Gravity and the Expanding Universe

[ChristineM]

Thanks for bringing up those verses!

The entirety of Proverbs deals with the knowledge that comes from respecting God.

Prov 1:7,

The fear of the LORD [is] the beginning of knowledge: [but] fools despise wisdom and instruction.
​

Before getting upset by the words "fear of the Lord," (specifically the word "fear") you may want to check the every usage of that word to see how God uses them instead of interjecting your own ideas. Suffice it to say, it means to reverence or respect.

• verb fear regard with feelings of respect and reverence; consider hallowed or exalted or be in awe of "Fear God as your father","We venerate genius"

fear - definition, etymology and usage, examples and related words​

In any case putting Prob 1:7 together with Proverbs 15:14, we can see that a lack of respect and awe for God is folly.

I might also point out that the lack of knowledge mentioned in Hosea 4:6 is a lack of knowledge of God. Read the context, namely verse 1.

Hos 4:1,

Hear the word of the LORD, ye children of Israel: for the LORD hath a controversy with the inhabitants of the land, because [there is] no truth, nor mercy, nor knowledge of God in the land.
​

I think taking things out of context is a huge factor in people's misunderstanding. Most don't do that with profane literature, but for some reason all normal reading skills seem to vanish when it comes to the scriptures. Go figure.

I read the bible as written, not interpreted to suite my ego

 

[ChristineM]

I used to have your viewpoint, but I used my intelligence to change according to new evidence. You don't know that you may jump on the Christian bandwagon some time in the future. Don't worry, if you do, it's not as bad as you may think now.

What new evidence, please be specific with citations.

Ive been on the Christian bandwagon and jumped off because yes, it was very bad and from what i see on there pages and elsewhere, nothing has changed. But hey, it's religion, i don't expect it to change. Only to dis progress because its seen as a threat

 

[rrobs]

I think they will think "good start and look at where it has lead, look at the benefits reaped by humanity from those early seeds"

I'll bet that's what the ancient Babylonians thought when talking about their planetary gods.

 

[rrobs]

I read the bible as written, not interpreted to suite my ego

Where was I off with Proverbs? Specifics, if you don't mind.

 

[Subduction Zone]

That is perhaps true as far as you understand Genesis, but your understanding is not the standard of truth.

If you want to massively reinterpret it. We know that the events of Genesis did not occur. There never were only two people. There was no flood of Noah. If you want to call them morality tales they still "work". What is your interpretation of the myths?

Could be a misunderstanding on my part. Infallible is perhaps a bit strong. How about, "enamored by science?"

How about a more than well merited respect for science?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Which books about science in the Bible have you read? Any examples of what they may have said is false?

There was no Garden of Eden, at no time were there ever only two people. There was no flood of Noah. That story fails on many levels. The Exodus as portrayed in the Bible did not occur either. That is a good start.

 

[rrobs]

What new evidence, please be specific with citations.

Genesis 1:1 to Revelation 22:21. Those are things I was ignorant of until I saw them.

Ive been on the Christian bandwagon and jumped off because yes, it was very bad and from what i see on there pages and elsewhere, nothing has changed. But hey, it's religion, i don't expect it to change. Only to dis progress because its seen as a threat

Glad to hear you were a Christian. Actually it would be better stated that you are a Christian.

1Pet 1:23,

Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
​

The first seed came from your mom and dad. It is corruptible, hence you will die. The new birth, on the other hand is incorruptible, hence you have everlasting life in the new earth to come. Notice that the word "incorruptible" is not followed by the word "seed" as "corruptible" is in the first part. That is a legitimate and precise usage of a figure of speech, namely an ellipsis. As you probably know, figures of speech are used to emphasize. In other words, God wants to emphasize your everlasting life. What's so bad about that?

 

[rrobs]

There was no Garden of Eden, at no time were there ever only two people. There was no flood of Noah.

Sounds like you were there to witness the beginning. Surely, that can't be what you are saying, so how do you know?

 

[ChristineM]

Genesis 1:1 to Revelation 22:21. Those are things I was ignorant of until I saw them

They are not evidence but stories in the bible

Glad to hear you were a Christian. Actually it would be better stated that you are a Christian.

No, of course christianity wont release my name from their records, so they can keep their numbers up. But in no way could i be considered christian. Given the pain, mayhem and death i have seen christians administer i would consider it an insult to be considered one. You don't want to insult me do you?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Power is energy expended over time. A thought i have had on the subject is. If your god is infinite power (energy over time) whence came the matter such as you and i.
Energy
See the first law of thermodynamics
Law of conservation of energy - Energy Education
And Einsteins mass energy equivalence e=mc2

Thank you for your ^above ^ posting.
Because of God's ' energy ' E-MC2 is why God as Creator has the Great Power and the Mighty Strength to create the visible material realm of creation.
Since we are created from His dynamic energy then God has the right to exercise regulation over His creation (us). -Isaiah 45:18; Isaiah 45:12
Having control in a loving way teaching us how to benefit oneself.

 

[ChristineM]

Thank you for your ^above ^ posting.
Because of God's ' energy ' E-MC2 is why God as Creator has the Great Power and the Mighty Strength to create the visible material realm of creation.
Since we are created from His dynamic energy then God has the right to exercise regulation over His creation (us). -Isaiah 45:18; Isaiah 45:12
Having control in a loving way teaching us how to benefit oneself.

