God's Existence

[omega2xx]

Time to go back to the basics. For the first time, I would wager.

I have never left the basics. IMO if you accept evolution as science, you have left them.

 

[ChristineM]

Exhaustion is not proof of anything . That is a lame excuse for not wanting to admit you have no evidence to prove God doe snot exist.



It is impossible to prove God does exist or that He does not. You are only blowing smoke, with your "proof by exhaustion," not presenting evidence.

E=MC2, as i have presented to you previously, is enough. Not my problem if you refutes to accept evidence.

If you think a formula can prove God does not exist, the smoke is getting thicker.

Then why is it called proof by exhaustion? Why is it accepted mathematically, statistically and scientifically as valid proof?

Do the maths on that formula, its easy, only multiplication involved.

 

[ChristineM]

I have never left the basics. IMO if you accept evolution as science, you have left them.

Evolution is a subset of biology which is a science

If you refuse to accept evolution as a science then you are right in saying you have never left basics.

 

[LuisDantas]

I have never left the basics. IMO if you accept evolution as science, you have left them.

Thanks for the warning.

 

[omega2xx]

Then why is it called proof by exhaustion?

Because man in trying to make his point has misnamed it. You can't possibly have exhausted all of what God claims to be. We don't have all of the scientific knowledge that God has put into His universe. We don't even have all of knowledge about many things in our universe.

Why is it accepted mathematically, statistically and scientifically as valid proof?

It is not universally accepted and I just gave you one reason why it is not.

Do the maths on that formula, its easy, only multiplication involved.

I have been in forums like this for about 40 years, To say a man-made formula, can prove the non-existence of God is at the top of the absurd list. I doubt if all of the information about the formula you want to use, is know for sure yet.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

I feel that an entity exists which created the universe. I doubt it's a person in the sense that most gods people worship are distinct "people" in a sense, with preferences, desires, anthropomorphic characteristics; I don't claim to know anything about it, but it seems unlikely that it's a thing humans can relate to. The only reason I have for believing that is because it's difficult for me to accept that the universe has always existed, or somehow came from nothing.

As it is though, this belief doesn't particularly affect my life. Because the belief in such a god doesn't affect how I live, I feel justified calling myself an atheist, in the same sense that agnostic atheists consider themselves atheists despite not believing that a god doesn't exist.

We are the only means we know of by which the universe can contemplate it's own existence, explore, understand, appreciate itself from within- out of curiosity, does a 'deistic atheist' see this as an unintended coincidence?- something the creator would have no interest in? why not?

 

[ChristineM]

Because man in trying to make his point has misnamed it. You can't possibly have exhausted all of what God claims to be. We don't have all of the scientific knowledge that God has put into His universe. We don't even have all of knowledge about many things in our universe.



It is not universally accepted and I just gave you one reason why it is not.



I have been in forums like this for about 40 years, To say a man-made formula, can prove the non-existence of God is at the top of the absurd list. I doubt if all of the information about the formula you want to use, is know for sure yet.

No misnaming involved and who needs to disprove everything you claim for god when every falsifiable claim to date is falsified

In those fields i mentioned it is universally accepted and they are the only ones that count when we are discussing scientific, mathematical and statistical proofs.

Interesting that the www has only been around for less than 30 years and yes Einstein refined the mass energy equivalence formula which has never been falsified.

 

[omega2xx]

No misnaming involved and who needs to disprove everything you claim for god when every falsifiable claim to date is falsified.

Unless you have all of then information about the universe and science, and you don't, all possibilities have not been exhausted, Therefore it is misnamed. Therefore you have not falisified the existence of God. In fact that theology can only be falsified in the minds of spiritually ignorant men.

In those fields i mentioned it is universally accepted and they are the only ones that count when we are discussing scientific, mathematical and statistical proofs.

It is not universally accepted and their is no way science, math or statistics can prove or disprove the existence of God.

Interesting that the www has only been around for less than 30 years

I may be off a few years but I have b een at it a long time.

and yes Einstein refined the mass energy equivalence formula which has never been falsified.

The next question, has it ever been verified?

 

[viole]

do you feel god exists? why do u feel that god exists?
or
do u feel that god does not exist? why do u feel that god does not exist?

I know that god(s) do not exist. That is one of the perks of being a gnostic atheist.

It is more than a feeling.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Kilgore Trout]

do you feel god exists? why do u feel that god exists?
or
do u feel that god does not exist? why do u feel that god does not exist?

I don't feel one way or the other. I have no idea what might be out there or what the ultimate structure of reality is.

Neither does anyone else.

I don't begrudge them their feelings though. It would just be nice if everyone was honest enough to identify them as such.

 

[viole]

Imagine if all children come with leukemia, if few have it then why not a lot of them
or all of them, nature doesn't have a control over the creation.

I think such few cases of abnormalities should be regard as a sign for God and not the contrary.

My personal suggestion is to go to a hospital and try to convince the parents of the kids dying there, that their slow dying kids are evidence that God exists. I am sure that the knowledge that without God all kids would be sick, would console them a lot. They will surely feel privileged that their kids, or abnormalities as you called them, have been chosen for a risk free ticket to Heaven.

Will you do it? Or do you spread this nonsense only on debate fora?

Of course, only with God a few chosen kids will slowly and painfully die. That is obvious. Or should be obvious to anyone acquainted with the capricious nature of the God of the Bible.

Ciao

- viole

 

[FearGod]

My personal suggestion is to go to a hospital and try to convince the parents of the kids dying there, that their slow dying kids are evidence that God exists. I am sure that the knowledge that without God all kids would be sick, would console them a lot. They will surely feel privileged that their kids, or abnormalities as you called them, have been chosen for a risk free ticket to Heaven.

Will you do it? Or do you spread this nonsense only on debate fora?

