logician
Well-Known Member
There never was "nothing".
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God's Magic
- Thread starter Arkwort
- Start date
There never was "nothing".
So glad to see that you agree logician. the singularity which has evolved the intellect that is in the world today and will continue to evolve into all eternity, was never nothing and is at all time ONE: the compilation of all that is.
Mr Cheese
Well-Known Member
the "atoms" that make a cup were always there...
energy cannot be created or destroyed.... BASIC SCIENCE
thus yes, in a sense, we did indeed name it a cup. :sarcastic
Mr Cheese
Well-Known Member
Nothing can exist in isolation or there never was nothing
there is always somethign with something
basic science again
oh and (cough cough) mysticism, which came first by at least 2000 (probably more) years
Arkwort
Eternal Dreamer
Do you think God is capable of devising a way of bringing himself/herself into existence from whatever existed originally?
Arkwort
Mr Cheese
Well-Known Member
Do you think God is capable of devising a way of bringing himself/herself into existence from whatever existed originally?
Arkwort
This implies that God is seperate some how.
Question
Where does God end?
Arkwort
Eternal Dreamer
Question
Do you think there was a beginning to everything?
Do you think God had a beginning?
Maybe there was no beginning!
Maybe God never began.
Maybe God always existed!
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Mr Cheese
Well-Known Member
Mr Cheese
Well-Known Member
Mr Cheese,
Do you think the very fact that something exists suggests that God exists?
Arkwort
yes all is God
even Dick Cheney and Beetle dung is God...
He who sees himself only on the outside,
not within, becomes small himself and makes others small.
Mani
Actually, the ground of everything is within me and it is God, and its within everybody too. And theres one ground for everybody, and this ground in the Divine Mercy. . . . The people of the unveiling, that is to say the Sufis, ask the Mercy of God to subsist in them. These are the ones who ask in the Name of God and He shows Mercy upon them only by making the Mercy subsist in them. This is a totally different outlook. It is the outlook whereby the Mercy of God is not arranged on the outside in events for me-in good and bad events-but it is subsisting in me all the time. Therefore what happens is that if the Mercy of God is subsisting in me-and that goes to say if I am united with the will of God- . . . if I am completely united with the will of God in love, it doesnt matter what happens outside, because everything that is going on outside that makes any sense is grounded in the same ground in which I am grounded. The opposition between me and everything else ceases, and what remains in terms of opposition is purely acci­dental and it doesnt matter. And this is . . . a basic perspective in all . . . the highest religions. You ought to get down to this, you get down to it in Christianity, you get down to it in Buddhism, you get down to it in Hinduism, and so forth. It is arriving at a unity in which the superficial differences dont matter. It doesnt, mean that theyre not real, it doesnt mean that theyre not there. They still subsist .
Thomas Merton
Arkwort
Eternal Dreamer
Mr Cheese,
Do you think the very fact that something exists suggests that God exists, and that there was no beginning?
Arkwort
Even if something popped into existence of 'its own accord' like matter and anti-matter, or perhaps something more profound like masses and masses of energy (which gave rise to the Big Bang), does this still suggest that God exists, and that there was no beginning?
Arkwort
Arkwort
Eternal Dreamer
Even if something popped into existence of 'its own accord' like matter and anti-matter, or perhaps something more profound like masses and masses of energy (which gave rise to the Big Bang), does this still suggest that God exists, and that there was no beginning?
Arkwort
It's a bit like saying that even though life evolved without the aid of God, does this still suggest that God exists? But it takes the idea to a new level....a universal level.
God could have set the system up that things popped into existence of their own accord, or evolved of their own accord. The very fact that there's anything happening could suggest that God exists, and that he had no beginning.
This would suggest that we might never 'know' if God exists.
Also we might wonder why God wants to stay out of the picture.
Or would it suggest that God doesn't exist?
Arkwort
Alceste
Vagabond
And while we're at it, is the Loch Ness Monster is just one very old monster, or a small population of monsters with short life spans?
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Only Sasquatch knows for sure.
Arkwort
Eternal Dreamer
Do you think God is capable of devising a way of bringing himself/herself into existence from nothing?
AND
Do you think God is capable of devising a way of bringing himself/herself into existence from whatever existed originally?
Arkwort
This may not be so daft as it sounds.
Lets say future scientists develop an artificial being and they keep on adding more capabilities, until the being is mistakable for God.
Then they give it a time travel capability.
The being goes back in time and initiates the Big Bang!
Hence in a round about way The being has devised a way of bringing itself into existence.
Afterall it was Arthur C Clarke who said "Sufficiently Advanced Technology is indistinguishable from Magic".
Arkwort :bow:
Guitar's Cry
Disciple of Pan
It's the only way. We do it every morning when we wake up.
Arkwort
Eternal Dreamer
Like Q in star trek......one minute he's there, the next he's gone. Only to reappear at the required moment.
I bet God could do that!
Arkwort
ManTimeForgot
Temporally Challenged
Nothing, and I repeat only nothing, which is imperfect can come into being from nothing. From nothing comes nothing and only nothing because nothing is the absence of all traits, and as such the only thing that nothing can "pass on" or "have copied from it" is more nothing.
Complete perfection can do whatever it wants to, assuming that you read "want" as having any kind of meaningful association with Ultimate Reality. Immunity to contradiction and violating tautology are two things that only Supreme Reality can do.
So the answer to the question of: "Can God create itself from nothing?" Is yes, no, and does, did, done it all the time.
Does any of that have any meaningful association with existence as we know it? Not even remotely close. Will it ever have meaningful association? Nope.
MTF
Complete perfection can do whatever it wants to, assuming that you read "want" as having any kind of meaningful association with Ultimate Reality. Immunity to contradiction and violating tautology are two things that only Supreme Reality can do.
So the answer to the question of: "Can God create itself from nothing?" Is yes, no, and does, did, done it all the time.
Does any of that have any meaningful association with existence as we know it? Not even remotely close. Will it ever have meaningful association? Nope.
MTF