You don't understand the 1st law of thermodynamics at all do you?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

No, of course christianity wont release my name from their records, so they can keep their numbers up. But in no way could i be considered christian. Given the pain, mayhem and death i have seen christians administer i would consider it an insult to be considered one. You don't want to insult me do you?

Or, what you say members of 'Christendom' ( so-called Christians ) administer...... Remember what Jesus said about those fake 'weed/tares' Christians.
And that Jesus' forewarned us that MANY would come ' in his name' but prove false - Matthew 7:21-23.
Even if 'Christendom' won't release names..... we find God can remove names from His Book of Life - Exodus 32:33; Revelation 3:5; Revelation 20:15

(Side note: when I wrote my former religion to remove my name (just my name) from their records, well they did, but also removed the whole family records including the cemetery deed. Thankfully I had the 1913 deed and the undertaker could Not understand why there was No family record and No record of the cemetery deed. He reassured me that his then made deed copy would go on file at the funeral home )

 

[URAVIP2ME]

You don't understand the 1st law of thermodynamics at all do you?

Energy can't be created from nothing, so when a Baptist told me that God created the universe from nothing I said that is Not what the Bible teaches.
God supplied His Power and Strength to create the visible material realm of existence. - Isaiah 40:26

 

[ChristineM]

Energy can't be created from nothing, so when a Baptist told me that God created the universe from nothing I said that is Not what the Bible teaches.
God supplied His Power and Strength to create the visible material realm of existence. - Isaiah 40:26

Actually void is nothing

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Actually void is nothing

in the Hebrew Bible at Genesis 1:1 uses the word ' empty ' when Earth was empty ( empty or void of inhabitable life on Earth at that beginning stage )
P.S. oops, should read Genesis 1:1-2.

 

[ChristineM]

empty or void of inhabitable life on Earth at that beginning stage

Where does the bible say this

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Where does the bible say this

Try Genesis 1:2

 

[ChristineM]

Try Genesis 1:2

What about 1:1

 

[URAVIP2ME]

In Genesis 1, the 4th day of creation, god created the sun, moon and stars...






...there are so many things wrong with this depiction.

For one, the “dome” (NRSV translation), “expanse” (NASB), “vault” (NIV) or firmament (KJV) was created on the 2nd day, which is supposedly is the “sky”:



But the reality is that the sun, moon and stars are not located within the limitations of this dome/vault/expanse/firmament. This same dome or vault is where birds created on the 5th day can fly:



Birds and sun in the same dome?

How is that in any way possible?

Genesis 1:20 also say that the lights mark the day (between light and darkness, between day and night), but also marked the year, and the seasons.

But the reality is that days, seasons and years, are controlled by the motion of the sun (eg motion of the sun according to the observer’s view of the sky), but on the Earth’s own motions, such as the rotation of the Earth on its axis that tilt about, and on the orbit of the Earth around the Sun, and its distances to the sun (radius) that are based on elliptical orbit.

Since the orbit is elliptical, the radius varied, with the longest radius being aphelion, the shortest being perihelion. The difference between aphelion and perihelion is about 5 million km.

The authors of the OT & NT wouldn’t know all this, because the Hebrew and Christian authors still believed in the Babylonian astronomy that based on the geocentric motion (the sun moving across the sky, while the Earth remained stationary and fixed.)

And like Polymath257 said, the Earth is the one in motion, eg rotating on its axis and orbiting around the Sun; the Earth don’t just hang there, as you cited in Job 26:7, stationary and in fixed position.



That’s not just inaccurate, it is wrong.

And in Joshua 10, during the battle against the Amorites, God stopped the sun and moon, long enough for the Israelite army to completely defeat the Amorites. After that (after their victory) the sun continue it course through the sky.



That’s another indication that the authors of Joshua believed in geocentric motion of the sun across the sky, instead of Earth orbiting around the Sun (heliocentric motion).

All of the biblical claims about the Earth and Sun are wrong (eg in Genesis, Joshua, Job, Psalms, etc), based on outdated geocentric model that began with Bronze Age Babylonian astronomy (as well as repeated in the Egyptian astronomy).

As I stated in earlier post of mine, heliocentric model was first proposed by Hellenistic astronomer, Aristarchus of Samos, who not only described a spherical Earth, but also about the Earth orbiting the Sun - the heliocentric model.

But the heliocentric model was unpopular for 1-and-a-half thousand of years, before it had being revived by Nicolaus Copernicus (mid-16th century), discovered by Galileo, revised the planetary orbits being elliptical by Johannes Kepler (Copernicus’ orbits were circular), and the forces governing the orbital motion identified as gravity by Isaac Newton.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Please notice Genesis 1:16 because there we find the word MADE and Not the word: CREATE.

Day One light was CREATED. See Genesis 1:3, then on Day Four God MADE the 'already created' light do something.
In other words He 'made' the 'created' light to rule; rule over day and night - Genesis 1:18

Kind of like an adult can procreate a child then have the existing child be MADE to sit in a chair, MADE to go to school, etc.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

What about 1:1

Gods' spirit is good (Psalms 143:10) and it was God who created, God is Creator -Revelation 4:11.