Of course, only with God a few chosen kids will slowly and painfully die. That is obvious. Or should be obvious to anyone acquainted with the God of the Bible.

Ciao

- viole

No one said that losing a child isn't painful for the parents even though that humans
are killing children in wars and by selling carcinogenic products.
16 Cancer Causing Foods You Probably Eat Every Day

That being said, if you think the child was the product of nature, then why to worry,
how life is meaningful if it came by unknown accidents and chances, why to worry
for what nature brought to us, how the child of human is different than the born
animal, monkey, sheep and even the mouse, all are product of nature, then what
to worry about, the nature has no senses, no feelings, please reality is easy to
be understood if we just open our minds than destroying our own selves.

 

[YmirGF]

Exhaustion is not proof of anything . That is a lame excuse for not wanting to admit you have no evidence to prove God doe snot exist.

As someone who is around a lot of wild doe's here on my island paradise, what does doe snot have to do with anything? Like, ya know, seriously....

 

[viole]

No one said that losing a child isn't painful for the parents even though that humans
are killing children in wars and by selling carcinogenic products.
16 Cancer Causing Foods You Probably Eat Every Day

That being said, if you think the child was the product of nature, then why to worry,
how life is meaningful if it came by unknown accidents and chances, why to worry
for what nature brought to us, how the child of human is different than the born
animal, monkey, sheep and even the mouse, all are product of nature, then what
to worry about, the nature has no senses, no feelings, please reality is easy to
be understood if we just open our minds than destroying our own selves.

I don't know you. But if my child dies of cancer, I cannot be possibly be pissed at nature. I would never say that only a few children die of cancer because of nature, and therefore naturalism is true. That would be utter nonsense.

But you believe in a higher controlling power. And you seem to indicate that the limited number of children dying of cancer are evidence that God exists.

So, who would you be pissed at, if your kid died slowly and painfully of cancer? Would you still talk to the wind (aka pray) that God reverses His decision?

Ciao

- viole

 

[FearGod]

I don't know you. But if my child dies of cancer, I cannot be possibly be pissed at nature. I would never say that only a few children die of cancer because of nature, and therefore naturalism is true. That would be utter nonsense.

But you believe in a higher controlling power. And you seem to indicate that the limited number of children dying of cancer are evidence that God exists.

So, who would you be pissed at, if your kid died slowly and painfully of cancer? Would you still talk to the wind (aka pray) that God reverses His decision?

Ciao

- viole

And who wouldn't die, it isn't only about our children but also our parents,
will you **** at nature because they died due to age which is painful as well.
or do you want all humans to live for eternal and no new comers, it may be
good for you and me and the others but God has a purpose as for all to come.

 

[viole]

And who wouldn't die, it isn't only about our children but also our parents,
will you **** at nature because they died due to age which is painful as well.
or do you want all humans to live for eternal and no new comers, it may be
good for you and me and the others but God has a purpose as for all to come.

Let me ask you this. If you had a kid, would that be irrelevant for you if she dies when she is two or eighty years old?

Please, answer honestly.

Ciao

- viole

 

[ChristineM]

Unless you have all of then information about the universe and science, and you don't, all possibilities have not been exhausted, Therefore it is misnamed. Therefore you have not falisified the existence of God. In fact that theology can only be falsified in the minds of spiritually ignorant men.



It is not universally accepted and their is no way science, math or statistics can prove or disprove the existence of God.



I may be off a few years but I have b een at it a long time.



The next question, has it ever been verified?

So provide something to prove your point rather than simple incredulity


Provide one discipline i mentioned that does not accept proof by exhaustion as valid

Yes, so have i, and quite probably in a far more technical way than you could imagine, so your point is ?

It has never been proven wrong therefore every single usage (and there are millions in the modern world) verifies it.

 

[omega2xx]

So provide something to prove your point rather than simple incredulity

If you can'; show me you have all the evidence you need, and you can't. you have not exhausted all possibilities, That is a no brainer.

Provide one discipline i mentioned that does not accept proof by exhaustion as valid[

Acceptance does not equal truth.

Yes, so have i, and quite probably in a far more technical way than you could imagine, so your point is ?

It has never been proven wrong therefore every single usage (and there are millions in the modern world) verifies it.

I have proved it wrong. Unless you have all the information available, and you don't, you have not exhausted the evidence. Do you not know what "exhausted" means?

 

[arthra]

do you feel god exists? why do u feel that god exists?
or do u feel that god does not exist? why do u feel that god does not exist?

For me there are of course several layers I can respond to your inquiry... The first relates to my sense of being.. Do I exist? and of course people who are unaware of me would say noooo...They don't know me.. but of course I have a consciousness that's been with me now for ohh seventy some years ... and there are experiences and memories stored so I feel I exist even though there are those who would doubt this... Now those who have had experiences with me will testify that I exist. The same could be said on a much grander scale for the Supreme Being God Almighty! There are records of people who have had encounters with the Supreme Being.. some of these records are admittedly shadowy just like the distant memories of my childhood but as we've matured the evidence and recollections are there... moreover the teachings of Prophets and those Who we would call Manifestations testify to the existence of God and the our very lives can testify to His existence.

 

[ChristineM]

If you can'; show me you have all the evidence you need, and you can't. you have not exhausted all possibilities, That is a no brainer.



Acceptance does not equal truth.

Yes, so have i, and quite probably in a far more technical way than you could imagine, so your point is ?



I have proved it wrong. Unless you have all the information available, and you don't, you have not exhausted the evidence. Do you not know what "exhausted" means?

I have already provided the proof, not my problem you have difficulty comprehending it so make up irrelevant straw men to justify your faith.

And still you provide nothing to counter it.

Fact is more truthful than faith.

You have proved nothing wrong, you have provided personal opinion based on faith alone.