also trusted them, as they were suppose to trust him. A risky business trust.

Satan tried to get eve to distrust god, when he tempted her. He tried to make her think that god was in some way holding out on her.

Did god know that satan was going to start distrusting him? No. He knew that satan had the ability to trust or not. God is not a puppet master. God knows what the puppets are able to do, but he does not pull their strings. They pull their own. They make their own choices. And if god messed around with it, it would mean no free will anymore, and it would mean that god never has to trust anybody, and that means, that anybody that loves him, does so cause they feel they should. God is love...love trusts. Seems like an awefully stupid and risky thing for a god to do, but when he created everything he said it was GOOD. He liked it. He was pleased with it. He invested honour in it. He was proud of it. He trusted it.

The surest way to make a man untrustworthy is to show him your distrust. God knows that. No wonder we sin against god everyday! He loves and trusts us...and we treat him like the boogyman. The real boogyman is humankind, we have proven we cant be trusted. No suspicion is needed, the proof is in the pudding.

Can god be trusted. Yes. Do we get it. NO.
Can Satan be trusted. No. Do we get it. NO.
 
Kcnorwood

Kcnorwood

Well-Known Member
Heneni said:
Nope he does. He knows of everything that has happened. And he is the best at predicting what will happen. But he does not cause all things to happen.
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Ok this statement is confusing either your saying he guesses or he does know he can't be both.
 
Trey of Diamonds

Trey of Diamonds

Well-Known Member
Kcnorwood said:
Ok this statement is confusing either your saying he guesses or he does know he can't be both.
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I've heard of this before. Some believe that God is capible of seeing all potential outcomes of any action so he knows what could happen in any given instance. And, while he is available for guidence, he doesn't directly interfer in the actions the happen in the universe.

I don't subscribe to this belief, I just have heard of it.
 
R

raibeart

Member
Trey of Diamonds said:
No, that is the title of the tread. In the first post I ask you to compare God and Satan, not predict who would win in a fight.

Original question.
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Well in that case the difference between them, is the shere fact that Satan was the angel in G-D's court that tempeted G-Ds followers because he was jealous of mans freewill. So he tried to prove to G-D, with his permission, to tempt his followers. Now keeping in mind I'm using the Satan referred to in the Tenach, who is also known as 'the accuser'. G-D is on the other hand a very loving and caring G-D, to those whom will follow him on the coming of the Messiah. Mind you if we do not see that Messiah in our lifetime, our life will not be in vein if we live it the way he wants us too.

I believe that as long as you follow the Golden Rule, who also follow most of the Ten Commandments. Thus if you follow the Golden Rule and do worship only him, he will be very forgiving when it is your time to be judged.
 
Heneni

Heneni

Miss Independent
Kcnorwood said:
You said before God doesn't know the future, so now he knows everything?
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God knows only the future that he causes to happen. And for the rest of the future, he is the best crystal ball glazer there is. He simply needs to stare carefully into our hearts, and he's quite able to predict and be sure of what we will get up to, but what is in that heart, is our business.

Its still, pretty simple.:p
 
darkendless

darkendless

Guardian of Asgaard
Heneni said:
God knows only the future that he causes to happen. And for the rest of the future, he is the best crystal ball glazer there is. He simply needs to stare carefully into our hearts, and he's quite able to predict and be sure of what we will get up to, but what is in that heart, is our business.

Its still, pretty simple.:p
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You seem so convinced of this God fellow, it would be a shame if he was nothing but a prank pulled by the romans a few thousand years ago wouldn't it.
How do you know that God knows all this? You seem to know more than God himself should know.
 
Heneni

Heneni

Miss Independent
darkendless said:
You seem so convinced of this God fellow, it would be a shame if he was nothing but a prank pulled by the romans a few thousand years ago wouldn't it.
How do you know that God knows all this? You seem to know more than God himself should know.
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Thanks for the compliment...I think:p

Well, since you asked why I am so convinced of this God fellow i'll tell you. I saw him in Eastbourne East Sussex England. TWICE. Thanks for the opportunity to share that with you.:D
 
Kcnorwood

Kcnorwood

Well-Known Member
Heneni said:
God knows only the future that he causes to happen. And for the rest of the future, he is the best crystal ball glazer there is. He simply needs to stare carefully into our hearts, and he's quite able to predict and be sure of what we will get up to, but what is in that heart, is our business.

Its still, pretty simple.:p
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The way you keep going back & forth makes me wonder if your making this up as you go along.
 
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