Hands off Cain

[Estro Felino]

The thread title is taken from a NGO, Hands off Cain which has been fighting for the abolition of death penalty.
Especially because in certain parts of the world, many innocent people are executed for reasons we Westerners disapprove of. Adultery, apostasy, homosexuality, etc.
But speaking of the West, the US have been doing a great job trying to limit the cases where death penalty is applied.

I am curious about your opinions.

 

[Spirit of Light]

The thread title is taken from a NGO, Hands off Cain which has been fighting for the abolition of death penalty.
Especially because in certain parts of the world, many innocent people are executed for reasons we Westerners disapprove of. Adultery, apostasy, homosexuality, etc.
But speaking of the West, the US have been doing a great job trying to limit the cases where death penalty is applied.

I am curious about your opinions.

I am fully against Capital punishment

 

[Estro Felino]

Even in the gravest forms of crime (serial killers, etc...), I think that our deep sense of justice would want these criminals not to have the privilege of living.

But, as the Enlightenment philosopher Beccaria said, executing a person is equivalent to what the culprit did.
And the State is supposed to make the Society understand that they are different than the culprit, who violated the most sacred of rights. The Right to Life. Of someone else.


For example, Nikolas Cruz' case interests me particularly.
It is an atrocious suffering thinking all those people brutally murdered.
But at the same time...I think this person is a victim of his own unhealthy psyche and deserves, at least to be cured to understand what he did.

 

[Heyo]

The thread title is taken from a NGO, Hands off Cain which has been fighting for the abolition of death penalty.
Especially because in certain parts of the world, many innocent people are executed for reasons we Westerners disapprove of. Adultery, apostasy, homosexuality, etc.
But speaking of the West, the US have been doing a great job trying to limit the cases where death penalty is applied.

I am curious about your opinions.

Fortunately, all civilized countries have abolished capital punishment. We should cautiously bring civilization to the rest. But not too fast or there might be a backlash.

 

[Jedster]

Fortunately, all civilized countries have abolished capital punishment. We should cautiously bring civilization to the rest. But not too fast or there might be a backlash.

Re: Thread title @Estro Felino
I saw film about Cain's fate. He was sentenced to never die and spent years begging for it to end as he lived lifetime after lifetime.

 

[Estro Felino]

In 2003, two members of the NGO Hands off Cain wrote and sung a song, which is considered the symbol of this fight. Of this project.
It is a sort of dialogue between the executioner and the executed person, a woman.

Spoiler: Translation

Executioner: I am the man who you didn't want me to be, I am worse than you could ever fear.
Tomorrow morning I will guide you beyond your own thoughts.
Everything's ready, so I can't fail. I have examined everything in great detail. When you will look into my eyes, I won't lower the gaze.
Executed woman: The world is not here...and I don't care about myself any more. I have been waiting too long in jail for the Heavens to open and for a hand and a gesture of Mercy to come, on us. For a hand and an act of Mercy.
Ex.: The hallway is narrower and narrower, it is the last time you will see it. That's my life, that's my job, one follows their own inclination and learns.
But I will never forget the first executed man. I used to get drunk, not to apologize to him.
He didn't die easy, it was never ending, but one gets used to anything with time.
Ex. woman: The world is not here, and my thought has flown away, beyond these bars to my home, over which the same sky shines, that someday will have a signature and a gesture of Mercy. An hand and an act of Mercy
Ex.: Everything is over, it went perfectly. Nowadays we almost never fail. Check out one more time, so I can get home. Because I too have my own family.
Ex. woman: The world is not here. But my soul has already gone and is already flying over my house where the same sky shines that tomorrow will have a cross and an gesture of Mercy.
I am here and my soul is not a jail number any more. It is a white light who has flown to the Stars and an act of Mercy.
Beyond the Heavens, where there is Mercy.

 

[Altfish]

It is barbaric, it is just revenge.
All forward thinking countries have abolished it.

Just remember the police are corrupt and under pressure to get results - this leads to false convictions.
Look at the IRA cases in the UK; if the death penalty still existed there would be a lot of martyrs out there.
There are numerous cases of people the UK has hung that they should not have been - just look up Derek Bentley

 

[Jedster]

It is barbaric, it is just revenge.
All forward thinking countries have abolished it.

Just remember the police are corrupt and under pressure to get results - this leads to false convictions.
Look at the IRA cases in the UK; if the death penalty still existed there would be a lot of martyrs out there.
There are numerous cases of people the UK has hung that they should not have been - just look up Denis Bentley

I think you meant Derek Bentley.
BBC News | UK | Bentley family gets compensation

 

[Estro Felino]

Fortunately, all civilized countries have abolished capital punishment. We should cautiously bring civilization to the rest. But not too fast or there might be a backlash.

Very wisely said.

 

[Estro Felino]

Very useful article.

Parkland school shooting: Nikolas Cruz death penalty case remains in limbo

 

[Estro Felino]

It is barbaric, it is just revenge.
All forward thinking countries have abolished it.

Just remember the police are corrupt and under pressure to get results - this leads to false convictions.
Look at the IRA cases in the UK; if the death penalty still existed there would be a lot of martyrs out there.
There are numerous cases of people the UK has hung that they should not have been - just look up Denis Bentley

You know....I have family in Florida.
Once I brought up Nikolas Cruz and they were upset. They were surely upset with me, since I was saying I didn't want him to be executed.

 

[Eddi]

I think that for aggravated murder (i.e. murder in cold blood, being a serial killer, murdering out of hate, murdering a police officer) the death penalty should certainly be an option - but not for all cases of murder:

Only in cases of aggravated murder

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I have always been against capital punishment. It was legal in Canada, when I was younger, but Canada has been fully abolitionist since Dec 10, 1998, when all remaining references to the death penalty were removed from the National Defence Act – the only section of law that since 1976 still provided for execution under the law. Despite that, that last executions in Canada were made under the Criminal Code, in 1962 when Ronald Turpin and Arthur Lucas were both hanged at Toronto’s Don Jail. I was in my first year of highschool, at a private school run by Quakers, and I admit I absorbed quite a few of my present values in that institution.

The last time Canada's military executed anyone was Harold Pringle, shot in Italy in 1945, 3 years before I was born.

 

[Estro Felino]

I think that for aggravated murder (i.e. murder in cold blood, being a serial killer, murdering out of hate, murdering a police officer) the death penalty should certainly be an option - but not for all cases of murder:

Only in cases of aggravated murder

Yes...I do understand that. I can relate.

There are indescribable cases...Ted Bundy for example. Which make reflect.

 

[Heyo]

Yes...I do understand that. I can relate.

There are indescribable cases...Ted Bundy for example. Which make reflect.

I don't want to kill another human, I don't want that burden put on me and I don't want that burden put on anybody else in my name.

 

[stvdv]

many innocent people are executed for reasons we Westerners disapprove of. Adultery, apostasy, homosexuality, etc.

But speaking of the West, the US have been doing a great job trying to limit the cases where death penalty is applied.

The West has less death penalty I assume from above. And did death penalty work to get the numbers of adultery etc. down over there?

 

[Estro Felino]

I don't want to kill another human, I don't want that burden put on me and I don't want that burden put on anybody else in my name.

Yes ...indeed...
I firmly believe in the penal science principles of my country.
But I want people to express freely their own opinion, and to debate about it. As @Eddi did.

 

[stvdv]

I am curious about your opinions.

Do you agree with Capital Punishment?

In some cases:
1) IF there is a person who is going to nuke the world (known for a fact) unless killed, then I have no problem with him being killed
2) ....

 

[Estro Felino]

Do you agree with Capital Punishment?

In some cases:
1) IF there is a person who is going to nuke the world (known for a fact), unless killed, then I have no problem with him being killed
2) ....

Ok. Do you think Nikolas Cruz should be put into that box?

 

[Altfish]

I think you meant Derek Bentley.
BBC News | UK | Bentley family gets compensation

Indeed I did. Post edited